Overclocking my A64 3000+

[sickcamry]

I recently purchased a new PC from NewEgg and got it all put together this past weekend. It consists of the following:

AMD Athlon 64 3000+
GIGABYTE nForce3 150 Chipset Motherboard GA-K8N PRO
Mushkin 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-3500 Level One (ordered two of them)
SAPPHIRE RADEON 9800PRO 128MB DDR 8X AGP
ASPIRE X-Superalien w/ 500W Power Supply
Zalman CNPS7000A-Cu Pure Copper CPU Cooler
Arctic Silver 5

Everything is working perfectly. I have the 9800 Pro overclocked at the exact speeds settings of the 9800XT, and it's stable as can be.
I also overclocked the processor a little, and here's where I have questions.

I currently have the processor OC'd to 2.17GHz, which is 217 Hypertransport, or DDR433 ~ DDR434, that's what my memory is rated for. Memory timings are set at CAS2,3,2,7,1T and works fine. Processor runs at about 29 degrees celcius under load. It runs extremely cold. Now I tried overclocking up to 2.2GHz, and it booted fine, but locked up after about 3 minutes of playing Max Payne 2. Setting it back down to 2.17GHz fixed this. I believe this to be a memory issue. I relaxed the timings to CAS2,3,3,8,2T but it didn't prevent the system from locking up in Max Payne 2 @ 2.2GHz. 2.25GHz of course does the same thing.

I tried upping the voltage on the RAM and processor a little but it didn't solve the problem. I tried to set the timings at CAS2.5 instead of CAS2, but the computer won't boot. When set at CAS2.5, the computer beeps over and over again until I press the reset button and BIOS goes back to a state of not being overclocked. Am I maxed out at 2.17GHz because of the memory I chose? I don't understand why it won't even boot at CAS2.5. What gives?

 

[DAPUNISHER]

My guess is the vid card doesn't play nice once the AGP speed is overclocked to that degree. You could try lowering the 9800pro's overclock and see if that stabilizes things@220fsb but the trade off will probably not be worth it. To elaborate, the gains from overclocking the vid card will be greater than the gains from juicing a few more mhz out of the CPU&ram but being forced to reduce the vid card speeds substantially, at least where gaming is concerned. I could be wrong about the reason for your lock-ups so you could pump the voltages even more than you have and see if that gets things stable but then you have to ask yourself if the added voltage and heat will be a worthwhile trade-off for a few more mhz. Which brings me to my next comment, no way is your CPU's core temp 29c under load with anything resembling normal ambient and case temps. It would have to be pretty cold in your place to get temps like that even with the Zalman. I'd guess either you're seeing the socket thermistor temp or it's misreading the case temp for the CPU temp, or the temp reading is just plain reading too low.

 

[Lyfer]

punishers right, 29C is way to cold under load. You prolly have to be running prometia to even come close to that temp. BTW like punisher said, it could be your video card, ATI's card have reputation for not running at high AGP speeds. Maybe when NF3 250 comes around, you'll have PCI/AGP lock and everything else to go with it to really so how these A64's can go.

 

[sickcamry]

You guys do realize that the nForce 150 has AGP/PCI lock, right? It's locked at 66.
It was the VIA chipset that doesn't do this.

nForce3 150 doesn't run at full Hypertransport speed. VIA doesn't allow the AGP/PCI to be locked. SIS755 chipset does everything properly.

As far as the CPU temperature reading, you're not the first to say that it sounds really low. I get that reading from BIOS. I flashed my BIOS to the latest version and it didn't change the CPU reading. When I run Sandra 2004, it says the same thing. Perhaps BIOS is giving incorrect readings or maybe there's something wrong with the thermal sensor for the CPU? Case temperature stays at 24 degrees celcius and never goes any higher than that. It's pretty cold in my room during this time of year. Right now the processor is reading 25 degrees celcius.

