Paying additional fees to pay your bills?

Anonemous

Diamond Member
May 19, 2003
7,361
1
71
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-lazarus-20101005,0,442445.column

Mortgage lenders and utility providers are charging customers as much as $20 to pay by phone.

David Lazarus

October 5, 2010

The credit card reform law now prohibits lenders from charging a fee for paying your bill by phone, particularly if you use an automated system. But apparently the same doesn't apply to mortgage payments.

Such practices — let's call them pay-to-pay — are a particularly obnoxious example of ways some businesses reach deeper into customers' pockets with unwarranted or overblown fees.

If you have a mortgage with Chase bank, for example, the company says on its statements that "Chase Fast/Pay is a quick and convenient payment option … with one simple phone call." If you need help from a living, breathing service rep, the charge is $20.

But even if you use Chase's automated phone system, the charge is still $15.

Wells Fargo charges an identical amount. So does Bank of America.

How could that be? I'm no tech geek, but it's hard to believe that the actual cost of processing an automated phone payment could be anything more than a few cents (if that).

Gary Kishner, a Chase spokesman, had no explanation for why an automated transaction comes with such a hefty price tag, except that it's still cheaper than paying a late fee, which typically runs about 5% of the monthly payment.

"That's just the cost we charge," he said.

Los Feliz resident David Campbell, 75, isn't buying that. He's a former economics professor at the University of Idaho and a longtime Chase mortgage customer.

"At $15 to use the automated system, I would guess that's about 99% profit," Campbell said. "How can they charge so much just to pay your bill?"

That's a great question, and it doesn't just apply to banks. Many phone and cable companies also charge customers for the privilege of giving the company some cash.

Beginning Oct. 16, Verizon Communications will charge $3.50 for any nonrecurring payment using a credit or debit card. In other words, if you don't sign up for their regular bill-paying program and prefer to pay each month with plastic, you'll pay more.

And it doesn't matter whether you speak with a service rep, use the company's automated phone system or pay online.

"It's a way to encourage customers to sign up for automated bill pay," explained Jon Davies, a Verizon spokesman.

That's one way of putting it. Another is that it's a way to punish anyone who doesn't give the company what it wants: a steady stream of guaranteed payments.

AT&T is a little better. It charges $5 if you pay by phone with a real, live service rep, but there's no charge for using the company's automated system.

Time Warner Cable charges $4.99 to pay by phone with a human being, but it too charges nothing to use the automated system.

"People pay for a product or service," said Doug Heller, executive director of Consumer Watchdog, a Santa Monica advocacy group. "They shouldn't have to pay again just for the right to pay them."

He said most businesses already factor in their operating costs in the prices they charge customers.

"Companies that make you pay to pay your bill are basically charging you twice," Heller said. "They build everything into their price for a product or service, and then they break it out again as a fee.

"It's deceptive," he said. "And it's not fair."

I wrote last week about some things President Obama's new consumer czar, Elizabeth Warren, should focus on. Maybe this is something to add to the list.

Meanwhile, let me know if there are any other pay-to-pay fees out there. Just post a comment online or shoot me an e-mail.

Discover glitch

Speaking of banks, a little heads-up for anyone who recently applied for a Discover credit card:

The company has mailed letters to a number of new plastic holders telling them that "the expiration date for your introductory purchase APR that was disclosed on your pricing schedule was not correct."

The letters say that the introductory 0% annual percentage rate for carrying a balance on stuff you buy "has been extended by one month and will apply until the last day of your billing period" in March 2011.

So what's going on?

Matt Towson, a Discover spokesman, said the company messed up in determining the six-month period that new cardholders would enjoy with a 0% APR before a more eye-opening 15.99% rate kicks in.

"It was a glitch," he said. "We made an error in calculating the dates."

The glitch apparently shortchanged people by a few days. So Discover is making good with an additional month of 0% interest.

That's the way you do it.
 

Bateluer

Lifer
Jun 23, 2001
27,730
8
0
Tactics like that are BS. My old apartment complex offered a system to pay online, but it charged a 35 dollar fee to do it. Even their employees in the office would tell us not to use it as it was a rip off. Since they had a 'drop box' you could drop a check in 24/7, the online option with that fee was asinine.
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
50,419
8
81
This has always pissed me off. I have to pay an extra fee just to give you my money?

Fuck you.

That Verizon bit pisses me off. What if you pay with Bill Pay(check)?

It really boggles the mind. It should be much, much cheaper for them to take an online payment than for you to write a check. If you write a check, someone has to take it, sign it and deposit it.

I may be able to understand a small fee for paying over the phone with a CSR, but not for an automated system and especially not for paying online.
 
