PARENTS: I need advice from you *EDIT - the man sets the record straight!*t)

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: Stark

I have a lot to lose should something go awry.

what, exactly, do you have to lose? Weren't you just compaining about your love life? Is this kid's mom one of the women you told you would marry before you dumped her to raise a child alone? Did you get the ring back at least?

I don't know you, but you sound a lot like my dad. He thought he was a great guy for giving my mom $300 bucks a month when the court mandated child support was closer to $800... but he had to have a nice car, apt. and girlfriends. The DA wasn't good at enforcing payments back then, so my mom busted her butt to raise my brother and I. She's still pissed at him, and I don't blame her.

In my dad's mind, he always comes first. Everything in his life revolves around him getting what he wants.

The last time I saw my dad was in the emergency room at County-USC hospital in downtown LA after he fell down a flight of stairs in a drunken stupor and somehow severed an artery with the beer bottle he was carrying. It really sucks to have a loser for a father... so I can relate to what your kid is going through.

and just like everything was about your dad, it still is, isn't it?

 

[OrByte]

Stark, perhaps you should consider seeing a doctor too, seriously you have some bitter feelings about your dad that need to be expressed to a professional. I am only trying to be helpful, I get a bad vibe from you!

MikeD you have always seemed like a reasonable person. Just ask for permission first, ask the doctor, and dont ask in front of your ex, that might set her off.

and don't give into her baiting. Good luck.

 

[Stark]

You Stark may have had a looser for a father, that doesn't mean that Michael is a looser and if you don't think he is, how can you relate to his kids?

I base my view on Mike's statements regarding his relationships with other human beings in previous threads. For example:

Not to brag, but I've got more notches in my belt than some of you have years on this earth. Really. But those are just "notches." However, out of the four women I've lived with, and the two engagement rings I purchased ( I even got one back! ) I just can't seem to "make it work" with anyone. I dont' know why.

and

Now, I suffer for my indifference...forever stranded in the single life. Unless I want to "settle" and marry a moo-moo-cow.

Now Mr. Self-Proclaimed Super Stud with the fat lazy girlfriend is forced to deal with one of the women he screwed and dumped and is worried about one thing: himself. Until he gets over himself and truly learns to put other people ahead of his own desires and wants, he will only find the emptiness and longing for intimacy he describes in his posts.

BTW,
I have a loser dad, but I've also had male friends with severly screwed up ex's who try to do what's best for their children. From everything Mike reveals about himself, I'm not inclined to think he's a "victim" in anything that happens in his life. Rather, I think he's only experiencing the age old phenomenon of "you reap what you sow."

 

[gopunk]

Now Mr. Super Stud is forced to deal with one of the women he screwed and dumped and is worried about one thing: himself.

if you read his other threads, he does exhibit significant concern for the welfare of his child. and stop making the woman out to be such a victim. it's not like he raped her, it takes two to tango.

I have a loser dad, but I've also had male friends with severly screwed up ex's who try to do what's best for their children. From everything Mike reveals about himself, I'm not inclined to think he's a "victim" in anything that happens in his life. Rather, I think he's only experiencing the age old phenomenon of "you reap what you sew."

i'm not seeing how he puts himself over his child. all you've pointed out is that he has a bunch of sexual exploits.

 

[notfred]

No offense, but Ialways find it hard to believe one parent in a situation like this. I've been around plenty of people w/ divorced parents. Usually the parents seem to act like you. They hate the other one, wish they would give up the kid and go away. Both parents ALWAYS think they're 100% right, when usually it's more like a 60/40 split. One parent is usually closer to the truth, but the blame has always, in every case I've seen, fallen partially on both parents. I'm sure you don't like this woman, and I'm sure she doesn't like you. You're going to prepare yourself to be assulted with all the evil lies you think this woman has told about you. You should be reasy to admit that at least SOME of them are probably true. She may very well be far worse than you, but I'm sure you've done something that caused her anger towards you, and some of that anger is most likely justified, just like yours is.


That being the case, I don't see any advantage to bringing a tape recorder. Who do you plan to play the tape back to later? Her? that'll jsut cause an argument? Your son? I'm sure he's heard his parents argue enoguh already. The doctor? If you determine that you actually have to try and defend yourself from him, you probably won't want to see him again anyway. A court? The doctor wouldn't be able to testify as to what you said anyway.