Here's proof that I'm not mistaken about the readings that my system is giving me. Like I said I don't know if they are accurate or not, but that's what it says:

http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/3/web/339000-339999/339247_84_full.jpg

http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/3/web/339000-339999/339247_85_full.jpg


Any reason why the computer won't boot with a CAS2.5 setting?

 

[Shimmishim]

have you tried one stick of ram?

try only one stick of ram and see how much higher you can push it.

running 1 stick seems to work the best...

 

[sickcamry]

Thanks Shimmishim but really if that's the fix for it then I don't wanna go there.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

LOL, my bad! I didn't even look at the board and ASSumed you had a K8T800 since everyone 'round here seems to use that. LOL@the SiSuck screenshot too! It's next to useless, you want to know what your temps are look in the bios, use the windows based hardware monitor from the manufacturer, or if unavailable use motherboard monitor. With the AGP being locked your problem becomes more difficult, I'd guess mainboard specific, the same for your timings issue. Are you using the latest bios?

 

[sickcamry]

Yep, flashed to the latest BIOS as soon as I got it.
I do use BIOS for the temperature readings, but I used SiSoft so that I could take a snapshot. BIOS CPU temperature fluctuates from 25 degrees celcuis to 30 degrees celcius depending on what game I have been playing and how long I've been playing it.
I chose the nForce3 150 chipset so that I could overclock as much as possible. 2.17GHz isn't bad at all, but this CAS2.5 issue has me a little confused. Not only will this RAM not overclock at all, it won't even let me RELAX on the CAS timings. weird huh?

 

[DAPUNISHER]

I've seen post about compatability issue with different ram and various A64 setups so that's probably what's going on with the timings, but the limited fsb speed is more puzzling I looked at your case and noticed they include no info on that 500w PSU so how do all the rails look? any dipping low?

I'm also wondering if that board gives you the socket and on-die temp readings for the CPU or if it just has a CPU temp reading? I'm just having trouble buying that temp, excuse me for doubting it, I just think you are either getting a socket reading or it reads low. Just to point out how useless Sisuck is I downloaded and ran it just now and sure enough it was next to useless just like with my previous couple setups screenshot Things that are wrong include that I'm don't think I'm on a skt7 board my CPU isn't running 100c, and I seriously doubt that@1.52v *that's accurate* that my CPU is 106W@2.3ghz

 

[sickcamry]

Unfortunately this Gigabyte BIOS seems a little "watered down" compared to my old Abit BIOS, even in "advanced" mode.
Here's all the information I could get for you out of BIOS, exactly as they appear:

Current CPU Temperature 30C
Current CPU Fan Speed 2163 RPM
CPU Vcore 1.500V

CAS# Latency 2
RAS# to CAS# delay (tRCD) 3
Min RAS# active time (tRAS) 7
Row precharge time (tRP) 2
Refresh period (tREF) 1x3120 cycles

Voltage readings just say "OK" and don't give me the actual voltages.

This is a great board as far as features and stability is concerned, but just doesn't have the overclocking features of an Abit or Asus.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

That is a barebones bios. Can you set the ram to run asynch with the HT speed so you can take it out of the mix and see if sonething else is limiting your overclock?

 

[Boonesmi]

nf3 150 is supposed to have pci/agp lock, but if i remember right several months ago some tech sites tested it and found that the pci bus is NOT locked... so when overclocking the fsb you will run the pci bus way out of spec

 

[sickcamry]

Originally posted by: DAPUNISHER
That is a barebones bios. Can you set the ram to run asynch with the HT speed so you can take it out of the mix and see if sonething else is limiting your overclock?

I'm not sure how to do that. What will the setting look like?

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Set the max mem clock to 166 that way your ram will be underclocked to 333DDR speeds when your CPU is@stock settings so when you up the CPU overclock from the default 200 settings your ram will still be running slow enough to eliminate it as the hold up, at least due to DDR speed anyways.

