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Our favorite satirist says TSMC will give initial 20nm exclusively to Apple

tviceman

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2008
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https://semiaccurate.com/2012/12/06/nvidias-maxwell-process-choice/#.UOjxXW80V8E
Charlie is saying Nvidia's next generation Maxwell will be 28nm because there won't be any 20nm wafers because TSMC is going to give it's entire initial 20nm ramp up to Apple. This of course would affect AMD (and Qualcomm). I think the story is complete crap. TSMC would be effectively telling 3-4 most important customers (the ones who pay extra to stay on the bleeding edge) FU. I realize Apple commands a very large volume, but if TSMC were to give their existing customers a very large shaft, that would have major implications on future business these companies do with TSMC.
 

Jaydip

Diamond Member
Mar 29, 2010
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IIRC Maxwell will be on 20nm.The performance expectations from Maxwell is huge as was presented in NV slides.In no way they can achieve that even with a matured 28nm process node.
 
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Haserath

Senior member
Sep 12, 2010
793
1
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Where else where they go?

GloFo
TSMC
Samsung
Intel

Those seem to be the only bleeding edge foundries today.

GloFo is behind by quite a bit. Intel is closed to everybody but a few other small companies. Samsung is losing Apple, so maybe they could move there?

There isn't much choice for fabless companies...:\
 

OVerLoRDI

Diamond Member
Jan 22, 2006
5,491
3
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It doesn't sound completely impossible. The foundry world is only going to get more exclusive and competitive as we get smaller and smaller.
 

boxleitnerb

Platinum Member
Nov 1, 2011
2,597
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If 20nm is in such bad shape as is rumored around the web, it is plausible that the initial products from NV and maybe AMD are based on 28nm. As the process matures, a switch to 20nm in Q3/Q4 2014 is not out of the question.
 

f1sherman

Platinum Member
Apr 5, 2011
2,243
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Everything is possible, but all that Apple "exclusive" stuff goes against everything TSMC and Morris Chang ever stood for.
Especially "jumping through hoops" for the benefit of their customers (official TSMC slogan) and enticing it's customers to stick with one foundry.

Apple can go back to Samsung, or buy it's own foundry business next node, and TSMC would be left with fleeing customers and shaky relations.
Char-lie is purposely creating antagonizing situation, so that his paying subscribers get some value for their money.

In reality it would be TSMC/Apple miscalculation of capacity/investments if initial demand for 20nm wafers would be so huge that Apple would pay some crazy royalties to get entire 20nm.
Nothing short of Apple buying TSMC does not prevent Nvidia/Qualcom/AMD to invest in their own 20nm TSMC wafers.
 

f1sherman

Platinum Member
Apr 5, 2011
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“You can’t easily raise prices or cut production without damaging your relationship with a customer,” he (Morris Chang) says.

“We have ongoing discussions with our customers about prices and capacity.
We try to anticipate the future and manage their expectations.”


He also acknowledges that good customers – those that place most or all of their foundry business with TSMC – receive more favorable treatment than other customers,
in terms of their production needs, during periods of strong demand.

http://www.bsicorp.net/technology/taiwan
 

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
560
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IIRC Maxwell will be on 28nm.The performance expectations from Maxwell is huge as was presented in NV slides.In no way they can achieve that even with a matured 28nm process node.
What? You confused me Jay, did you mean "Maxwell will NOT be on 28nm?"
 

Fx1

Golden Member
Aug 22, 2012
1,215
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Does anyone know why Samsung cant start to make GPU' for Nvidia and AMD?

TSMC is a pain in the ass anyway they seem to cause more problems than they fix.
 

amenx

Platinum Member
Dec 17, 2004
2,872
639
136
Money talks, and Apple has a lot of money.
I wonder if Apple ever considered investing in their own fabs. Money is certainly not a problem. It may take a few years to get off the ground, but certainly beats trusting others like TSMC to do it for them. Especially knowing that TSMC may not be a reliable long term partner with the sort of volumes they require and which sometimes necessitates screwing some clients in favor of others.
 

tommo123

Platinum Member
Sep 25, 2005
2,617
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wouldn't it take 10s of billions to get current gen fabs going? let alone the fabs they would want in a few years time? plus stealing the engineers away from intel and the rest.

wouldn't it be more sensible to just let others have to deal with the stress of it?
 

A Hitman

Junior Member
Feb 29, 2008
19
1
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Maybe all his advertisers pulled their ads?
I hear AMD has been cutting back on it's advertising budget :p

I wonder if this will lead to AMD and Nvidia changing Fabs, maybe they are waiting for Samsung to call them?
 

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