Patrick intensifies state's push to curb soaring health premiums

winnar111

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Mar 10, 2008
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http://www.boston.com/news/loc...aring_health_premiums/

Governor Deval Patrick yesterday accelerated his administration's efforts to control spiraling statewide healthcare costs, warning that rising premiums threaten to crush families and businesses and doom Massachusetts' groundbreaking experiment with universal insurance.

Patrick said officials are considering using state insurance regulations to block excessive healthcare premiums. He is also summoning leaders of insurance and hospital companies for meetings as soon as this week to ask for their "vigorous cooperation."

In response to stories by the Globe's Spotlight Team about the role of Partners HealthCare and Blue Cross Blue Shield of Massa chusetts in driving up costs, Patrick convened a panel of senior administration figures yesterday to coordinate new and existing state cost containment efforts, which he said should produce action by summer. He also said he expects to file new legislation.

"The increases at this rate over time [are] just not sustainable, not for families, not to business, not for government," Patrick said at a news conference after the summit.

Inspector General Gregory W. Sullivan also said he wants providers and insurers to delay signing new contracts until the administration has implemented new, as-yet-undetermined policies to limit premiums.

The Spotlight Team has reported, quoting officials directly involved in the negotiations, that the leaders of Partners and Blue Cross made a deal in 2000 in which Blue Cross significantly boosted its payments to Partners in exchange for Partners' insistence that all other insurers pay at least as much for the care of their members by Partners doctors. That prevented insurance companies from competing on price, and helped to drive up consumer prices statewide. Individual insurance premiums in Massachusetts have risen nearly 9 percent a year since 2000, twice the annual rate increase of the late 1990s.

The Spotlight Team has also reported that Partners hospitals are paid significantly more than other, comparable facilities.

Partners and Blue Cross say they did nothing improper. Both companies contend that payments to hospitals had been too low before the 2000 agreement, and Partners said its CEO promised only to treat all insurers equally.

Both companies also said yesterday that they look forward to participating in Patrick's discussions. Partners spokesman Rich Copp said in a statement that cost increases nationally "have been mirrored almost exactly" in Massachusetts. He also noted that Partners' latest contract with Blue Cross, settled over the summer, "resulted in rate increases well below those experienced in prior years." The contract calls for increases in payments of about 5 to 6 percent a year, roughly equivalent to medical inflation.

Blue Cross CEO Cleve L. Killingsworth Jr. expressed support in a statement for one proposal the administration is considering: reforming the payment system to compensate hospitals for patient outcomes, rather than for the number of procedures or visits.



So these imbeciles pass outrageous mandates driving up the cost of insurance, make everyone purchase this insurance, have the government go bankrupt buying this expensive insurance, and then blames the insurance companies after the fact.

Can we call this experiment a failure yet?
 

senseamp

Lifer
Feb 5, 2006
35,787
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This has to be much more comprehensive and on federal level. It should be a benefit, not a mandate.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
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Oh Winnar.

Even if Massachusetts completely screws up their healthcare there are numerous examples worldwide of socialized medicine being the absolute best form of health care available that we know of. It provides the most health for the least money.
 

Specop 007

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Jan 31, 2005
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Originally posted by: eskimospy
Oh Winnar.

Even if Massachusetts completely screws up their healthcare there are numerous examples worldwide of socialized medicine being the absolute best form of health care available that we know of. It provides the most health for the least money.

Which is all the more reason it would fail here.

"We" are not "Them". You cant say it works in some foreign country with a completely different culture and mindset and expect it will fit equally well here. One could also argue that since they think theres witches in Africa that they must also exist here too..... or perahps because Israel requires military service it should be required here too.

Simply saying "Well they do it there" is a poor poor justification for wanting it full force here. I dont know of any state that actually has a successful UHC type program. That alone speaks volumes about how a UHC type program would operate on a larger level.
 

bozack

Diamond Member
Jan 14, 2000
7,913
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I read that article in the globe and thought it was interesting, also interesting to see what it takes to motivate the Patrick administration to actually do something.

Partners is the gorilla in the room, they formed an "alliance" and are now using their power to charge more, which in my understanding is hurting non Partners facilities.

Normally I am for the big guy, but in this case I would like to see partners get smacked down a bit off their high horse.

 

BeauJangles

Lifer
Aug 26, 2001
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Originally posted by: Specop 007
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Oh Winnar.

Even if Massachusetts completely screws up their healthcare there are numerous examples worldwide of socialized medicine being the absolute best form of health care available that we know of. It provides the most health for the least money.

Which is all the more reason it would fail here.

"We" are not "Them". You cant say it works in some foreign country with a completely different culture and mindset and expect it will fit equally well here. One could also argue that since they think theres witches in Africa that they must also exist here too..... or perahps because Israel requires military service it should be required here too.

