PCI-E 1.1 vs 2.0 question

hclarkjr

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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are there any benchmarks that show the difference between the 2? is it worth upgrading the motherboard just get 2.0?
 

RussianSensation

Elite Member
Sep 5, 2003
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Don't waste your $. There is neglible difference between PCIe 8x and 16x.
Get an aftermarket cooler and crank that Q6600 to 3.2-3.4ghz instead :)

Alternatively, you'd be better served if you sold your card for $120, purchased a 4870 for $230 or GTX260 for $210. Either of those scenarios will provide a faster gaming performance than spending the same amount of $ on a P45 motherboard.
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,038
344
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Originally posted by: RussianSensation
Don't waste your $. There is neglible difference between PCIe 8x and 16x.
Get an aftermarket cooler and crank that Q6600 to 3.2-3.4ghz instead :)

Alternatively, you'd be better served if you sold your card for $120, purchased a 4870 for $230 or GTX260 for $210. Either of those scenarios will provide a faster gaming performance than spending the same amount of $ on a P45 motherboard.
True. Also with a motherboard upgrade I do hate removing everything and having to fiddle with the wires, cards, and everything fitting. not to mention BIOS updates for things that just don't work correctly out of the box.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
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alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: RussianSensation
Don't waste your $. There is neglible difference between PCIe 8x and 16x.
Get an aftermarket cooler and crank that Q6600 to 3.2-3.4ghz instead :)

Alternatively, you'd be better served if you sold your card for $120, purchased a 4870 for $230 or GTX260 for $210. Either of those scenarios will provide a faster gaming performance than spending the same amount of $ on a P45 motherboard.
it is not negligible if you have 4870 CF; if you don't want to compromise, then the full 16x + 16x is what you want from x48/x38 as i am doing,

However, evidently the difference between 1.0 and 2.0 PCIe is not enough to upgrade even though the available bandwidth is evidently doubled
-i am testing this also as i go from p35 to x48

if you are looking for a new MB *anyway*, however, you might want to pick x48 or x38; x48 is ~$200 if you are keeping the current platform. i believe Nehalem's i7 lanches the end of November if you want the bleeding edge of technology - that means your wallet is also bleedin' :p

if you have a single GPU it probably makes sense to keep your current MB; i will know for sure pretty soon. i am backing up all my data right now to do clean installs so i can compare MB platform differences. All my benches with Cat 8.8 are completely done, so i already have the relative performances of 4870x2, 280GTX, 4870/512, 8800GTX and 2900xt established at 16x10 and 19x12.

These new benches with Cat 8.9 will specifically show P35 MB's PCIe limitations - if any - with the higher performing GPUs including it's 1.0 PCIe interface vs x48's 2.0 and P35's 4x PCIe 2nd CF slot vs x48's full 16x bandwidth. It is an ongoing project and i should have that phase done next week.

 

hclarkjr

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
11,375
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Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: RussianSensation
Don't waste your $. There is neglible difference between PCIe 8x and 16x.
Get an aftermarket cooler and crank that Q6600 to 3.2-3.4ghz instead :)

Alternatively, you'd be better served if you sold your card for $120, purchased a 4870 for $230 or GTX260 for $210. Either of those scenarios will provide a faster gaming performance than spending the same amount of $ on a P45 motherboard.
it is not negligible if you have 4870 CF; if you don't want to compromise, then the full 16x + 16x is what you want from x48/x38 as i am doing,

However, evidently the difference between 1.0 and 2.0 PCIe is not enough to upgrade even though the available bandwidth is evidently doubled
-i am testing this also as i go from p35 to x48

if you are looking for a new MB *anyway*, however, you might want to pick x48 or x38; x48 is ~$200 if you are keeping the current platform. i believe Nehalem's i7 lanches the end of November if you want the bleeding edge of technology - that means your wallet is also bleedin' :p

if you have a single GPU it probably makes sense to keep your current MB; i will know for sure pretty soon. i am backing up all my data right now to do clean installs so i can compare MB platform differences. All my benches with Cat 8.8 are completely done, so i already have the relative performances of 4870x2, 280GTX, 4870/512, 8800GTX and 2900xt established at 16x10 and 19x12.

These new benches with Cat 8.9 will specifically show P35 MB's PCIe limitations - if any - with the higher performing GPUs including it's 1.0 PCIe interface vs x48's 2.0 and P35's 4x PCIe 2nd CF slot vs x48's full 16x bandwidth. It is an ongoing project and i should have that phase done next week.

please keep us posted, this is the kind of info i asked about.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
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alienbabeltech.com
OK, i am sorry i am taking so long - i offered to post my 8.8 benches, but most here said they were content to wait for my 8.9 results [although they are much the same except with CF-x3]

i had to double check every single benchmark over both partitions to be sure when i did my benching with Cat 8.8 when i saw a certain lack of smoothness with 4870/512
- now i feel i better do 2 completely fresh installs of Vista on my identical HDs to make damn sure there are no other factors in comparing MB PCI-E differences

it is something i feel is not properly explored elsewhere although there is some testing at a tech site or two

 

Nathelion

Senior member
Jan 30, 2006
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I'm pretty sure I've seen benchmarks around that show a performance hit with SLI/xfire in PCIE 1.0 8x/8x. I think it was also concluded that a 4870 x2 would be bottlenecked by a 16x PCIE 1.0 link, and needs PCIE 2.0.
 