I really don't think that a recording is going to do you any good without someone to paly it back to. Anyway, if you think she's going to make up lies about what you said in therapy, then she might as well make up another lie and say "he just didn't record that part of the conversation!"

Tape recordings are usually used to prove that someone said something. So, what are you expecting someone to say that you'll need to prove to someone else?

 

[Stark]

if you read his other threads, he does exhibit significant concern for the welfare of his child. and stop making the woman out to be such a victim. it's not like he raped her, it takes two to tango.

If she's such a horrible person and he's a noble victim in all this, why doesn't he fight for custody, as has been suggested already in this thread?

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: Stark

if you read his other threads, he does exhibit significant concern for the welfare of his child. and stop making the woman out to be such a victim. it's not like he raped her, it takes two to tango.

If she's such a horrible person and he's a noble victim in all this, why doesn't he fight for custody, as has been suggested already in this thread?

i obviously can't speak for him, but it was my impression from his other threads that he thinks it's a lost cause. the courts do favor women a lot.

 

[iamme]

Don't use one of those digital voice recorders. They suck. MiniDisc players make awesome live recordings. (as hinted above)

Sorry, you may continue now.

 

[Stark]

there are several good organizations that help fathers fight for custody. How much do you want to bet he has never contacted any of them?

Them foxy ladies don't like no brat kids hangin' round.

 

[kami]

I am not sure what you are so worried about MichaelD...in all honesty forget about yourself for a moment and realize this is to help your kid. She may be a super-mega-bitch to you, but she's also the one raising your kid. Maybe he has behavioral problems because of her, and maybe he doesn't. If he does, it could be because raising a kid by yourself can be tough.

Do you really think a DOCTOR would be in for a plot to get you somehow? What exactly would they accomplish? Are you worried she might try to get more child support or something? What's the big deal here, honestly?

 

[iamme]

Yeah, I'm a bit confused on how your meeting w/ this doctor could screw you somehow....

Are you afraid that it will turn into an analysis of what a "bad father" you are (according to 1-sided views from your wife)? If so, how would recording it help?

Just wanted to understand better...

 

[Sust]

I think Jzero was right about the recording stuff.
If I remember correctly, you cannot record a conversation with someone else unless there is verbal consent from all parties present.
I think everyone has to recite their names and state on the tape that they understand that everything they say will be recorded.
I remember a lawyer friend of mine telling me about this because I wanted to see the names and faces of the places Dateline was going around and busting up with their hidden cameras.
Her response was that Dateline had to blip out names and faces because they did not agree to be recorded.
Something about individual rights or privacy?
You probably would not benefit from recording your conversation since he'll probably want to talk about you only, but if it makes you feel better to do so then by all means ask the shrink first.

As for the psychiatrist/psychologist/therapist/whatever, if he/she is truly devoted to the most important thing(your child) then he/she will dig up all the facts before making any recommendations. It's very unprofessional for a mental health worker to insult you and/or co-conspire with your ex to keep you away from your son if you have truly been a decent father.
Just bear in mind that some of the things the shrink might ask could be upsetting and/or offensive but they are not meant to be personal.
Try to remain calm(which you will be since you say that you have done nothing wrong) through it all.
Remember who is the REAL victim here and whose future is truly at risk if things go horribly wrong.


Good luck.

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: gopunk
Now Mr. Super Stud is forced to deal with one of the women he screwed and dumped and is worried about one thing: himself.

if you read his other threads, he does exhibit significant concern for the welfare of his child. and stop making the woman out to be such a victim. it's not like he raped her, it takes two to tango.

I have a loser dad, but I've also had male friends with severly screwed up ex's who try to do what's best for their children. From everything Mike reveals about himself, I'm not inclined to think he's a "victim" in anything that happens in his life. Rather, I think he's only experiencing the age old phenomenon of "you reap what you sew."

i'm not seeing how he puts himself over his child. all you've pointed out is that he has a bunch of sexual exploits.

Sorry, but in my opinion "significant concern for the welfare of the child" involves creating a stable, healthy environment for the child. MichaelD choose as the mother of his child a woman he describes as "the most evil person Satan ever accidently left behind" - among other things. Charming. No freakin' wonder the kid has emotional problems.
I'm with Stark on this one.

