"Partial Birth' Abortion Ban Sought Again"

[TripperJoe]

This isn't about "killing an innocent baby." I would say the infant is hardly innocent if it's endangering the mother's life. Anyway, the reason Clinton vetoed this bill twice in the past during his terms was because of the wording--which was really just political maneuvering.

The bill doesn't even ban partial birth abortions like you all think. It just mandates an replacement with an alternative method of late-term abortion. So the fetus still dies whether it passes or not. Just because the technique of partial-birth abortions disgusts you, doesn't mean that it's not medically sound. Especially for the SAFETY OF THE MOTHER, which is the overriding concern. So to stay on-topic in the OT forum, I'm only speaking about the ban on partial birth abortions here, which are performed when the life of the mother is considered to be compromised by the fetus. If you think that the mother should die and the fetus should live, you should seriously reconsider your priorities. If you think the procedure is "just plain gross, so we should get rid of it" maybe you should go through 4 years of medical schooling, and then assert your opinions.


To the person who questioned the semantics of pro-choice/anti-choice, and pro-life/anti-life:

Pro-life implies that pro-choice supporters are against the idea of life, which is hardly the case. Thus, anti-choice is a much more accurate description of those opposing abortion rights.

 

[Ornery]

Originally posted by: TripperJoe
This isn't about "killing an innocent baby." I would say the infant is hardly innocent if it's endangering the mother's life...

...So to stay on-topic in the OT forum, I'm only speaking about the ban on partial birth abortions here, which are performed when the life of the mother is considered to be compromised by the fetus. If you think that the mother should die and the fetus should live, you should seriously reconsider your priorities.

Partial-Birth Abortion Ban Act of 2003

• This subsection does not apply to a partial-birth abortion that is necessary to save the life of a mother whose life is endangered by a physical disorder, physical illness, or physical injury, including a life-endangering physical condition caused by or arising from the pregnancy itself.

WTF are you babbling about?:disgust:

 

[jaeger66]

Originally posted by: Ornery
WTF are you babbling about?:disgust:

Shut up and don't come back until you read the entire bill.

 

[Ornery]

Facst just don't seem to agree with you, eh? Sucks to be you!

 

[CPA]

Originally posted by: Gooberlx2

Originally posted by: WinkOsmosis

Originally posted by: Johnnie
this needs to be banned.....killing is wrong.

I agree. Something is wrong with you if fears of the "religious right" cloud your judgement of right and wrong.

Well, it depends on when you feel cognitive life actually begins. I personally don't feel it begins until after birth.

I'm sorry, but there is very little, if any, difference between the actual birth of the baby and the very minute preceding the birth of the baby in it's cognitive abilities. Knowing that, when is it a viable time to abort and when is it not a viable time to abort?

 

[CPA]

Originally posted by: drewshin

...in this situation, it's the life of a child -- one who cannot defend him or herself. There's basically a war on unborn children..some are fighting to protect them, and others are happily killing them. I'm actually suprised how many posters in this thread stood up for the pro-life people..

how can you say happily killing them? i have two friends that have had abortions and it was the toughest decision of their life, but in the end they feel they made the right decision to wait until they are ready to raise a family. actually, both of them now say that they will not have another abortion because of what they went through, but feel that others should also have this choice if they would like.

it seems like most of these obnoxious pro-lifers are guys that have no idea what is going on, except "killing is wrong!" (i can understand women who are against abortion)

yes, do pro-lifers support the death penalty? do they believe in the sanctity of life then, even though a certain percentage of them could be innocent?

So a human life had to be relinquished because your friends couldn't keep their legs shut or they couldn't use proper form of contraceptive?

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: Harvey
The morons who want to stick their noses between a woman and her doctor are great arugments for retroactive abortion. :disgust:

And the moron who wants to stick his nose between me and my slave are great arugments for retroactive abortion.

Fact is Harvey Pro Lifers feel the unborn are fully human and the unborn carried in the wombs of pro-choice women are just as human as those carried in the wombs of pro-life women. Pro-choicers ought to put at least some effort into understanding the pro-life position. If you believed that a class of persons were being murdered by methods that include dismemberment, suffocation, and burning wouldn't you be perplexed if someone tried to ease your outrage by telling you that you didn't have to participate in the murders if you didn't want to?

PHILOSOPHICAL PROBLEMS WITH MORAL RELATIVISM RE: Abortion

 

[CPA]

Originally posted by: OulOat

Originally posted by: Ornery
"You are right, politicians never lie."