RussianSensation

Elite Member
Sep 5, 2003
19,458
765
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Originally posted by: apoppin

it is not negligible if you have 4870 CF; if you don't want to compromise, then the full 16x + 16x is what you want from x48/x38 as i am doing,
I never mentioned anything with regard to a CF setup. I am just responding to OP's original question which considers his setup (1 graphics card) only.

if you are looking for a new MB *anyway*, however, you might want to pick x48 or x38; x48 is ~$200 if you are keeping the current platform. i believe Nehalem's i7 lanches the end of November if you want the bleeding edge of technology - that means your wallet is also bleedin' :p
There is no point in spending $200 for 1% performance gain unless there is a need for a dual graphics card setup.

 

RussianSensation

Elite Member
Sep 5, 2003
19,458
765
126
Originally posted by: Nathelion
I'm pretty sure I've seen benchmarks around that show a performance hit with SLI/xfire in PCIE 1.0 8x/8x. I think it was also concluded that a 4870 x2 would be bottlenecked by a 16x PCIE 1.0 link, and needs PCIE 2.0.
Comparing SLI/CF in 8x/8x configuration is not the same as running HD4870 X2 at 16x in PCIe 1.0. It'd be interesting to see if 16x bottlenecks 4870 x2. I highly doubt there is a difference worth talking about. You have a link?
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
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alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: RussianSensation
Originally posted by: apoppin

it is not negligible if you have 4870 CF; if you don't want to compromise, then the full 16x + 16x is what you want from x48/x38 as i am doing,
I never mentioned anything with regard to a CF setup. I am just responding to OP's original question which considers his setup (1 graphics card) only.

if you are looking for a new MB *anyway*, however, you might want to pick x48 or x38; x48 is ~$200 if you are keeping the current platform. i believe Nehalem's i7 lanches the end of November if you want the bleeding edge of technology - that means your wallet is also bleedin' :p
There is no point in spending $200 for 1% performance gain unless there is a need for a dual graphics card setup.
i know you didn't mention CF - at all; i just wanted to clarify the need for it - with CF. And it is not "$200 more" for a x38 MB over a P45 :p


It'd be interesting to see if 16x bottlenecks 4870 x2.
i am reformatting now and will test 1.0 vs 2.0, shortly
--p35's 1.0 vs x48's 2.0 16x PCIe slot; as well as the 2nd 4x PCIe slot vs the 16x provided by x48

there is only one review i am aware of so far, most have been done comparing P45 vs x38/x48 - i want to explore the older MBs a lot of us got last year

 

RussianSensation

Elite Member
Sep 5, 2003
19,458
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Update:

"We have been running this board with our 9950BE at 3.54GHz non-stop since Tuesday without a failure yet. One of the concerns from the performance oriented crowd is that the x16 graphic slots are hardware fixed at x8 operation. We have not noticed any performance differences with single card testing when compared to the 790FX that operates its PCIe 2.0 slots at x16 in single or dual card configurations. In CrossFire testing, we had the same results with the 4670 and 4850 cards while the 4870 cards performed about 2% slower." - Sept 19th analysis
 

hclarkjr

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
11,375
0
0
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: RussianSensation
Originally posted by: apoppin

it is not negligible if you have 4870 CF; if you don't want to compromise, then the full 16x + 16x is what you want from x48/x38 as i am doing,
I never mentioned anything with regard to a CF setup. I am just responding to OP's original question which considers his setup (1 graphics card) only.

if you are looking for a new MB *anyway*, however, you might want to pick x48 or x38; x48 is ~$200 if you are keeping the current platform. i believe Nehalem's i7 lanches the end of November if you want the bleeding edge of technology - that means your wallet is also bleedin' :p
There is no point in spending $200 for 1% performance gain unless there is a need for a dual graphics card setup.
i know you didn't mention CF - at all; i just wanted to clarify the need for it - with CF. And it is not "$200 more" for a x38 MB over a P45 :p


It'd be interesting to see if 16x bottlenecks 4870 x2.
i am reformatting now and will test 1.0 vs 2.0, shortly
--p35's 1.0 vs x48's 2.0 16x PCIe slot; as well as the 2nd 4x PCIe slot vs the 16x provided by x48

there is only one review i am aware of so far, most have been done comparing P45 vs x38/x48 - i want to explore the older MBs a lot of us got last year

so what were your results?
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
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alienbabeltech.com
so what were your results?
i am still working with my p35 MB :p
- i almost finished and then AMD released Cat 8.9 .. so i redid my benches

then i almost finished again, and Nvidia released their new drivers a few days ago

:Q

i have a day job also, so i really have the weekends. i am *almost* done [for the 4th time !!] again .. and will swap out my MB i a couple of days

- at least all my Backups are done and patches programs and drive images safely tidied up so it won't take quite as long for x48 as it did for p35.
 

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