Pakistani doctor faces treason charges after bin Laden raid

[Doppel]

Americans can go fuck themselves. I won't feel sorry if there is another 9/11. I know some Americans rejoice at every Pakistani that dies. I won't do the same, but I really don't value American life.

I just want you to know that I laughed when I read this. I chortled. And I think you would do the same, please let's be honest.

I've never met an American who rejoices when a Pakistani dies but I bet you've met a Pakistani who rejoices when an American does. The essential level of social ineptness, poor education, adherence to an injurious religion, is why on a societal level Pakistan is such a mess of a country. And it's why America has better weapons. It has air craft carriers and remote control planes with rockets and space ships and Pakistan has sloppy-seconds it had to buy from other countries with real industries that are capable of more than cobbling together knock-off AK-47s. If Pakistan was given these great weapons it would just kill itself with them, like a crack head given money. He'll continue to abuse himself.

Look, a list of Pakistan inventions, its great contribution to computing--and this is almost just too good to be true--was one of the first computer viruses: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Pakistani_inventions_and_discoveries

 

[Rebel44]

Americans can go fuck themselves. I won't feel sorry if there is another 9/11. I know some Americans rejoice at every Pakistani that dies. I won't do the same, but I really don't value American life.

And I wont feel sorry if/when USA take away Pakistani nukes and destroy facilities used to build them.

I also wouldnt mind if someone turned Pakistani border area with Afghanistan into large glass parking lot.

 

[VI3L]

Del

 

[randomrogue]

Pakistan is a very sad place. When you cross the border from India nothing really changes except the religion. Yet they are struggling immensely with much more than India. You have to wonder what a Pakistani thinks when they realize that they came from the same people but India has made something of itself while Allah just keeps shitting on Pakistan's head with natural disasters, political problems, and no progress. Where I live we have huge campaigns that are trying to help the Pakistanis out after this latest flood and I wonder how much money is sent their way and if it gets to the places it needs to be. Then of course you have the political problems and the rhetorical question "What if Pakistan had not allowed OBL into Pakistan in the first place?" I'm not saying they escorted him from Afghanistan to Pakistan but anyone who has been to that part of the world knows that when someone lives in a compound like that they have to pay for the privilege with bribes. People looked the other way. The guy is very tall, unmistakable, and could have easily been handed over. It's not like the reward isn't large enough for an average man to take it. The only way someone would turn down that huge sum of money is if their government was involved.

I still agree with Silverpig though. If that was to happen in Canada or the USA we would prosecute him as well. The difference is that it wouldn't happen.

 

[The Green Bean]

Pakistan is a very sad place. When you cross the border from India nothing really changes except the religion. Yet they are struggling immensely with much more than India. You have to wonder what a Pakistani thinks when they realize that they came from the same people but India has made something of itself while Allah just keeps shitting on Pakistan's head with natural disasters, political problems, and no progress. Where I live we have huge campaigns that are trying to help the Pakistanis out after this latest flood and I wonder how much money is sent their way and if it gets to the places it needs to be. Then of course you have the political problems and the rhetorical question "What if Pakistan had not allowed OBL into Pakistan in the first place?" I'm not saying they escorted him from Afghanistan to Pakistan but anyone who has been to that part of the world knows that when someone lives in a compound like that they have to pay for the privilege with bribes. People looked the other way. The guy is very tall, unmistakable, and could have easily been handed over. It's not like the reward isn't large enough for an average man to take it. The only way someone would turn down that huge sum of money is if their government was involved.

I still agree with Silverpig though. If that was to happen in Canada or the USA we would prosecute him as well. The difference is that it wouldn't happen.

I don't know why you have to bring India into all of this but they have problems too. It's just that their problems aren't shown in the American media. In 2002 there was a massacre of Muslims and I have seen youtube videos in the form of investigative journalism where senior members of the government have not only admitted to murdering Muslims but taken pride in that. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_Gujarat_violence

Then there is the Naxallite Maoist insurgency that has killed more than 11,000 people since 2002. That is almost as many deaths that the Taliban war in Pakistan has caused. The estimates for civilian deaths in the Kashmir insurgency since 1989 range as far as 100,000 which is about the same as the Iraqi deaths in America's war.