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IceBergSLiM

Lifer
Jul 11, 2000
29,932
3
81
Customer service these days means asking your customer if there is any way for you to rape them harder.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Most of these fees are only charged when the bill is on the day or within 48 hours of being due.

Almost all the creditors I have give the option of paying on the due date via phone with a fee that's roughly half the late fee.

I think that is fair.

It's not like 30 days went by without you knowing about it.
 

SandEagle

Lifer
Aug 4, 2007
16,809
13
0
Tmobile charges $1.75/month if you want to receive a paper bill. Go green, go paperless or else
 

her209

No Lifer
Oct 11, 2000
56,336
11
0
Sprint started charging like $5 extra and would "waive" it if you enrolled in their automatic payment program.
 

kranky

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
21,019
156
106
It looks like the Verizon fee applies to landline, FIOS and DSL customers, not to wireless customers.

And it actually says you have to pay a $3.50 fee to pay with credit or debit, unless signed up for automatic billing. Amazing.
 

rcpratt

Lifer
Jul 2, 2009
10,433
110
116
AAA really pisses me off. $5 fee for each paper bill they send you, and they don't even fucking tell you until you get the first one. And their online/auto pay sucks. I ended up paying the last 3/4 of my bill all at once so I didn't have to rack up $10 more in charges, eff you AAA.
 

Jeff7

Lifer
Jan 4, 2001
41,596
20
81
Are they affiliated with Ticketmaster? :D

Several dollars to ship a ticket, and a "convenience fee" because they were kind enough to let you pay online.
 

PingSpike

Lifer
Feb 25, 2004
21,758
603
126
My power company charges $5 to pay online, so I just send them a check. That only costs me about $0.50.
 

rcpratt

Lifer
Jul 2, 2009
10,433
110
116
Do that many of you really still send out checks yourselves? Don't your banks have a Web BillPay type feature?

Everything of mine except crappy AAA goes through that.

edit: Eh, nvm.
 
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Brovane

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2001
6,392
2,582
136
Do that many of you really still send out checks yourselves? Don't your banks have a Web BillPay type feature?

Everything of mine except crappy AAA goes through that.

Ditto. My credit union has online bill pay. I just select the amount that needs to be sent, when it needs to be sent and depending on the company it will either be a check or electronic transfer. It has simplified a lot of things and doesn't cost me anything.
 

Acanthus

Lifer
Aug 28, 2001
19,915
2
76
ostif.org
I use webbillpay, but if for whatever reason i have to use credit to pay a utility or some other odd situation... It sucks.

The electric company charges $3 by phone (automated) and $3 to pay online. Gas is the same.

Time warner charges me to pay them no matter what i do, unless i physically mail them a check.
 

KaOTiK

Lifer
Feb 5, 2001
10,877
8
81
Progressive charges like $3 or whatever if you don't use their automated pay system. It is BS.
 

Homerboy

Lifer
Mar 1, 2000
30,890
5,001
126
I use webbillpay, but if for whatever reason i have to use credit to pay a utility or some other odd situation... It sucks.

The electric company charges $3 by phone (automated) and $3 to pay online. Gas is the same.

Time warner charges me to pay them no matter what i do, unless i physically mail them a check.

That's not right.
I had TW/RR for years.
I ALWAYS used webbillpay with them via my bank. At first they weren;t on the 1 day instant pay, so a check would be cut by my bank and mailed out to TW (5 days). Then they became 1 day turn around and it was Electronic Funds Transfer. I never was billed extra.
 

her209

No Lifer
Oct 11, 2000
56,336
11
0
I use webbillpay, but if for whatever reason i have to use credit to pay a utility or some other odd situation... It sucks.

The electric company charges $3 by phone (automated) and $3 to pay online. Gas is the same.

Time warner charges me to pay them no matter what i do, unless i physically mail them a check.
Its like they want to do more work to physically process payments.
 

IndyColtsFan

Lifer
Sep 22, 2007
33,655
688
126
If something costs me extra money to pay online, I'll just pay by check.

Me too, and you know it costs them much more to process a check than an electronic payment. They're hoping people will pay for the convenience, which won't happen.

Indiana used to have a $5 (IIRC) "service charge" to renew your vehicle registration online. The state government must have gotten the hint, because now, they give you a discount to renew online.
 

IndyColtsFan

Lifer
Sep 22, 2007
33,655
688
126
Do that many of you really still send out checks yourselves? Don't your banks have a Web BillPay type feature?

Everything of mine except crappy AAA goes through that.

edit: Eh, nvm.

I don't write a single check for my monthly bills. My accounts are through Chase and I pay everything through their electronic bill pay.

With that being said, I WOULD write checks if a vendor tried to charge me to pay online. There is absolutely, positively no way that a transaction costs more electronically than it would for them to have to manually process a check. They're just hoping people will pay for the convenience and for them, it is pure profit.