paste or pad? (fixed)

[Lasthitlarry]

Anyway, the heatsink came with a little gray pad already on it, so I decided to skip the step of scraping and using arctic silver(figured thermaltake knew what was up), and I am rewarded with a burnt processor(I am pretty sure its burned, but I cant be positive). My friend lives like 9 hours away, so I tell him to order some arctic silver 5, and clean the processor and heatsink using rubbing alcohol, and applying the thermal stuff. But, he also said his power supply was really hot when all this happens and the smell seems to be coming from there, so a bad power supply is a bit likely, as it came with the cheap case)

Edit:

Ok, my friend installed the a new power supply, and it works.
Well sort of, it has trouble with the boot procedure, it resets sometimes before it actually gets to Windows, so it might be a hard drive issue, which I am discussing here.

 

[aatf510]

From what you have said, it looks more like a PSU problem then a CPU problem.

 

[Insidious]

Thermal pads work just fine unless you crank the CPU voltage way up.

Judging from all the other difficulties with the build, I suggest some serious issues of component selection and or installation.

I believe the seven Ps were missing in this adventure

-Sid

 

[bocamojo]

Originally posted by: Lasthitlarry
Ok, so I build my friend a computer, and everything goes wrong, the winxp cd didn't come with a serial number to install it, the case lights don't work, the motherboard has compatibility issues, cd drive gets jammed after 5 minutes of running(rosewill, arg i hate you)etc. Finally we get it done and I actually give it to my friend to use. Little did I know his processor would burn out in like 2-3 months (Amd athlon xp+ 2600-3000)*cant remember. Now what I think caused all this is my disregard of a thermal solution. The heatsink/fan I bought him was thermaltake volcano something, it is more than enough for the processor.

Actual Event: Played dungeon siege for 2-3 hours, left computer on for 1-2 hours and went afk, computer crashed. (all the details I got)

Anyway, the heatsink came with a little gray pad already on it, so I decided to skip the step of scraping and using arctic silver(figured thermaltake knew what was up), and I am rewarded with a burnt processor(I am pretty sure its burned, but I cant be positive). My friend lives like 9 hours away, so I tell him to order some arctic silver 5, and clean the processor and heatsink using rubbing alcohol, and applying the thermal stuff. But, he also said his power supply was really hot when all this happens and the smell seems to be coming from there, so a bad power supply is a bit likely, as it came with the cheap case)

Wow, sry for the long post, hope someone can help us out.

Once you've used the thermal pad, there's no getting it off. It has some sort of wax that melts into the heatsink. You could always get a new heatsink and apply the AS5 to it, but it will do you no good to try and clean off the current heatsink and apply AS5. I would have him install motherboard monitor or speedfan and get a feel for what the CPU temps are. If they are under 50C, then I would leave the heatsink alone and focus on replacing the PSU.

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: bocamojo

Originally posted by: Lasthitlarry
Ok, so I build my friend a computer, and everything goes wrong, the winxp cd didn't come with a serial number to install it, the case lights don't work, the motherboard has compatibility issues, cd drive gets jammed after 5 minutes of running(rosewill, arg i hate you)etc. Finally we get it done and I actually give it to my friend to use. Little did I know his processor would burn out in like 2-3 months (Amd athlon xp+ 2600-3000)*cant remember. Now what I think caused all this is my disregard of a thermal solution. The heatsink/fan I bought him was thermaltake volcano something, it is more than enough for the processor.

Actual Event: Played dungeon siege for 2-3 hours, left computer on for 1-2 hours and went afk, computer crashed. (all the details I got)

Anyway, the heatsink came with a little gray pad already on it, so I decided to skip the step of scraping and using arctic silver(figured thermaltake knew what was up), and I am rewarded with a burnt processor(I am pretty sure its burned, but I cant be positive). My friend lives like 9 hours away, so I tell him to order some arctic silver 5, and clean the processor and heatsink using rubbing alcohol, and applying the thermal stuff. But, he also said his power supply was really hot when all this happens and the smell seems to be coming from there, so a bad power supply is a bit likely, as it came with the cheap case)

Wow, sry for the long post, hope someone can help us out.

Once you've used the thermal pad, there's no getting it off. It has some sort of wax that melts into the heatsink. You could always get a new heatsink and apply the AS5 to it, but it will do you no good to try and clean off the current heatsink and apply AS5. I would have him install motherboard monitor or speedfan and get a feel for what the CPU temps are. If they are under 50C, then I would leave the heatsink alone and focus on replacing the PSU.

Tests have shown Honeywell PCM out performs Artic Silver 5 on CPU heatsinks.

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: toattett
From what you have said, it looks more like a PSU problem then a CPU problem.

I might have to agree with him on this, for the CD-ROM, CPU, motherboard, and OS crashes make the PSU looks rather suspect.


http://www.pcpowercooling.com/products/...ghperformance/turbocools/510/index.htm

clean the processor and heatsink using rubbing alcohol,

BAD MISTAKE! NEVER EVER USE RUBBING ALCOHOL TO CLEAN A PROCESSOR. RUBBING IS DIFFERANT THAT ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL BECAUSE RUBBING ALCOHOL CONTAINS OILS ADDED TO THE ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL TO PROTECT THE SKIN AND THOSE OILS CAN CAUSE DAMAGE TO SENSITIVE ELECRICAL COMPONENTS. INSTEAD YOU SHOULD USE METHYL ETHYL KETONE AKA MEK.