India has one of the highest poverty rates in the world--even higher than Pakistan. I visited some villages in MP a few months ago and the conditions were terrible: far worst than what I've seen in Pakistan. Yes, Indian cities like Mumbai are far ahead of their Pakistani counterparts in development terms but the Rural mess is appauling. You shouldn't forget that Pakistan has always had a better per capita income when compared to India until 2007.

When i was in India, I was sitting with my friend who was driving in a posh area of Mumbai. A police motorcycle took a wrong turn and crashed into us. We had to pay the police bribe money to get out of the situation. There is massive corruption in India as well: some are even implicating the involvement of the Prime Minister. I'm not saying we are better off but to portray India as this booming garden of love while portraying Pakistan as hell on Earth is ridiculous.

No progress? Pakistan's economy is expected to grow 5.4% despite war, floods and political unrest. The middle class is the largest its ever been. My business has grown at least 50x times since it started in 1990. The problem is that Pakistan is estimated to have a black market economy worth more than $50 billion which is more than 30% of the total documented GDP. Our main problem is not wars, not floods and not even corruption--the main obstacles to progress is political stability, energy and tax collection. There seems to be hope for all three areas...

 

[Broheim]

THINK FOR YOURSELF

you should take your own advice and not just copypasta the generic brainless conspiracy bullshit that every bored unemployed loser does...

 

[Jaskalas]

1) You have no proof Pakistan was involved.

Strawman, I never said Pakistan was involved with the attack itself, but Pakistan IS involved with Al-Qaeda and OBL. Where they go, we follow. The choice is to shoo them away, or invite us in.

Either that or pray they don't strike us again.

 

[The Green Bean]

Either that or pray they don't strike us again.

Or what?

 

[Doppel]

Or what?

More unilateral incursions into your so-called country taking out the bad guys. And just like with the OBL raid there will be air power ready to repel any intervention your military tries to exercise.

US won't invade Pakistan of course but it has shown a willingness to go into Pakistan when it needs to. Your borders don't even mean much to you so you cannot expect them to mean much to anyone else.

 

[randomrogue]

I appreciate an educated Pakistani responding in here. I think it's nice to see someone elses point of view.

 

[chucky2]

Or what?

You should step back a bit from your zealotry and take a long and hard think of just what is going to happen if/when one of your sh1thole countries aids another group that ends up attacking the US again. Prior to 9/11, even the Cole didn't really trip the publics trigger into giving a second thoughtless sh1t about the Muslim world. After 9/11, pretty much all the majority Muslim countries over there are on the publics sh1tlist. Granted, there may be significant %'s of our population that don't want us over there, but don't confused large %'s of those large %'s for caring about you: They don't. They just don't think any of you are worth one American life and/or $.

What is going to happen when one of your undereducated, brainwashed, poor @ss individuals (or a group of them) goes and does something dumb again and ends up killing a few thousand more civilians - on purpose?

Do you think the US public is going to politically allow the POTUS another field trip over to one of your sh1tholes with our troops? Not on your Allah's life! They're going to demand a response, and one that isn't going to expose our troops. What do you think that's going to be? That's going to be F-whatevers, B-whatevers, cruise missles, etc etc etc. Except unlike now, where they have ROE that hinder the military, there'll be very lax ROE.

You'd think if you care about yourselves you'd de-fundi, de-corrupt, so as to not allow one of your losers to go and pick a fight with the wrong country on your behalf...but nope, still fundi'ing, still corrupted...

...Nice! :thumbsup:

 

[The Green Bean]

The public of only three countries supported the Afghan war. The rest wanted OBL to stand a trial. Unsurprisingly, those three countries were USA, Israel and India. Even the majority in the UK did not want to invade Afghanistan. How come the UK and America's other "allies" have not started lambasting Pakistan for terrorist support. The UK has traditional ties with Pakistan that go much deeper than what America has done. America is just putting in money, while the British have actually done something.

Isn't rating an America life higher than a Pakistani one racist? American's are only pseudo-moralists: Fascists.

 

[randomrogue]

You have $1. You can give it to a Pakistani or you can give it to an American. Does giving it to a Pakistani make you racist?