"I think it's better for a child to die quickly than to be raised by a mom who didn't want him/her. I dunno, maybe it's just me, but I think love is an important thing."

What an ass. This isn't politicians, it's a coalition of about 300 medical specialists.

Better for a child to die quickly... Oh please, tell me more!

Can you quote more than one source? Maybe from an accredited medical document?

It must make you really happy to know that once you ban abortion, you'll be causing more of these cases

Baby found in dumpster
Crushed baby's body found in dump truck
Dead Infant found in trash
Baby fatally beaten to death
Children found living in filth

Yah, you're right. Ban abortion, it's okay if these kinds of cases increase as long as we ban abortion.

hahaha, that's always the argument of the pro-abortion crowd, yet what you fail to see is that even with the availability of abortion clinics and the law on their side, it still happens.

 

[TripperJoe]

Originally posted by: jaeger66

Originally posted by: Ornery
WTF are you babbling about?:disgust:

Shut up and don't come back until you read the entire bill.

The bill states yes, that partial birth abortions are not prohibited when medically necessary. However, the rest of the bill details how partial birth abortions are NEVER medically necessary. So they must have been performed because physicians enjoyed the procedure? .

I think jaeger just got fed up with you because you extrapolated based on your limited knowledge, and then tried to make others look like the uneducated ones.

So a human life had to be relinquished because your friends couldn't keep their legs shut or they couldn't use proper form of contraceptive?

Don't be so insensitive. Sometimes contraceptives fail. And how many women do you know use contraceptives to prevent pregnancy during rape? Incidentally, contraceptive education is being flushed down the toilet (no pun intended) by the current administration. I can't begin to tell you how bad this will make the situation.

Personally, I'd be much happier if no one ever got abortions because no one ever wanted/needed one. But that doesn't seem to be the case, now does it?

 

[Ornery]

Originally posted by: TripperJoe

Originally posted by: jaeger66

Originally posted by: Ornery
WTF are you babbling about?:disgust:

Shut up and don't come back until you read the entire bill.

The bill states yes, that partial birth abortions are not prohibited when medically necessary. However, the rest of the bill details how partial birth abortions are NEVER medically necessary. So they must have been performed because physicians enjoyed the procedure? .

I think jaeger just got fed up with you because you extrapolated based on your limited knowledge, and then tried to make others look like the uneducated ones.

So a human life had to be relinquished because your friends couldn't keep their legs shut or they couldn't use proper form of contraceptive?

Don't be so insensitive. Sometimes contraceptives fail. And how many women do you know use contraceptives to prevent pregnancy during rape? Incidentally, contraceptive education is being flushed down the toilet (no pun intended) by the current administration. I can't begin to tell you how bad this will make the situation.

Personally, I'd be much happier if no one ever got abortions because no one ever wanted/needed one. But that doesn't seem to be the case, now does it?

Here's the Partial Birth Abortion Ban For Dummies version:

Senate OKs partial birth abortion ban
By DAVID ESPO, The Associated Press, Thursday, March 13, 2003; 10:55 AM

• The legislation includes an exemption in cases in which the procedure is necessary to save the life of the mother.

Here's the full text:

`Partial-Birth Abortion Ban Act of 2003'

• This subsection does not apply to a partial-birth abortion that is necessary to save the life of a mother whose life is endangered by a physical disorder, physical illness, or physical injury, including a life-endangering physical condition caused by or arising from the pregnancy itself.

Take your pick!

 

[TripperJoe]

Ok, I think you just don't want to listen at this point, so I'll stop wasting my time. Obviously either you're being obtuse or just disagreeable for the sake of irritating others, neither of which I appreciate.

 

[Ornery]

I posted links with no opinion attached what-so-ever... Facts suck, eh?

Originally posted by: TripperJoe
This isn't about "killing an innocent baby." I would say the infant is hardly innocent if it's endangering the mother's life...

...So to stay on-topic in the OT forum, I'm only speaking about the ban on partial birth abortions here, which are performed when the life of the mother is considered to be compromised by the fetus. If you think that the mother should die and the fetus should live, you should seriously reconsider your priorities.

That retarded gum flapping actually didn't deserve a reply in the first place. Who said they thought the mother should die and fetus live? Where in the bill does it say that? Link? Text? Anything? You've got some fvcking nerve, sh|t for brains! :|