Pentium 4 sales seen falling way short -5/14
I thought the price drop would help them out, but I guess not yet at least.
I thought the price drop would help them out, but I guess not yet at least.
Pentium 4 sales seen falling way short - ouch....
- Thread starter Adul
- Start date
I guess that's one thing that can happen when they announce that they are going to change the socket config in the near future.
Add to that some expensive memory in a tight pc market and you have the makings of a sad story.
Intel screwed up really big time with RamPus.
Add to that some expensive memory in a tight pc market and you have the makings of a sad story.
Intel screwed up really big time with RamPus.
You could drop the prices of every processor AMD or Intel tomorrow
by HALF and you would still not create substantial new demand
at the consumer level. Most people now have PCs with 400Mhz or
faster processors, and most people simply do not run ANY
apps that really require more processing power.
In the enterprise division, faster and cheaper processors will
lead to upgrades. But the consumer division is what drives the
commodity numbers, and the killer app that pushes people to
another cpu upgrade simply hasn't appeared.
Kwad
by HALF and you would still not create substantial new demand
at the consumer level. Most people now have PCs with 400Mhz or
faster processors, and most people simply do not run ANY
apps that really require more processing power.
In the enterprise division, faster and cheaper processors will
lead to upgrades. But the consumer division is what drives the
commodity numbers, and the killer app that pushes people to
another cpu upgrade simply hasn't appeared.
Kwad
That's good. If a company shells out crap, they don't deserve sales.
Too Expensive, Underperforming, No upgrade path, and Rambus - Just to sum up what I mean when I call it crap.
Too Expensive, Underperforming, No upgrade path, and Rambus - Just to sum up what I mean when I call it crap.
Rectalfier:
That's good. If a company shells out crap, they don't deserve sales.
Too Expensive, Underperforming, No upgrade path, and Rambus - Just to sum up what I mean when I call it crap.
The P4 is not underperforming. In the near future, when more applications are using SSE2, you will see some perfomance gains. I'm not an Intel Zealot or something, but guys like you made that some really valuable members left the boards, and I'm just sick of this all-time Intel-bashing. I have at home 3 AMD-powered computers (because they are faster and cheaper
), so don't call me an Intel-Zealot.
That's good. If a company shells out crap, they don't deserve sales.
Too Expensive, Underperforming, No upgrade path, and Rambus - Just to sum up what I mean when I call it crap.
The P4 is not underperforming. In the near future, when more applications are using SSE2, you will see some perfomance gains. I'm not an Intel Zealot or something, but guys like you made that some really valuable members left the boards, and I'm just sick of this all-time Intel-bashing. I have at home 3 AMD-powered computers (because they are faster and cheaper
), so don't call me an Intel-Zealot.I wouldnt consider PIV to be crap*, IMHO they just did a stupid move by releasing it so early. I think they should have waited until the socket change - or if possible make the socket change earlier
- and make it available then with the lower price.Rambust really fscked things up for Intel, cant argue about that
* ..but I do agree with Rectalfier's "sum up" of it's umm... 'properties'
The sales should pickup soon because of Win2K SP2 and XP will be coming out. My company is still on NT 4.0, but I heard that they'll begin the upgrade of all the PC's when XP comes out. I don't know which they'll choose though... AMD or Intel.
flockster,
the situation is one which Intel couldn't sell as many P4 chips as expected. Therefore, profit is small and price cuts due to competition against AMD makes even the profit smaller. This is hurting Intel, which is why it's seen as a bad news.
I really hope I didn't play a part in PM's departure. He was a valuable member of these boards, and I miss his input. I am stating my opinion, as you are stating yours. I do not have the intention of trolling.
You are correct in saying that the P4 will be better in the future, but also the P4 will be 3ghz by the time SSE2 is used, making any gains on a 1.5Ghz minimal. Considering the P4 is selling so poorly, I wonder what software company would put the extra time and money into optimizing their code for a product that accounts for 1-2 percent of the total CPU market.