 

[Broheim]

The public of only three countries supported the Afghan war. The rest wanted OBL to stand a trial. Unsurprisingly, those three countries were USA, Israel and India. Even the majority in the UK did not want to invade Afghanistan. How come the UK and America's other "allies" have not started lambasting Pakistan for terrorist support. The UK has traditional ties with Pakistan that go much deeper than what America has done. America is just putting in money, while the British have actually done something.

Isn't rating an America life higher than a Pakistani one racist? American's are only pseudo-moralists: Fascists.

no, it's called being realistic.

 

[EagleKeeper]

The public of only three countries supported the Afghan war. The rest wanted OBL to stand a trial. Unsurprisingly, those three countries were USA, Israel and India. Even the majority in the UK did not want to invade Afghanistan. How come the UK and America's other "allies" have not started lambasting Pakistan for terrorist support. The UK has traditional ties with Pakistan that go much deeper than what America has done. America is just putting in money, while the British have actually done something.

Isn't rating an America life higher than a Pakistani one racist? American's are only pseudo-moralists: Fascists.

Putting OBL on trial would have served as an inflammatory role much higher than when Atilla (sp) was in court

It would have afforded him a pulpit.

Even before he would be in trial; there would have been multiple kidnapping/ransom/attacks intended to free him.

Pakistan admitted that he was caught. The purpose of dumping the body at see after validation was to prevent a location of martyrdom. Look at the problems in Jerusalem over a piece of land. The same would have happened if his body was on land. It would be a rally point for he cause and followers.


As for attacks against Pakistan for terror support. Those that are affected the most will complain the loudest.

Terrorists from Pakistan attack India.
Terroirsts hiding and supported from with Pakistan attack NATO forces.

Israel has lived under Muslim attacks for for all her life. She has the justifiable experience to identify terror attacks and identify methods to expose the culprits

The UK fears Muslims now - she has allowed them to control the attitude of society by being afraid to stand up to unreasonable demands to reduce tensions.

 

[chucky2]

The public of only three countries supported the Afghan war. The rest wanted OBL to stand a trial. Unsurprisingly, those three countries were USA, Israel and India. Even the majority in the UK did not want to invade Afghanistan. How come the UK and America's other "allies" have not started lambasting Pakistan for terrorist support. The UK has traditional ties with Pakistan that go much deeper than what America has done. America is just putting in money, while the British have actually done something.

Even if that's true (I'm not going back to check), who cares? Do you think these other countries are going to be doing anything when we War that is significant? If we need 200k troops, and the US puts up 150k alone, should we give a shit what Denmark thinks? I don't know why people keep bringing up the opinions of other countries when those countries are statistically irrelevant: When they actually contribute something meaningful, then maybe their opinion will carry weight. They don't, so it doesn't. It's like giving equal credence to a 8 year olds opinion on house matters...whatever they think really doesn't matter, they're just along for the ride.

Isn't rating an America life higher than a Pakistani one racist? American's are only pseudo-moralists: Fascists.

I'm American, so I rate American lives higher than any others. I fully expect people of other countries to rate their citizens lives higher than any others. That's just the way that works.

That being said, I wouldn't rate a US soldiers life in say urban combat higher than a neutral or friendly Pakistani civilians life if it came down to it. That doesn't mean though that when we receive what is supposed to be actionable intelligence on a high value Taliban/AQ target, and we take him out with a drone strike, and accidentally kills a civilian, that we absolutely shouldn't have done the strike. You have to weigh the importance of getting the bad guys right then vs. potential damage to the good guys/civilians. Sometimes you'll let them go because the risk is too high, other times you're going to take the opportunity and hope for the best. That's War. Don't like it, don't have a War in your country.

Now what steps could you take to ensure there aren't masses of fundi brainwashed folks running around your country in this day and age of easy international travel/shipping....hmmmm....?

Chuck

 

[Broheim]

Even if that's true (I'm not going back to check), who cares? Do you think these other countries are going to be doing anything when we War that is significant? If we need 200k troops, and the US puts up 150k alone, should we give a shit what Denmark thinks? I don't know why people keep bringing up the opinions of other countries when those countries are statistically irrelevant: When they actually contribute something meaningful, then maybe their opinion will carry weight. They don't, so it doesn't. It's like giving equal credence to a 8 year olds opinion on house matters...whatever they think really doesn't matter, they're just along for the ride.