 

[Googer]

If you are going to use ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL make sure that you use the 100% stuff and not the 70% kind you get a WAL*MART or the drugstore.

100% Isopropyl Alcohol is tough to find.

 

[Ausm]

Originally posted by: Googer

Originally posted by: toattett
From what you have said, it looks more like a PSU problem then a CPU problem.

I might have to agree with him on this, for the CD-ROM, CPU, motherboard, and OS crashes make the PSU looks rather suspect.


http://www.pcpowercooling.com/products/...ghperformance/turbocools/510/index.htm

clean the processor and heatsink using rubbing alcohol,

BAD MISTAKE! NEVER EVER USE RUBBING ALCOHOL TO CLEAN A PROCESSOR. RUBBING IS DIFFERANT THAT ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL BECAUSE RUBBING ALCOHOL CONTAINS OILS ADDED TO THE ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL TO PROTECT THE SKIN AND THOSE OILS CAN CAUSE DAMAGE TO SENSITIVE ELECRICAL COMPONENTS. INSTEAD YOU SHOULD USE METHYL ETHYL KETONE AKA MEK.

I clean mine off using a thin razor blade and acetone.


Ausm

 

[Matthias99]

Originally posted by: Googer
If you are going to use ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL make sure that you use the 100% stuff and not the 70% kind you get a WAL*MART or the drugstore.

100% Isopropyl Alcohol is tough to find.

Really, the 70% stuff works fine; it just takes longer to dry (it's 30% water). Almost all drugstores will carry 90%, if not 95% or higher (you may have to ask for this; they don't always have it out on the shelves). You might also try a hardware store.

BAD MISTAKE! NEVER EVER USE RUBBING ALCOHOL TO CLEAN A PROCESSOR. RUBBING IS DIFFERANT THAT ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL BECAUSE RUBBING ALCOHOL CONTAINS OILS ADDED TO THE ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL TO PROTECT THE SKIN AND THOSE OILS CAN CAUSE DAMAGE TO SENSITIVE ELECRICAL COMPONENTS. INSTEAD YOU SHOULD USE METHYL ETHYL KETONE AKA MEK.

Most people use "rubbing alcohol" as a synonym for "isopropyl alcohol". The standard stuff you buy at the drugstore will be fine. Really. Chill out.

The thing you should be careful with is using "nail polish remover" instead of "acetone". Some "nail polish remover" products add all sorts of crap to the acetone that can leave conductive residue on parts.

 

[farmercal]

I clean mine off using a thin razor blade and acetone.

I agree with Ausm, fingernail polish remover does a great job.

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: Matthias99

Originally posted by: Googer
If you are going to use ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL make sure that you use the 100% stuff and not the 70% kind you get a WAL*MART or the drugstore.

100% Isopropyl Alcohol is tough to find.

Really, the 70% stuff works fine; it just takes longer to dry (it's 30% water). Almost all drugstores will carry 90%, if not 95% or higher (you may have to ask for this; they don't always have it out on the shelves). You might also try a hardware store.

BAD MISTAKE! NEVER EVER USE RUBBING ALCOHOL TO CLEAN A PROCESSOR. RUBBING IS DIFFERANT THAT ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL BECAUSE RUBBING ALCOHOL CONTAINS OILS ADDED TO THE ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL TO PROTECT THE SKIN AND THOSE OILS CAN CAUSE DAMAGE TO SENSITIVE ELECRICAL COMPONENTS. INSTEAD YOU SHOULD USE METHYL ETHYL KETONE AKA MEK.

Most people use "rubbing alcohol" as a synonym for "isopropyl alcohol". The standard stuff you buy at the drugstore will be fine. Really. Chill out.

The thing you should be careful with is using "nail polish remover" instead of "acetone". Some "nail polish remover" products add all sorts of crap to the acetone that can leave conductive residue on parts.

Nail Polish remover is usualy ACETONE.

Neveruse the drugstore kind of alcohol it is differant than this stuff.
http://www.precisionroller.com/find/%2ATech+Aids%2A+S5530+.htm
http://www.coleparmer.com/catalog/product_view.asp?referred_id=778&sku=00029XI
USE Cleanroom or Electronic Grade stuff only

 

[Zepper]

I agree with many above, it sounds more like a PSU problem. You can use the Hardware Monitoring software that came with the mobo to keep an eye on CPU and System temps and even set alarms based on your own range of Hi/Lo settings. DL the latest from the mobo mfr. and install/use it!
. If you need to change the TIM (thermal interface medium) on the CPU and it's a Pad, scrape the remains of the pad off the HS and the CPU with a plastic tool (the plastic knife they give with breakfast at Mickey D's works very well, but an expired or unused credit card will do. Then use lighter fluid (naphtha - Ronson is a brand also Zippo, etc.) to remove the rest. Followed by a rinse with 90% isopropyl or ethanol. Contrary to an earlier poster's comments, you can easily remove old Pads completely. Adhesive TIMs are another story...
. Pads are fine - you can get replacements pads from the OEM for AMD retail heatsinks, http://www.ajigo.com and some other sources. The nice thing about pads is that it's a one time deal. You don't have to worry about having to re-do it sometime down the road as you do with most greases.

