Palestinians criticize Hamas Rulers.....

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Maxima1

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2013
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Since 2001, only about 30 people in Israel have been killed by rockets and mortars. Once Israel did their recent offensive, they lost more soldiers than all those past rocket and mortar fatalities. And for every Hamas terrorist killed, there's ten right there to take their spot. Israel puts too little value on the Palestinian lives. But it's nothing surprising. The Likud party doesn't want a two state solution. It's basically an occupation with a blockade, so the resistance isn't surprising either.
 
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Borealis7

Platinum Member
Oct 19, 2006
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Since 2001, only about 30 people in Israel have been killed by rockets and mortars.
that is a very simplistic way to look at it. and people regularly tend to belittle the threat Hamas poses to Israel. if i start firing a gun at you, but miss a lot and only rarely hit you, every day for the rest of your life will you be ok with that?

what you've written here is that for 13 years, Hamas is firing rockets and mortars at civilians (also known as Committing a War Crime) on an almost daily basis. just because they can't aim does not mean hundreds of thousands of people living in 30 mile radius from Gaza are not terrorized by the rockets and must run to shelter every time there is an alarm.
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
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Originally Posted by JEDIYoda
Let me know when Palestine can defend its people against attacks......until then you are secretly calling for the extermination of the people of Palestine!!

Does it work that way too?
actually it originally read -- Let me know when Israel can defend its people against attacks......until then you are secretly calling for the extermination of the people of Israel!

I cannot do anything about the actions of Hamas against the people who elected Hamas to govern....

Seems like you also believe that Israel should not be able to defend it`s populace against the missile attacks by Hamas......

Isreal is not the one attacking the Palestinian people.......
Hamas is attacking Israel and using the Palestinians people as a pawn in this whole thing!
They dig tunnels under the Palestinain peoples homes and hospitals and schools!

They fire those missiles from Palestinian homes.......
They store munitions and missiles in those tunnels and hospitals and schools......

Then to top that off Hamas uses the killed Palestinians, especially the children as a public relations coup...

Hamas doesn`t care if they kill Israeli citizens...but they don`t care if Palestinian civilians die...for Hamas until recently having Palestinians die has been a huge public relations coup for Hamas!! To Hamas that is a win, win!!

It has been said that Israel is using a missile defense system to protect its citizens and Hamas is using it`s citizens to protect it`s missiles!
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
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JediYoda, just stop. This relentless schilling is getting really tiresome. If you aren't being paid to do this then you should be.

On the off-chance you aren't being paid and want to engage honestly with people, the first thing you should do is stop telling people who oppose Israel's recent actions that they are for Israel's extermination. It's really immature.
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
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JediYoda, just stop. This relentless schilling is getting really tiresome. If you aren't being paid to do this then you should be.

On the off-chance you aren't being paid and want to engage honestly with people, the first thing you should do is stop telling people who oppose Israel's recent actions that they are for Israel's extermination. It's really immature.
I am sorry but Whiskey started that.......and as long as Whiskey keeps posting his fodder I will continue to turn the tables....

Then WelshBloke does the same crap......when he knows full well that Hamas is the government of the Palestinian people and as such is responsible for the well being of the Palestinians.......

again -- I will say this one more time -- If Hamas would stop the missiles, Israel would stop the retaliation!

Yet -- Hamas has already stated that they will fight on, even if Israel stop the retaliation....hmmmm


Paid to do this where were you several years ago when Lemon Law and I went at it?

But you are correct...most people on these forums know and understand that this is a complex issue and there are 2 sides that very well both of them have merits....

My contention has always been that if Hamas would stop attacking Israel and take care of the Palestinians as in infrastructure and other things that Hamas would have backed Israel into a corner and would have helped towards legitimizing Hamas on the stage of world opinion!
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
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Then WelshBloke does the same crap......when he knows full well that Hamas is the government of the Palestinian people and as such is responsible for the well being of the Palestinians.......

again -- I will say this one more time -- If Hamas would stop the missiles, Israel would stop the retaliation!


Really? Israel would stop the blockade, stop the settlers from taking Palestinian land and stop jailing and killing Palestinians?