I'm American, so I rate American lives higher than any others. I fully expect people of other countries to rate their citizens lives higher than any others. That's just the way that works.

That being said, I wouldn't rate a US soldiers life in say urban combat higher than a neutral or friendly Pakistani civilians life if it came down to it. That doesn't mean though that when we receive what is supposed to be actionable intelligence on a high value Taliban/AQ target, and we take him out with a drone strike, and accidentally kills a civilian, that we absolutely shouldn't have done the strike. You have to weigh the importance of getting the bad guys right then vs. potential damage to the good guys/civilians. Sometimes you'll let them go because the risk is too high, other times you're going to take the opportunity and hope for the best. That's War. Don't like it, don't have a War in your country.

Now what steps could you take to ensure there aren't masses of fundi brainwashed folks running around your country in this day and age of easy international travel/shipping....hmmmm....?

Chuck

Denmark has more troops deployed and higher losses per capita than any other country in Afghanistan, so we're pretty supportive >.>

 

[chucky2]

Out of all the Western forces troops in Afghanistan (100&#37, what is the % of troops that Denmark makes up?

P.S. I picked Denmark out of the blue, if they're actually providing a real number of troops then that's great, I'd value their opinion more than someone not providing any troops, which was really my point.

 

[randomrogue]

Out of all the Western forces troops in Afghanistan (100%), what is the % of troops that Denmark makes up?

P.S. I picked Denmark out of the blue, if they're actually providing a real number of troops then that's great, I'd value their opinion more than someone not providing any troops, which was really my point.

You'd have to look up the numbers but I recall that Denmark is definitely among the largest supporters per capita. There was a discussion about this a month or so ago where someone was trying to show how much America was doing in Afghanistan but they screwed up and used data that was very old.

 

[randomrogue]

http://www.afghanistan.um.dk/NR/rdo...oopsInAfghanistanPerCapitaPDFofExcelSheet.pdf

 

[Broheim]

Out of all the Western forces troops in Afghanistan (100%), what is the % of troops that Denmark makes up?

P.S. I picked Denmark out of the blue, if they're actually providing a real number of troops then that's great, I'd value their opinion more than someone not providing any troops, which was really my point.

randomrogue posted the numbers, but yeah, we have a battlegroup deployed in one of the suckiest places in Afghanistan: Helmand, more specifically Gereshk, I myself was stationed at FOB Armadillo.

 

[kinev]

Americans can go fuck themselves. I won't feel sorry if there is another 9/11. I know some Americans rejoice at every Pakistani that dies. I won't do the same, but I really don't value American life.

...Isn't rating an America life higher than a Pakistani one racist? American's are only pseudo-moralists: Fascists.

The ironing is delicious...

 

[randomrogue]

randomrogue posted the numbers, but yeah, we have a battlegroup deployed in one of the suckiest places in Afghanistan: Helmand, more specifically Gereshk, I myself was stationed at FOB Armadillo.

There was some discussion about moving Danish troops around since they're suffering the highest casualties per-capita.

 

[chucky2]

http://www.afghanistan.um.dk/NR/rdo...oopsInAfghanistanPerCapitaPDFofExcelSheet.pdf

randomrogue posted the numbers, but yeah, we have a battlegroup deployed in one of the suckiest places in Afghanistan: Helmand, more specifically Gereshk, I myself was stationed at FOB Armadillo.

There was some discussion about moving Danish troops around since they're suffering the highest casualties per-capita.

This is what I'm talking about:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISAF_troop_number_statistics

Denmark was a bad example, replace that with another NATO country that is contributing almost nothing.

Don't get me wrong: Any contribution is worthwhile, and I'm thankful for your service and contribution (you've been there and one that while I sit in the States). It just irks me when people in the States start getting boners on other countries whining about the US when these other countries basically count for shit in the grand scheme of things.

 

[MotF Bane]

Americans can go fuck themselves. I won't feel sorry if there is another 9/11. I know some Americans rejoice at every Pakistani that dies. I won't do the same, but I really don't value American life.

The next time you go around this forum begging for American money because of some natural disaster in your country, I will remember this quote, and I will bring it up again.