 

[SnapIT]

Originally posted by: Stark

You Stark may have had a looser for a father, that doesn't mean that Michael is a looser and if you don't think he is, how can you relate to his kids?

I base my view on Mike's statements regarding his relationships with other human beings in previous threads. For example:

Not to brag, but I've got more notches in my belt than some of you have years on this earth. Really. But those are just "notches." However, out of the four women I've lived with, and the two engagement rings I purchased ( I even got one back! ) I just can't seem to "make it work" with anyone. I dont' know why.

and

Now, I suffer for my indifference...forever stranded in the single life. Unless I want to "settle" and marry a moo-moo-cow.

Now Mr. Self-Proclaimed Super Stud with the fat lazy girlfriend is forced to deal with one of the women he screwed and dumped and is worried about one thing: himself. Until he gets over himself and truly learns to put other people ahead of his own desires and wants, he will only find the emptiness and longing for intimacy he describes in his posts.

BTW,
I have a loser dad, but I've also had male friends with severly screwed up ex's who try to do what's best for their children. From everything Mike reveals about himself, I'm not inclined to think he's a "victim" in anything that happens in his life. Rather, I think he's only experiencing the age old phenomenon of "you reap what you sow."

And this has NOTHING to do with him as a father... you are telling him that he is a bad father and you DON'T EVEN KNOW HIM!

 

[SnapIT]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: gopunk
Now Mr. Super Stud is forced to deal with one of the women he screwed and dumped and is worried about one thing: himself.

if you read his other threads, he does exhibit significant concern for the welfare of his child. and stop making the woman out to be such a victim. it's not like he raped her, it takes two to tango.

I have a loser dad, but I've also had male friends with severly screwed up ex's who try to do what's best for their children. From everything Mike reveals about himself, I'm not inclined to think he's a "victim" in anything that happens in his life. Rather, I think he's only experiencing the age old phenomenon of "you reap what you sew."

i'm not seeing how he puts himself over his child. all you've pointed out is that he has a bunch of sexual exploits.

Sorry, but in my opinion "significant concern for the welfare of the child" involves creating a stable, healthy environment for the child. MichaelD choose as the mother of his child a woman he describes as "the most evil person Satan ever accidently left behind" - among other things. Charming. No freakin' wonder the kid has emotional problems.
I'm with Stark on this one.

Yeah, because it CAN NEVER BE the mothers fault, now can it... the woman HE chose???? what about the man she chose???? if you go by your standards she is unfit to be a mother, now isn't she?

I would describe my ex wife, the mother of my children in the same way, i got custody... what does that tell you, that the justice system is screwed???

Get a fscking clue!

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: gopunk
Now Mr. Super Stud is forced to deal with one of the women he screwed and dumped and is worried about one thing: himself.

if you read his other threads, he does exhibit significant concern for the welfare of his child. and stop making the woman out to be such a victim. it's not like he raped her, it takes two to tango.

I have a loser dad, but I've also had male friends with severly screwed up ex's who try to do what's best for their children. From everything Mike reveals about himself, I'm not inclined to think he's a "victim" in anything that happens in his life. Rather, I think he's only experiencing the age old phenomenon of "you reap what you sew."

i'm not seeing how he puts himself over his child. all you've pointed out is that he has a bunch of sexual exploits.

Sorry, but in my opinion "significant concern for the welfare of the child" involves creating a stable, healthy environment for the child. MichaelD choose as the mother of his child a woman he describes as "the most evil person Satan ever accidently left behind" - among other things. Charming. No freakin' wonder the kid has emotional problems.
I'm with Stark on this one.

choose? i'm sure if he had the choice, he'd choose someone else.

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: gopunk
Now Mr. Super Stud is forced to deal with one of the women he screwed and dumped and is worried about one thing: himself.

if you read his other threads, he does exhibit significant concern for the welfare of his child. and stop making the woman out to be such a victim. it's not like he raped her, it takes two to tango.

I have a loser dad, but I've also had male friends with severly screwed up ex's who try to do what's best for their children. From everything Mike reveals about himself, I'm not inclined to think he's a "victim" in anything that happens in his life. Rather, I think he's only experiencing the age old phenomenon of "you reap what you sew."

i'm not seeing how he puts himself over his child. all you've pointed out is that he has a bunch of sexual exploits.