Because the record of Palestinians killed by Israel doesn't really gel with that. If anything the pattern of Israeli aggression against Palestinian civilians matches up better to when there's an Israeli election coming up.
 

cabri

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2012
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One also needs to ask why the blockade was installed on Gaza when talking in the context of Israel relaxing the blockage.
And why are Palestinians being jailed? What are the charges?
Why are Palestinians (Gaza/West Bank/elsewhere?) being killed?

In the real world, actions have consequences.

To repair damages, cleanup has to be done and a rebuilding process must be initiated.
Without cleaning the foundation, what gets rebuilt becomes suspect.
 

DominionSeraph

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
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On the off-chance you aren't being paid and want to engage honestly with people, the first thing you should do is stop telling people who oppose Israel's recent actions that they are for Israel's extermination. It's really immature.

The shilling here is for the Palestinians. You grant no valid response to their aggressive actions. You think that if the Israelis were just passive enough that the Palestinians would suddenly have no reason to fight and thus lay down their arms and everyone would live in peace. You fail to notice that the Palestinians call for the extermination of the Jews and capture of all Israel, and that they have been fighting for this from the start.

You believe that the world is a nice place and that there's no way the Palestinians could possibly have wishes that would override the rights of the defenseless?


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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
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The shilling here is for the Palestinians. You grant no valid response to their aggressive actions. You think that if the Israelis were just passive enough that the Palestinians would suddenly have no reason to fight and thus lay down their arms and everyone would live in peace. You fail to notice that the Palestinians call for the extermination of the Jews and capture of all Israel, and that they have been fighting for this from the start.

You believe that the world is a nice place and that no one could possibly have wishes that would override the rights of the defenseless?

I "fail to notice" none of that, I just apply reason and intellect to the issue, something that you're not able to do. You're pulling the same shit you did before; because you can't argue against what I actually said, you furiously pile up straw men and Nazi references because you don't have an actual argument.

These are big, complex issues. I don't think you're equipped mentally to handle them.
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
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You fail to notice that the Palestinians call for the extermination of the Jews and capture of all Israel,

Much as that keeps getting stated, it's the Palestinian land that keeps getting whittled away by Israel and the rights and lives of Palestinians that keep getting curtailed by Israel.
 

DominionSeraph

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
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I "fail to notice" none of that.

You posit nothing that addresses it.
The Palestinians' situation is the result of their aggression. The Israelis dismantling their defenses does nothing but open themselves up to attack, as the Palestinians have not given up on any of the reasons they hold to attack Israel.

There can be no peace until the Palestinians give up on being the next Hitler.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
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You posit nothing that addresses it.
The Palestinians' situation is the result of their aggression. The Israelis dismantling their defenses does nothing but open themselves up to attack, as the Palestinians have not given up on any of the reasons they hold to attack Israel.

There can be no peace until the Palestinians give up on being the next Hitler.

And there can be no rational discussion until stupid people stop calling the Palestinians the next Hitler. Grow up.
 

Exophase

Diamond Member
Apr 19, 2012
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Really? Israel would stop the blockade, stop the settlers from taking Palestinian land and stop jailing and killing Palestinians?

Why do you think Israel has the blockade up? They didn't put it there the day they withdrew from Gaza, they put it there as retaliation to sustained rocket strikes. Maintaining the blockade is not free and it doesn't help Israel by itself. It's only there to try to prevent the region from getting supplies to make rockets and other weapons to launch at Israel. If Israel could somehow know for sure they wouldn't be attacked anymore I think they would drop the blockade and siege.

That said, I think the blockade was and is a big mistake on Israel's part. It did bring down the number of attacks for a while, but now the rocket attacks are higher than ever. And it caused Hamas to use supplies that could have went to buildings on tunnels instead. And it makes the people who are cut off more dependent on aid from Hamas and jobs with Hamas. So I don't really see how it's practical, even ignoring the great humanitarian problems and the negative effect it has on world relations.

Unfortunately, both Israel and Hamas are committed to a strategy of getting the other side to back down by attacking and punishing them.
 

DominionSeraph

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
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That said, I think the blockade was and is a big mistake on Israel's part. It did bring down the number of attacks for a while, but now the rocket attacks are higher than ever.