.bh.

:moon:

 

[SlitheryDee]

Originally posted by: toattett
From what you have said, it looks more like a PSU problem then a CPU problem.

Yeah, don't be too quick to blame the cpu. Possibly you could just throw another psu in there and be good to go. I had a similar scare when trying to OC. Naturally since I was bumping up the CPU voltage I thought that I had pushed it too far and cooked my CPU. Turned out my el-cheapo Comp USA brand psu crapped out. Unfortunately I bought a new cpu AND mb before dicovering this.

 

[bocamojo]

Originally posted by: Zepper
I agree with many above, it sounds more like a PSU problem. You can use the Hardware Monitoring software that came with the mobo to keep an eye on CPU and System temps and even set alarms based on your own range of Hi/Lo settings. DL the latest from the mobo mfr. and install/use it!
. If you need to change the TIM (thermal interface medium) on the CPU and it's a Pad, scrape the remains of the pad off the HS and the CPU with a plastic tool (the plastic knife they give with breakfast at Mickey D's works very well, but an expired or unused credit card will do. Then use lighter fluid (naphtha - Ronson is a brand also Zippo, etc.) to remove the rest. Followed by a rinse with 90% isopropyl or ethanol. Contrary to an earlier poster's comments, you can easily remove old Pads completely. Adhesive TIMs are another story...
. Pads are fine - you can get replacements pads from the OEM for AMD retail heatsinks, http://www.ajigo.com and some other sources. The nice thing about pads is that it's a one time deal. You don't have to worry about having to re-do it sometime down the road as you do with most greases.

.bh.

:moon:

I never said you couldn't remove the pad completely, but what I said was once the pad had been heated, there is a waxy substance that melts into the pours of the heatsink. I know of no way to completely clean/remove that substance, once it's melted into the heatsink.

 

[Zepper]

Naphtha is a fairly small molecule as hydrocarbons go - smaller than most wax molecules. If a wax can get in the pore then naphtha can get it out - at least enough that it will make no never-mind when it comes to applying the new pad or grease. I think that a lot of this 'pore' nonsense is Arctic Silver marketing bushwa anyway...
. Alcohols are relatively large molecules that's why when you mix alcohols with water, the final volume is LESS than the sum of the two volumes separately. The water molecules fit in the spaces between the alcohol molecules...

.bh.

 

[Matthias99]

Originally posted by: Googer

Originally posted by: Matthias99

Originally posted by: Googer
If you are going to use ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL make sure that you use the 100% stuff and not the 70% kind you get a WAL*MART or the drugstore.

100% Isopropyl Alcohol is tough to find.

Really, the 70% stuff works fine; it just takes longer to dry (it's 30% water). Almost all drugstores will carry 90%, if not 95% or higher (you may have to ask for this; they don't always have it out on the shelves). You might also try a hardware store.

BAD MISTAKE! NEVER EVER USE RUBBING ALCOHOL TO CLEAN A PROCESSOR. RUBBING IS DIFFERANT THAT ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL BECAUSE RUBBING ALCOHOL CONTAINS OILS ADDED TO THE ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL TO PROTECT THE SKIN AND THOSE OILS CAN CAUSE DAMAGE TO SENSITIVE ELECRICAL COMPONENTS. INSTEAD YOU SHOULD USE METHYL ETHYL KETONE AKA MEK.

Most people use "rubbing alcohol" as a synonym for "isopropyl alcohol". The standard stuff you buy at the drugstore will be fine. Really. Chill out.

The thing you should be careful with is using "nail polish remover" instead of "acetone". Some "nail polish remover" products add all sorts of crap to the acetone that can leave conductive residue on parts.

Nail Polish remover is usualy ACETONE.

Sometimes. I've seen plenty of "nail polish remover" products that had ingredients other than just acetone, and some of them could easily be damaging.

In fact, here's acetone-free "nail polish remover". That would definitely not be a good thing to put on your CPU.

Neveruse the drugstore kind of alcohol it is differant than this stuff.
http://www.precisionroller.com/find/%2ATech+Aids%2A+S5530+.htm
http://www.coleparmer.com/catalog/product_view.asp?referred_id=778&sku=00029XI
USE Cleanroom or Electronic Grade stuff only

Isopropyl "rubbing" alcohol

Ingredients: Isopropyl Alcohol (91%), Purified Water

It's the same stuff at a slightly lower concentration, and would be just fine for cleaning computer parts. You may be able to find 95% or 99% isopropyl in a drugstore, but it's less common. They almost always have ~90%, though.

Mineral spirits or naptha may be more useful for cleaning thermal pad residue; I'm not sure. Isopropyl seems to get thermal paste off completely, and either isopropyl or acetone are good for general cleaning.