Sorry, but in my opinion "significant concern for the welfare of the child" involves creating a stable, healthy environment for the child. MichaelD choose as the mother of his child a woman he describes as "the most evil person Satan ever accidently left behind" - among other things. Charming. No freakin' wonder the kid has emotional problems.
I'm with Stark on this one.

choose? i'm sure if he had the choice, he'd choose someone else.

Of course he had a choice - was he raped?

 

[Stallion]

I would have to say no. It might put a dampner on what might happen if the Dr. and your son knew you had a recorder. This just might be the visit where your son breaks through his problems and if he knew it was being recorded he might back away.. IMHO

 

[Stark]

And this has NOTHING to do with him as a father... you are telling him that he is a bad father and you DON'T EVEN KNOW HIM!

No, I don't, and never claimed to, but let's go over his post:

1. I see my son every other week
not a good start, but sometimes that's all that's possible in some cases
2. We have happy, productive visits that we both look forward to.
ok, let's look for evidence of this "productive" bonding time.
3. For the past year, his mom has been taking him to a child psychologist every other week. He had very bad behaviorial problems in kindergarten and was kind of out of control sometimes. He is not on drugs and they have no intention of putting him on any. He has gotten a LOT better and is doing well. He's a happy kid and it shows during my visits with him. I have never asked him about his doctor visits and he's never volunteered any info. So, I leave well enough, alone.
ya, that's father of the year material there, boy. the kid goes to a therapist because of his behavioral problems and Mike's never even asked about it. What a caring and concerned pop. And I'm the one with my head in the sand?

I would describe my ex wife, the mother of my children in the same way, i got custody... what does that tell you, that the justice system is screwed???

But there's the difference... if she's satan, she wouldn't have the kid.

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: gopunk
Now Mr. Super Stud is forced to deal with one of the women he screwed and dumped and is worried about one thing: himself.

if you read his other threads, he does exhibit significant concern for the welfare of his child. and stop making the woman out to be such a victim. it's not like he raped her, it takes two to tango.

I have a loser dad, but I've also had male friends with severly screwed up ex's who try to do what's best for their children. From everything Mike reveals about himself, I'm not inclined to think he's a "victim" in anything that happens in his life. Rather, I think he's only experiencing the age old phenomenon of "you reap what you sew."

i'm not seeing how he puts himself over his child. all you've pointed out is that he has a bunch of sexual exploits.

Sorry, but in my opinion "significant concern for the welfare of the child" involves creating a stable, healthy environment for the child. MichaelD choose as the mother of his child a woman he describes as "the most evil person Satan ever accidently left behind" - among other things. Charming. No freakin' wonder the kid has emotional problems.
I'm with Stark on this one.

choose? i'm sure if he had the choice, he'd choose someone else.

Of course he had a choice - was he raped?

no, i'm sorry having sex with somebody is not necessarily the same as choosing to have that person be the mother of your child. it's not apparent to me that michaeld ever planned on having this child.

 

[stev0]

Crap someplace else.

i'm no parent, but i would say yes, just incase.

stark, stuff it, no one cares.

 

[SnapIT]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: gopunk
Now Mr. Super Stud is forced to deal with one of the women he screwed and dumped and is worried about one thing: himself.

if you read his other threads, he does exhibit significant concern for the welfare of his child. and stop making the woman out to be such a victim. it's not like he raped her, it takes two to tango.

I have a loser dad, but I've also had male friends with severly screwed up ex's who try to do what's best for their children. From everything Mike reveals about himself, I'm not inclined to think he's a "victim" in anything that happens in his life. Rather, I think he's only experiencing the age old phenomenon of "you reap what you sew."

i'm not seeing how he puts himself over his child. all you've pointed out is that he has a bunch of sexual exploits.

Sorry, but in my opinion "significant concern for the welfare of the child" involves creating a stable, healthy environment for the child. MichaelD choose as the mother of his child a woman he describes as "the most evil person Satan ever accidently left behind" - among other things. Charming. No freakin' wonder the kid has emotional problems.
I'm with Stark on this one.

choose? i'm sure if he had the choice, he'd choose someone else.

Of course he had a choice - was he raped?