Simply saying "Well they do it there" is a poor poor justification for wanting it full force here. I dont know of any state that actually has a successful UHC type program. That alone speaks volumes about how a UHC type program would operate on a larger level.

Most people in Massachusetts, including the staff at the State House really don't believe the universal healthcare plan was a good one. It basically did nothing except force everyone to have healthcare and hold those who didn't have the care fiscally responsible starting in Jan '09. Unfortunately (but obviously), those penalties don't make up for the amount of money the state is spending.

The plan in MA is nothing like a true UHC system, it was just an absolutely awful experiment.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
69,045
26,922
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This experiment failed because it still includes private insurance companies. It is a good lesson for those who would revive some version HillaryCare and attempt to pass it off as reform. Private health insurance schemes are a luxury America can no longer afford.
 

shira

Diamond Member
Jan 12, 2005
9,567
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Originally posted by: winnar111
So these imbeciles pass outrageous mandates driving up the cost of insurance, make everyone purchase this insurance, have the government go bankrupt buying this expensive insurance, and then blames the insurance companies after the fact.

Can we call this experiment a failure yet?
Nothing in the story supports your conclusion that the existence of the MA plan - with it's insurance mandates - "drove up" costs. The story indicates that the Boston Globe discovered that Partners and Blue Cross colluded, thereby preventing price competition.

In other words, your lying (again).
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
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Originally posted by: Specop 007
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Oh Winnar.

Even if Massachusetts completely screws up their healthcare there are numerous examples worldwide of socialized medicine being the absolute best form of health care available that we know of. It provides the most health for the least money.

Which is all the more reason it would fail here.

"We" are not "Them". You cant say it works in some foreign country with a completely different culture and mindset and expect it will fit equally well here. One could also argue that since they think theres witches in Africa that they must also exist here too..... or perahps because Israel requires military service it should be required here too.

Simply saying "Well they do it there" is a poor poor justification for wanting it full force here. I dont know of any state that actually has a successful UHC type program. That alone speaks volumes about how a UHC type program would operate on a larger level.

Uhmmm... no. Laughably no.

This is the difference between having 'evidence' for something, and not. We have evidence of other countries with similar cultures, backgrounds, economic capacity per capita, institutions, policy formulation mechanisms, medical technology, and standards for treatment that have been able to implement a different policy than ours with great success. Sanitation systems were first developed in Europe. Did we say "that there sewage system won't work in 'Murrica! It's foreign!"? Of course not, we would have been foolish to do so.

Now lets look at 'witches'. Actually your insane attempt to link the two does more to prove my point than yours. There is no evidence for witches in Africa, much like there is no evidence for witches in America. Objectively the correct policy position is the same between the two areas, don't go on witch hunts. If both societies acted on the preponderance of objective evidence, both countries would be better off. Something to think about, eh?
 

JohnnyGage

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Feb 18, 2008
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Originally posted by: eskimospy
Oh Winnar.

Even if Massachusetts completely screws up their healthcare there are numerous examples worldwide of socialized medicine being the absolute best form of health care available that we know of. It provides the most health for the least money.


Elaborate on why is it "cheaper"?



Edit:To re-phrase
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,039
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Originally posted by: JohnnyGage
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Oh Winnar.

Even if Massachusetts completely screws up their healthcare there are numerous examples worldwide of socialized medicine being the absolute best form of health care available that we know of. It provides the most health for the least money.


Elaborate on why is it "cheaper"?



Edit:To re-phrase

The reason why I didn't elaborate is that this has been discussed to death on here. Not to be a jerk, but there are about 104982352 threads that discuss exactly why it is cheaper on here already.
 

JS80

Lifer
Oct 24, 2005
26,271
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lulz the HMOs should stop selling insurance in Mass. let's see where prices go.

How can a state with great Ivy institutions be so fucking stupid
 

Mxylplyx

Diamond Member
Mar 21, 2007
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The private healtcare industry just doesnt jive with the notion that healthcare is a right. The government, which also considers healthcare a right, but isnt directly responsible for providing it, legislates mandates for the private companies to follow, and then bitches when they raise prices to compensate for it.

When we finally do move to nationalized healthcare, I think the biggest mistake the government can make is claiming that the service us well insured people receive wont be affected, it will just be cheaper and more widely accessible. I am willing to sacrifice some of the quality that I enjoy as a well insured person in order to make healthcare available to everyone, just done lie to me and tell me it will be anything otherwise. The well insured in America have the best healthcare in the world. It's just unfortunate that not everyone gets to use it.
 

Farang

Lifer
Jul 7, 2003
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Originally posted by: JS80
lulz the HMOs should stop selling insurance in Mass. let's see where prices go.

