PCI-E: is this just a marketing ploy that will eventually die out like zip drives?

[jinduy]

and there's no obvious performance gain for using a PCI-E card. i would be super disappointed if they ever came out with updated AGP technology and called it "16x" AGP or whatever... i mean agp was at first 2x..then4...then 8... why not 16?

is pci-e just a marketing ploy? i'm starting to feel like i should go for an AGP board right now.

 

[Matthias99]

Originally posted by: jinduy
and there's no obvious performance gain for using a PCI-E card. i would be super disappointed if they ever came out with updated AGP technology and called it "16x" AGP or whatever... i mean agp was at first 2x..then4...then 8... why not 16?

Because doubling the speed of the AGP interface (again) would be extremely difficult because of noise/crosstalk issues. Also, there would be little point to it, since there is no noticeable performance difference between 4X and 8X AGP anyway.

is pci-e just a marketing ploy? i'm starting to feel like i should go for an AGP board right now.

It's not a marketing ploy; PCI-E is replacing both PCI *and* AGP going forwards. It's not any faster right now, but it's also not any slower, and not all that much more expensive, and AGP may not be supported on all newer video cards.

 

[3chordcharlie]

PCI-E is a future technology, really. AGP has reached its limits (even with extremely short traces, I think Nvidia could only manage 12x on its bridge chip, IIRC).

Right now you won't get anything out of PCI-E except the knowledge that the graphics card will still be compatible with a new motherboard a year or two from now.

 

[n0cmonkey]

These transitions take time. I'll be getting an AGP system when I get around to buying parts.

 

[Cook1]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
These transitions take time. I'll be getting an AGP system when I get around to buying parts.

n0c likes outdated systems

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: Cook1

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
These transitions take time. I'll be getting an AGP system when I get around to buying parts.

n0c likes outdated systems

I get out of the house.

 

[batmanuel]

PCIe is all about replacing the PCI bus with a new technology that is scalable and has a lot more performance headroom for future add-in cards such as HDTV tuners and 10-gigabit ethernet cards. Replacing the AGP is just a side effect of a much more important architectural change.

Also, for the hardcore gamer who has the money to spend for the absolute highest performance, you have to go PCIe to SLI a pair of 6800 Ultras. AGP just isn't as good of an option if you are trying to run Half Life 2 on a large display like a Dell 2405FPW.

Finally, professional graphics cards like the Wildcat Realizm can use the extra bandwidth afforded by PCIe to use system memory as a frame buffer for complex 3D models without having to pay as high a performance penalty as the AGP versions (since PCIe is WAY faster at communicating upstream to the motherboard than AGP).

PCIe is the future. It may not seem such a big deal now, but in a year or two you will be wondering how we coped without it.

 

[live2game]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: Cook1

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
These transitions take time. I'll be getting an AGP system when I get around to buying parts.

n0c likes outdated systems

I get out of the house.

:laugh:

 

[Concillian]

PCIe is not going away.

The transition is being pushed mainly because PCI has reached it's limits, not because AGP has reached it's limits. PCIe makes sense because it unifies the expansion buses in a way that PCI tried to do long ago, AGP was necessary only a short while later as PCI was a shared bus (graphics activity would starve HD throughput and vice versa).

PCIe is significantly more scalable, is simpler and overall better than an AGP/PCI solution. I do not think it is likely that PCIe will go by the wayside like Zip disks. Did you ever see EVERY new Intel chipset support ONLY zip drives? No, but every new Intel chipset supports ONLY PCIe and none support AGP.

16x AGP isn't going to happen. Not only is it a difficult thing to implement, it would still have less throughput capability of a PCIe x16 slot.

 

[ed21x]

zip drives were never a marketing ploy, as it definitely had it's time in the sun and was extremeley popular until being replaced by CDR's

 

[TerryMathews]

Personally, I would have rather the industry settled on PCI-X as opposed to PCIe although I understand the reasons they went with PCIe.

 

[ribbon13]

PCI-X isn't going to go away as quickly as PCI is.

 

[charles555]

why is everybody saying "PCI-E costs more".

IT DOESN"T!!!!!!!!!!!!! Maybe the mother board, but who cares, because the GFX cards are cheaper.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Well, the good news is that there are PCI-E to PCI-X bridge chips, so you could bridge a few PCI-X slots to a PCI-E slot.
But PCI-E is a point-to-point link, whereas PCI-X is still a shared bus like PCI, so PCI-E is still much better.

 

[ribbon13]

Indeed. I'm pretty sure x4 PCIe is going to become the new server standard eventually.

 

[edmundoab]

Originally posted by: charles555
why is everybody saying "PCI-E costs more".

IT DOESN"T!!!!!!!!!!!!! Maybe the mother board, but who cares, because the GFX cards are cheaper.

initially it cost more coz they weren't many manufactured..
but now as they keep mass producing.. prices reduce

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: VirtualLarry
Well, the good news is that there are PCI-E to PCI-X bridge chips, so you could bridge a few PCI-X slots to a PCI-E slot.
But PCI-E is a point-to-point link, whereas PCI-X is still a shared bus like PCI, so PCI-E is still much better.

You also need a indiviual controller chip for each PCI-X slot, which makes it much more expensive...

 

[bunnyfubbles]

Originally posted by: ed21x
zip drives were never a marketing ploy, as it definitely had it's time in the sun and was extremeley popular until being replaced by CDR's

yeah, zip didn't know how to hang on to it, they needed to supply the drives for cheap (floppy drive cheap) and then make money of the media, or the royalties. Zip would have been a great replacement for the floppy drive, yet the floppy still exists to this day, rediculous.

 

[charles555]

same thing happened with the superdrive (I still want one of those in USB.)

 

[ribbon13]

You mean the LS120?

 

[sparkyclarky]

Run an add in RAID card pushing something like RAID 0 or some other striping form of RAID along with an add in gig-E card and sound for good measure and you'll see where PCI is long overdue for an overhaul.

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: charles555
same thing happened with the superdrive (I still want one of those in USB.)

Originally posted by: ribbon13
You mean the LS120?

I would imagine so; I think those were called "Superdisk LS-120"s.
I think they would have done a lot better if they would have managed somehow to 1) come out before ZIP drives were well-established, and 2) boost the speed before launch.
I liked the idea of reverse compatibility, as well as a drive capable of reading floppy disks faster. Unfortunately, schools, businesses, and home users had already jumped all over the ZIP drive, and they saw no reason in buying still more hardware to do basically the same thing.