Did she have a choice? was she raped? is she unfit? if not, then why do you take her side without KNOWING ANYTHING ABOUT HIM?

I am glad that you have no say in things like these...

 

[SnapIT]

Originally posted by: Stark

And this has NOTHING to do with him as a father... you are telling him that he is a bad father and you DON'T EVEN KNOW HIM!

No, I don't, and never claimed to, but let's go over his post:

1. I see my son every other week
not a good start, but sometimes that's all that's possible in some cases
2. We have happy, productive visits that we both look forward to.
ok, let's look for evidence of this "productive" bonding time.
3. For the past year, his mom has been taking him to a child psychologist every other week. He had very bad behaviorial problems in kindergarten and was kind of out of control sometimes. He is not on drugs and they have no intention of putting him on any. He has gotten a LOT better and is doing well. He's a happy kid and it shows during my visits with him. I have never asked him about his doctor visits and he's never volunteered any info. So, I leave well enough, alone.
ya, that's father of the year material there, boy. the kid goes to a therapist because of his behavioral problems and Mike's never even asked about it. What a caring and concerned pop. And I'm the one with my head in the sand?

I would describe my ex wife, the mother of my children in the same way, i got custody... what does that tell you, that the justice system is screwed???

But there's the difference... if she's satan, she wouldn't have the kid.

However, what you describe isn't always as easy as you think, as a father without custody, can you get out of work to see your kid? even if it is such a meeting? do you even know that? was he asked, did he even know about it? you don't know, now do you...

Unfortunantly, even when the father is the most fit parent, the mother usually get's custody... it is just the way it is, i had to fight a long hard fight... and it could have gone either way...

 

[PlatinumGold]

I hope you take my post for what it is michael because i don't know you from a hole in the ground. all i know about you is what i've seen posted here.

Got news for you, Oh Ostrich With Head Underground; those that don't cover there own ass wind up burying their own ass.

hmm. I know the past it the past, but has it occured to you that this mentality exactly is the reason ur sons mother and you hate each other so much? also, i'm not sure if you mentioned this anywhere, but was there ever a serious relationship between you and your sons mother?

her hate for you is probably her way of covering her own ass and soo the trap tightens.

it's like the prisoners dilemna, both you and ur sons mother would be better off if you didn't see each other but because if one of you plays the patsy you feel like the bigger loser, you both play defensive, unfortunately, this isn't the prisoners dilemna and the real losers aren't you and ur sons mother, the real loser is your son.

I realize you love your son and ur trying ur best for him, but you have to admit that the quality of ur relationship with his mother does affect him.

For your sons sake, i hope that you and ur sons mother can come to a better relationship.

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: gopunk
Now Mr. Super Stud is forced to deal with one of the women he screwed and dumped and is worried about one thing: himself.

if you read his other threads, he does exhibit significant concern for the welfare of his child. and stop making the woman out to be such a victim. it's not like he raped her, it takes two to tango.

I have a loser dad, but I've also had male friends with severly screwed up ex's who try to do what's best for their children. From everything Mike reveals about himself, I'm not inclined to think he's a "victim" in anything that happens in his life. Rather, I think he's only experiencing the age old phenomenon of "you reap what you sew."

i'm not seeing how he puts himself over his child. all you've pointed out is that he has a bunch of sexual exploits.

Sorry, but in my opinion "significant concern for the welfare of the child" involves creating a stable, healthy environment for the child. MichaelD choose as the mother of his child a woman he describes as "the most evil person Satan ever accidently left behind" - among other things. Charming. No freakin' wonder the kid has emotional problems.
I'm with Stark on this one.

choose? i'm sure if he had the choice, he'd choose someone else.

Of course he had a choice - was he raped?

no, i'm sorry having sex with somebody is not necessarily the same as choosing to have that person be the mother of your child. it's not apparent to me that michaeld ever planned on having this child.

Which is why some children get raised in caring, loving homes, and some get raised in the crossfire of custody battles and mutual hatred. I just feel bad for the kids. Anyway, whether he planned to have the child or not, he willfully engaged in an activity from which a child reasonably might (and did in fact) arise, so he, and the mother, are the responsible parties. Just because the child wasn't 'planned' is no excuse - a child was a reasonably foreseeable outcome.