How can a state with great Ivy institutions be so fucking stupid

I'm not an expert on Mass. politics but wasn't this Romney's doing?
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
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Originally posted by: Farang
Originally posted by: JS80
lulz the HMOs should stop selling insurance in Mass. let's see where prices go.

How can a state with great Ivy institutions be so fucking stupid

I'm not an expert on Mass. politics but wasn't this Romney's doing?

ROMNEY/JINDAL 2012!!!!
 

winnar111

Banned
Mar 10, 2008
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Originally posted by: Farang
Originally posted by: JS80
lulz the HMOs should stop selling insurance in Mass. let's see where prices go.

How can a state with great Ivy institutions be so fucking stupid

I'm not an expert on Mass. politics but wasn't this Romney's doing?

Partially.
 

bozack

Diamond Member
Jan 14, 2000
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Originally posted by: Farang
I'm not an expert on Mass. politics but wasn't this Romney's doing?

Romney saw the writing on the wall and did what any good politician would do, took one for the team...he made some modifications to a proposal that was getting steamrolled in one way or another and took credit for it on the national level. I think if there wasn't so much pressure behind it (probabily mostly from Partners) then he wouldn't have just bent over most of the citizens. I know many who contract, make just enough to get by, and now are forced to buy substandard health insurance at no real discount from what they could have paid before the legislation took effect.
 

Farang

Lifer
Jul 7, 2003
10,914
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Originally posted by: bozack
Originally posted by: Farang
I'm not an expert on Mass. politics but wasn't this Romney's doing?

Romney saw the writing on the wall and did what any good politician would do, took one for the team...he made some modifications to a proposal that was getting steamrolled in one way or another and took credit for it on the national level. I think if there wasn't so much pressure behind it (probabily mostly from Partners) then he wouldn't have just bent over most of the citizens. I know many who contract, make just enough to get by, and now are forced to buy substandard health insurance at no real discount from what they could have paid before the legislation took effect.

Please.. what you said would be more plausible had Romney not gone out of his way to take so much credit for it. This was a badge of honor for him and his ticket to look like someone who could reach across the isle and steal the health care issue from Democrats during a national campaign.
 

winnar111

Banned
Mar 10, 2008
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Originally posted by: Farang
Originally posted by: bozack
Originally posted by: Farang
I'm not an expert on Mass. politics but wasn't this Romney's doing?

Romney saw the writing on the wall and did what any good politician would do, took one for the team...he made some modifications to a proposal that was getting steamrolled in one way or another and took credit for it on the national level. I think if there wasn't so much pressure behind it (probabily mostly from Partners) then he wouldn't have just bent over most of the citizens. I know many who contract, make just enough to get by, and now are forced to buy substandard health insurance at no real discount from what they could have paid before the legislation took effect.

Please.. what you said would be more plausible had Romney not gone out of his way to take so much credit for it. This was a badge of honor for him and his ticket to look like someone who could reach across the isle and steal the health care issue from Democrats during a national campaign.

In other words, Romney's plan sucked. No fkn shit, which is why he's not in the White House.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
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Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: JohnnyGage
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Oh Winnar.

Even if Massachusetts completely screws up their healthcare there are numerous examples worldwide of socialized medicine being the absolute best form of health care available that we know of. It provides the most health for the least money.


Elaborate on why is it "cheaper"?



Edit:To re-phrase

The reason why I didn't elaborate is that this has been discussed to death on here. Not to be a jerk, but there are about 104982352 threads that discuss exactly why it is cheaper on here already.

Then there are 104982352 threads which come to the wrong conclusion. Medicaid is obscenely expensive and we're supposed to believe that the same people who are in office who support that fiasco will magically do better.

How about how they took years to implement HIPPA, and that created so much mandated bureaucracy that any hypothetical savings will take decades to recoup if ever?

As one working in health care I get to see first hand what screw ups the state and federal programs are. While there are a great many problems with private insurance, I worry about what happens when the same politicians that brought us the Bridge to Nowhere and Iraq take over health care. Make no mistake it will not be health care workers or consumer advocacy groups which will craft and implement UHC. It will be done with an eye for political concerns and pork by people who haven't the slightest idea. There are countless threads about how one party or another screwed something up, yet I'm supposed to believe that the same people will be good stewards of one of the most important programs that could possibly exist? No, I don't buy it. MA isn't an aberration, it's the future of health care if(when?) government runs it.

I can live with UHC in some form, but the liberal faith in it is equivalent to the conservative faith in the premise of Iraq. Both sides want their pet so badly that they will find any argument for it.

 

babylon5

Golden Member
Dec 11, 2000
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There are somethings that USA just can't do (without drastic consequences), but other countries can do pretty well.

UHC is one of them.