And what makes you think that Hamas being able to freely import weapons to use against Israel would have them not importing weapons to use against Israel, when they import weapons to use against Israel every chance they get?

Without the blockade Hamas would have far more to launch, and they need no more reason to launch than, "Israel exists."

Unfortunately, both Israel and Hamas are committed to a strategy of getting the other side to back down by attacking and punishing them.

The difference is that Hamas wants the Jews to back down from their lives. If a Jew will not lay down and die, that's enough reason for Hamas to try to kill him. There is no accepting that from the victim's side if you want to live out your life, thus the Israeli response.
The Israelis cannot stop until the Palestinian supremacists give up on being the next Hitler, and "getting the other side to back down by attacking and punishing them," has been proven to eventually be successful for that exact situation if enough force is employed.

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Exophase

Diamond Member
Apr 19, 2012
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And what makes you think that Hamas being able to freely import weapons to use against Israel would have them not importing weapons to use against Israel, when they import weapons to use against Israel every chance they get?

Without the blockade Hamas would have far more to launch, and they need no more reason to launch than, "Israel exists."

Then why exactly has Hamas launched more rockets in 2014 (which is only 2/3rds over!) than any previous year, despite being at its weakest having lost connections in Egypt and Iran?

In the couple years between when Israel withdrew from Gaza and the blockade was placed rocket launches were a lot lower than they are now.
 

DominionSeraph

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
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Then why exactly has Hamas launched more rockets in 2014 (which is only 2/3rds over!) than any previous year, despite being at its weakest having lost connections in Egypt and Iran?

Not firing every bullet and throwing every grenade at Israel the moment it comes into their hands doesn't mean that they are only responding to rational provocation when they do decide to attack. They've been stockpiling and figured the murder of three Jewish teenagers was enough of the raising of the Hamas flag to trigger the continuation of their war.
 

DominionSeraph

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
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60 years of giving up the idea of Aryan supremacy:
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60 years of holding on to the idea of Palestinian supremacy:
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JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
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The difference is that Hamas wants the Jews to back down from their lives. If a Jew will not lay down and die, that's enough reason for Hamas to try to kill him. There is no accepting that from the victim's side if you want to live out your life, thus the Israeli response.
The Israelis cannot stop until the Palestinian supremacists give up on being the next Hitler, and "getting the other side to back down by attacking and punishing them," has been proven to eventually be successful for that exact situation if enough force is employed.
<-- the sort version -- Israel needs to keep punching the Palestinian supremacist in the face until it hurts!!
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
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And there can be no rational discussion until stupid people stop calling the Palestinians the next Hitler. Grow up.
And there can be no rational discussion until stupid people stop comparing Israel to the Nazi`s!! Grow up.
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
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Really? Israel would stop the blockade, stop the settlers from taking Palestinian land and stop jailing and killing Palestinians? <-- I contend if there was no Hamas there would be no need for a blockade....you have to remember that even Egypt has a blockade in place...for the exact same reasons Israel does!!

Because the record of Palestinians killed by Israel doesn't really gel with that. <--


it doesn`t matter if the record gels or not...you need to remember that the Palestinian people allowed Hamas to dig tunnels under their homes and schools and hospitals! The Palestinian people also allowed Hamas to use their homes. hospitals and schools to fire missiles and to hide munitions and missiles.....

There are some people who would say that the Palestinian people are hardly innocent bystanders...




If anything the pattern of Israeli aggression against Palestinian civilians matches up better to when there's an Israeli election coming up. <-- your opinion which you are entitled too!
:)
 

Exophase

Diamond Member
Apr 19, 2012
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Not firing every bullet and throwing every grenade at Israel the moment it comes into their hands doesn't mean that they are only responding to rational provocation when they do decide to attack. They've been stockpiling and figured the murder of three Jewish teenagers was enough of the raising of the Hamas flag to trigger the continuation of their war.

Or perhaps the huge spike in rocket launches in 2014 had more to do with how Israel retaliated to the three dead teenagers than raising the flag around the murder...
 

blankslate

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2008
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The schilling in this thread is for the fucks in the area who want to continue the violence.

the last time there seemed to be real progress toward a peaceful settlement a state leader was assassinated by a traitor to his country and the person on the other side probably lost his nerve after all he might be assassinated too.

...