PCI vs. AGP... Is there that much difference?

[Desciple]

I'm getting ready to plunk down hard-earned cash for a new video card. My current system only supports PCI, but I am going to upgrade to AGP(4X) board (probably Asus P3V4X). If I get my new video card first, so I can use it while building my new system, I'll need to get a PCI card. Does the performance gained by going AGP versus PCI justify waiting until my new system is built to get the video card? Or are they really pretty much the same, so I might as well get the new video card NOW and go PCI? I want shooter games (Quake3, Unreal, etc.) to rock on my new system, but am unclear as to what exactly I am gaining by going AGP. Any one out there have good hard evidence to support either AGP or PCI?
Thanks to all,
Desciple

P.S. Sorry fot posting twice! Newbies, where would we be without 'em?

 

[glen]

The textures will load from your HD faster to your game card, but that won't affect game performance unless the card is having to access your HD for more textures, which almost nevers happens..and if it did, expect to fall to 1 fps.

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

Eathier would do fine the question is are you going to coverclock the crap out of you chip?? the problem with agp is that it dont like hight bus speeds it runs a 66mhz so when you overclock you change that and you need to change the multiplier to bring the agp bus speed back down around 66 if the motherboard will let you do it..i dont know much about the board you want to get i know the abit has 2 settings in the bios for overclocking i have agp and i run at 133mhz and i lose the agp around 145mhz with pc100 ram.. i hope i helped you alittle

 

[Deeko]

It depends on what card you get. The Voodoo5 doesn't show much of a drop going from AGP to PCI. But the GeForce does. I'm not sure about Radeon, actually.

 

[MustangSVT]

PCI doesnt support T&L which is Videocard taking load off of cpu on drawing polygons. So, generally it'll show much more detailed and faster frame rates then non T&L supported applications. So far there isnt much T&L supported software, but that seems to be the important feature to have in future.

Also, the most powerful PCI card u can get is probably Geforce MX PCI, however that has higher price then AGP card (of MX) and with some searchin, u'll find Geforce GTS for same price as PCI MX. Too bad 3DFX closed, they had quite strong PCI cards as such as V5.

So, basically unless u found a good price on V5 PCI, i suggest get the MB upgrade first then go AGP route.

 

[Desciple]

Thanks all for your advice. I'm heading for PriceWatch today!
Cheers,
Desciple

 

[Deeko]

MustangSVT, the V5 still owns the PCI business. You can still buy their cards, and they still are great.

 

[acroig]

I agree with Deeko about the V5 PCI, but Mustang makes a good point. Upgrade mobo first, then decide on video. GTS for all out speed, Radeon for most DX8 features (until NV20 that is), V5 AGP for all around (Glide) and FSAA.

My 2 cents.

 

[dougjnn]

Radeon doesn't make a PCI card do they? I did a pricewatch search and didn't find any.

I think what I'd like to do for a dual monitor setup is get a radeon pci card (for the prettiest 2D, I hear), and then maybe the NVidia NV20 AGP after it's been out a couple of months.

I figure that NV20 is going to have hardware direct X 8.0 support. I also figure, because of nvidia doing Xbox video for MS, all sorts of PC as well as Xbox games are going to jump onto taking full advantage of the DX 8.0 support soon, as an easy port from the Xbox efforts.

Waddayall think?

 

[acroig]

No, there's no Radeon PCI. One thing to keep in mind, rumor is that when the NV20 ships it will cost in the $500 range. Might have to wait a while to get one

 

[romstar]

Romi,

The RADEON 32MB SDRAM PCI product has been announced, however it has not been released. Unfortunately, we do not have a release date available for this product at this time.

Should you have any further questions feel free to contact us.

Sincerely,

Kyra Gollom
ATI Sales Support
33 Commerce Valley Drive East, Thornhill ON L3T 7N6
Telephone (905) 882-2600 Option 4, Fax (905) 882-2620
Email: sales@ati.com
Check out our web site http://www.ati.com

there is going to be a pci version but when it comes out who know!!!!

 

[BFG10K]

MustangSVT:

PCI doesnt support T&L

It's not a question of not "supporting" T&L. It's a simple matter of raw bandwidth.

The extra vertex data required for T&L raises the bandwidth requirements to the point where PCI can no longer manage the transfers in an effective manner.

 

[MustangSVT]

hence my point.

It's not a question of not "supporting" T&L. It's a simple matter of raw bandwidth. The extra vertex data required for T&L raises the bandwidth requirements to the point where PCI can no longer manage the transfers in an effective manner. = pci doesnt support T&L.

 

[BFG10K]

hence my point. = pci doesnt support T&L.

No, not really. You made it sound like transferring the extra vertex data required by T&L is a feature of AGP and it was specifically designed for it. In reality, the fact that T&L works better on AGP is a simple side-effect of the extra bandwidth.

But hey, I'm just being picky.

 

[MustangSVT]

hmmm.. it is a feature of AGPcard that supports it. u know any PCI based card that does T&L?

seeesh.

 

[merlocka]

From a review at Target PC, "The one major caveat is T&L. Don't enable it. If it's enabled, your FPS will plummet to nearly half of its present rate. The is due to the PCI bus limitation, not a limitation of the card itself."

review

It does it, but FPS will drop significantly if it is enabled.

But it can be done. Saying "PCI doesnt support T&L" because of this is like saying a K6 doesn't support games.

 

[BFG10K]

u know any PCI based card that does T&L?

Um... yes. GF2 MX PCI and ATi Radeon PCI.

 

[MustangSVT]

dang.. i was wrong. Sorry for talking before i knew what the hell im talking about.

 

[BFG10K]

Sorry for talking before i knew what the hell im talking about.

Don't worry about it. You had the right idea.