 

[sickcamry]

Hmmm...I think I'll just leave it at 2.17GHz and be happy with it.
I can always upgrade to a better MB (nForce3 250) and faster RAM in the future. Thanks guys.

 

[sickcamry]

Well, I was playing Max Payne 2 and it locked up again. Video card diagnostics said the card stopped responding to system commands. Then it downclocked the card automatically. So it looks like this might have been somewhat of a card issue afterall. I relaxed on my video OC a little, and I bumped the CPU voltage to 1.55 and OC'd the CPU up to 2.2GHz. I'll let you guys know if it's stable.

EDIT: What's a "normal" overclock for the Athlon 64 3000+ w/ nForce3 board? Also, does anyone know how well Mushkin PC3500 Level One is supposed to OC? Thanks.

 

[sickcamry]

Computer crashed after about 35 minutes of gaming. Wasn't the same type as before. I set the CPU back down to 1.17GHz and I think that's where it's going to stay. I slightly lowered my video card overclock as well.

 

[sickcamry]

Hmmm...it just did the same thing. When the system locks up, my speakers so haywire and start screeching really bad and the monitor goes into power saver mode. I just downclocked both the CPU and video card a little more. Hopefully it doesn't happen again.

What causes the system to lock up in this manner? I hope the CPU or video card isn't getting too hot. I changed the memory timings to CAS2,3,3,8,2T hoping that would help since it is rated at 2,3,3 @ DDR433.

 

[Boonesmi]

dont forget that your pci bus is probably way out of spec, which can cause lockups.

 

[sickcamry]

Originally posted by: Boonesmi
dont forget that your pci bus is probably way out of spec, which can cause lockups.

nForce3 150 chipset is supposed to have AGP/PCI lock? Does it not work properly? Any way to fix this? I played Max Payne 2 for about two hours last night @ 2.2GHz and just a very slight overclock on my 9800Pro, and had no problems at all.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

That's what I suggested i my first post, lower the vid card overclock to get higher speeds from the CPU and RAM. But also as I mentioned you will probably discover by benching or using FRAPS that being able to run the vid card with a nice overclock will be better for gaming than 3 extra mhz CPU&ram speed.

Boonesmi is correct that the PCI probably isn't in spec when overclocking, I've seen people post in various forums around the web about the issue and saw these 2 links in the mobo review thread provided by klah

link 1

link 2

 

[sickcamry]

You guys are right, I did some quick research and found that the nForce3 MBs have AGP lock but not PCI lock. So maybe my SB Audigy card was crapping out due to the PCI overclock. I set the processor at 2.1GHz and sped up the CAS timings a little. I also overclocked the 9800Pro back up to XT speeds. I'll have to play with it tonight and see if it is going to be stable in this configuration. Thanks guys.

 

[Zebo]

This sucks. And is why I tell people the barton + cheap nforce2 mobo is the best budget system right now. Or the P4C's overclocked for people with money to burn. Personally I'm waiting till all the bugs both in nforce3 and memory are worked out before building my water cooled maxed 64. Not to mention waiting for PCI express video cards. Allshould come together nicely by summertime.

Edit great link to lostcircuits dapunsher...they have a really sweet bios guide I find very useful.

 

[sickcamry]

2.1GHz is still a decent overclock for someone who is happy with their stock A64 3000+, right? I mean, I will see a difference in apps and games, correct? Sorry, I'm a semi-n00b when it comes to overclocking.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: sickcamry
2.1GHz is still a decent overclock for someone who is happy with their stock A64 3000+, right? I mean, I will see a difference in apps and games, correct? Sorry, I'm a semi-n00b when it comes to overclocking.

Sure it's fine. I'm happy with a stock barton 2500 in everything i do. But if we compare overclockablity percentages it's fairly weak at 5% OC because of mobo/ram issues right now. Compare to 2.43 MHz for a 2500 barton which is a 32% OC, or 3.4 MHz for a 2.4C/2.6C/2.8C p4 which is a 42%/30%/21% OC repectivly. Both are achivable.