I did not cause the P4 to have poor sales, the P4 did. It is not a good product "currently", I am just stating reasons why it is not a good product "currently". I will buy from any company that offers me the best performance for the best price. I bought a K6-2 a long time ago because I thought 3dnow would make it perform. To my horror, it was more like 3dlater, or 3dnever. I will not buy a product, so that I can hope that it's performance will improve, especially an expensive one like the P4.
This is my opinion straight up. I welcome any discussion of what I have said.
You are correct in saying that the P4 will be better in the future, but also the P4 will be 3ghz by the time SSE2 is used, making any gains on a 1.5Ghz minimal. Considering the P4 is selling so poorly, I wonder what software company would put the extra time and money into optimizing their code for a product that accounts for 1-2 percent of the total CPU market.
I did not cause the P4 to have poor sales, the P4 did. It is not a good product "currently", I am just stating reasons why it is not a good product "currently". I will buy from any company that offers me the best performance for the best price. I bought a K6-2 a long time ago because I thought 3dnow would make it perform. To my horror, it was more like 3dlater, or 3dnever. I will not buy a product, so that I can hope that it's performance will improve, especially an expensive one like the P4.
This is my opinion straight up. I welcome any discussion of what I have said.
<< That's good. If a company shells out crap, they don't deserve sales.
Too Expensive, Underperforming, No upgrade path, and Rambus - Just to sum up what I mean when I call it crap. >>
what we are saying is that if they dont sell, and say they back out of making cpus...then there is no competition.
NO matter how much you hate a company, they need to be there...or else prices wouldnt be as nice as we have seen them.
Intel has always made the best CPU's. When the Athlon was released, Intel promptly released the coppermine, and despite the shortages, it was a kick ass chip. With the P4, I was very disapointed with them. I used to choose AMD because it performed the same for a better price. Now, I am some what forced to buy AMD because Intel does not have a product that meets my needs, this upsets me. I hope the 0.13 P4 will change my thinking. I am saying that bad sales are a good thing because I think Intel will learn a good lesson from this experience.
P.S. I don't hate Intel, although it may seem like that at times. Think of me as a nagging parent, that wants to see results.
P.S. I don't hate Intel, although it may seem like that at times. Think of me as a nagging parent, that wants to see results.
Rectalfier:
I didn't wanted to attack you, but in the first moment, it sounded for me like trolling. I'm glad that you back up your statment, cuz there are enough kiddies who don't. I also think the P4 is _at the moment_ not worth the money, but maybe in the near future, who knows.
So long,
Ndee
I didn't wanted to attack you, but in the first moment, it sounded for me like trolling. I'm glad that you back up your statment, cuz there are enough kiddies who don't. I also think the P4 is _at the moment_ not worth the money, but maybe in the near future, who knows.
So long,
Ndee
there's a nice phrase called "total cost of ownership" applied to cars
P4 can't quite compete with the low prices of Athlons now. P4 needs special cases, RIMMs, more expensive motherboards. the debate of whether P4 is even any good or not can't have helped
P4 can't quite compete with the low prices of Athlons now. P4 needs special cases, RIMMs, more expensive motherboards. the debate of whether P4 is even any good or not can't have helped
Ok let me read that again...
<< Intel has always made the best CPU's >>
and then you went on to say:
<< used to choose AMD because it performed the same for a better price. Now, I am some what forced to buy AMD because Intel does not have a product that meets my needs, this upsets me. >>
So, shouldn't you edit your first comment to say "Intel used to always make the best CPU's but they were not the cheapest, but now they are neither the cheapest nor the best..."
Not nitpicking, but AMD has IMO had a better performing chip, price disregarded, for a while now.
<< Intel has always made the best CPU's >>
and then you went on to say:
<< used to choose AMD because it performed the same for a better price. Now, I am some what forced to buy AMD because Intel does not have a product that meets my needs, this upsets me. >>
So, shouldn't you edit your first comment to say "Intel used to always make the best CPU's but they were not the cheapest, but now they are neither the cheapest nor the best..."
Not nitpicking, but AMD has IMO had a better performing chip, price disregarded, for a while now.
its the economys fualt, in the big internet craze of the last few years the majority of the US bought computers, many of them for the first time, Compaq, Gateway, Dell, and a hundred others flooded the market and now they cant seem to find new buyers, what else do you expect.
Does anyone have numbers of people who own computers and then the number/% of those who are mainly using it for gaming?
I would think the gamers represent 5% or less of the market and WE are the ones who are doing most of the upgrading nowadays. Grandma doesn't need to upgrade her Athlon 500, neither does uncle bill and aunt june need anything better than their 450 to send me emails, but to the 5% who do upgrade once or twice a year, we're not going to create the sales they would like to see.
It's getting to the point now where hardware is so damn fast and cheap that the only people needing new things are gamers to take advantage of the newest and greatest. Hello market slowdown.
I would think the gamers represent 5% or less of the market and WE are the ones who are doing most of the upgrading nowadays. Grandma doesn't need to upgrade her Athlon 500, neither does uncle bill and aunt june need anything better than their 450 to send me emails, but to the 5% who do upgrade once or twice a year, we're not going to create the sales they would like to see.
It's getting to the point now where hardware is so damn fast and cheap that the only people needing new things are gamers to take advantage of the newest and greatest. Hello market slowdown.
why would you buy a cpu that's about to be replaced? i'm pretty sure the upcoming northwood will be fast...that's why all current p4s won't be compatible.
Shudder, I think you hit the nail on the head...
I have talked to a few people I built some systems for and they say they aren't having any problems running the appz they normally run so they are less inclined to spend more money to upgrade right now...they generally say once they can't do what they need they will upgrade. However I do see the internet as an area that may push them t upgrade with all the streaming audio and video and P4 can capitalize on these. Just a little early to the party perhaps!
AMD is doing well be they are geared more for the gamers market and quick upgradability of gamers. They also produce units in the fractions of Intels so the market can absorb that. Hell AMD can't make them fast enough according to reports.
Sidenote: Nice to see AMD stock higher price then INtel...Seems like they usually move in synch...Intel reports bad first quarter Intel falls and drags AMD down...WTF. Amd announces increased first quarter profits and market share and they still don't pass Intel. I know people look at Intel as the litmus test for the cpu industry and rightfully so with the 70 percent market share so bad news to Intel is bad news to the cpu industry period. Just nice to see AMD get rewarded by their strong numbers.
I have talked to a few people I built some systems for and they say they aren't having any problems running the appz they normally run so they are less inclined to spend more money to upgrade right now...they generally say once they can't do what they need they will upgrade. However I do see the internet as an area that may push them t upgrade with all the streaming audio and video and P4 can capitalize on these. Just a little early to the party perhaps!
AMD is doing well be they are geared more for the gamers market and quick upgradability of gamers. They also produce units in the fractions of Intels so the market can absorb that. Hell AMD can't make them fast enough according to reports.
Sidenote: Nice to see AMD stock higher price then INtel...Seems like they usually move in synch...Intel reports bad first quarter Intel falls and drags AMD down...WTF. Amd announces increased first quarter profits and market share and they still don't pass Intel. I know people look at Intel as the litmus test for the cpu industry and rightfully so with the 70 percent market share so bad news to Intel is bad news to the cpu industry period. Just nice to see AMD get rewarded by their strong numbers.
I just wonder how good the P4 will be for streaming audio and video. Majority of the households don't have broadband so whatever you download off a 56K is gonna look like crap. And how much of us rely on streaming audio and video anyways? The advantage with SSE2 is going to be a moot point since future Athlon will have that. Intel, thread carefully!
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