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"Optimum" 9mm gun for target practice, concealed + home defense?

JEDI

Lifer
Sep 25, 2001
27,289
1,340
126
From this THREAD

I've decided against a .22 caliber for self defense. Most poinant were alkemyst saying with panic/adrenaline, would the bad guy even know he was shot? And phantom309 saying that .22's rimfire catridge is less reliable than centerfire.

next "inexpensive" size up for an automatic weapon is 9mm.

[.38 special is for revolvers. i rather have 15 shots than the 6 in a revolver. in a combat situation, my acuracury will probably drop DRASTICALLY as compared to a range. I rather have too many bullets than come up 1 short.]

I tried the Beretta 92 and Glock 19, which is the compact version of the Glock 17.

Now i know why the US military had the 92 as the standard sidearm for ~20yrs. nice gun. But WAAAAAAAY to big for concealed.

The Glock 26 is a sub-compact version. the standard clip is 10, although it can take a 17 round clip from the glock 17 and a 15round clip from the glock 19. The magazine just sticks out of the handle. I'm thinking Glock 26 w/15 round clips.

geez.. the 9mm has ALOT more recoil than the .38 special! :(

and if my arm isnt stiff and moves w/the recoil, the next round doesnt get chambered correctly, thus = JAM :(

My idea of optimum is:
1) reliable
2) As close to ZERO maintance as possible
3) concealable
4) inexpensive

So what 9mm gun would you recommend based on what i wrote?
 

GMI

Member
Jun 6, 2005
191
0
0
while this doesn't meet the inexpensive part of your requirement. I love sigs. I personally have a P229, it's not that big a gun, and it's damn maintance free. It did cost me about 700~800 though :( And the gun itself is a tad heavier than other 9mms
 

jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
48,502
214
106
I was going to say SigP229 as well...they're not cheap, though.

I've always thought 9mm had fairly light recoil..then again, I have a .45.

How inexpensive is inexpensive? Considered a CZ or Kel-Tec?
 

Kirby

Lifer
Apr 10, 2006
12,032
2
0
You might want to try out the Ruger that looks like the German Luger. It has a certain cool factor if you're a history buff, or Nazi....but anyhoo, I've got a Beretta, and I love it. They're not cheap, but I think they hold their value quite well, so it would be a good investment.
 

Kilgor

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
3,292
0
0
My idea of optimum is:
1) reliable
2) As close to ZERO maintance as possible
3) concealable
4) inexpensive
Going by your idea of optimum I would get a Ruger GP100 or somthing similar. Since you have your heart set on an Semi-Auto you might want to look at a CZ Rami or CZP01. Ruger also makes some nice reliable Semi-autos like the P85 and P95.
 

fuzzymitx

Member
Aug 12, 2005
55
0
61
forget the G26 if you are concerned abour recoil and just use a G19.... if you are really really concerned you can get a G19C (compensated... the barrell/slide are ported)...

Don't believe any of the bullcrap you hear about ported and ruining night vision, try shooting just one shot in low light and enjoy the blast of flame out the barrel and the poofing of night vision.

Glock is the definition of low maintenance.... (and most Semi Auto's on the market today are as well...) I have a G19, 9226 navy, Bushmaster M-4 clone, Remington 870 express magnum...

I guess I'll help win WWIII against North Korea. :D
 

Auggie

Golden Member
Jul 18, 2003
1,379
0
0
Where to begin with this post...

First and foremost your number 1 and number 2 priorities are conflicting. Proper maintenance translates directly into reliability. This is pretty basic stuff, and an idea that will help you in any number of life situations outside of gun ownership. Glocks can apparently be used effectively after being buried in the sand a year then fired under water. But regular use of Glocks in as little as six months can often damage and break the guide rods that usually come factory stock. So - is the Glock an ultra-rugged user-proof gun, or does it require good maintenance? Faced with having to pull one out of a holster and wager your existence on it, do you really want one of your top priorities of your weapon to be "I can treat the gun like sh1t and not worry too much about it?"

And you sound like you know next to nothing about handguns, but you're gung-ho for a CCW license? Hmm... I'd say go buy a gun to learn with (I highly recomment learning on the Beretta 92FS or any 92 derivative - I love mine!) for a few months of regular (at least twice/month) practice and get your shooting ability to a decent place.

Furthermore, I strongly hope ammunition cost would not be a deciding factor in which gun you would buy (aside from .40 and some other slightly more exotic caliber sizes). 9mm and .45 are both affordable. .45 costs as much as twice what 9mm costs, but these two calibers are adequate home defense sizes and should both be affordable to take to the range a couple times a month. If that's not true, I'd say you don't have enough money to responsibly get a gun at the moment.

Only after you're an intermediate shooter will you have any kind of idea WHATSOEVER of which gun feels best to you, that you can control and conceal effectively. (And if any 9mm is giving you recoil problems, wait until puberty is over before you buy.) And I can pretty much guarantee that as you begin shooting, your tastes and feel for guns will change, especially if you have a friend that you can go shooting with and use his gun. Ranges will also usually have demo semi-automatics that you can pay a fee to use. It's amazing to see how different the Glock 19 is from the Beretta, or even how different the Beretta 92FS is from the Beretta 92 Vertec. I found out that I absolutely love the Vertec feel... about 12 months after I started shooting.

Sorry to be snide, but it sounds like you haven't got a clue about anything, and the last thing we need is an inexperienced know-nothing running around with a CCW. Developing into a responsible gun owner isn't just a "hey, I feel like getting a gun this week!" moment.
 

Auggie

Golden Member
Jul 18, 2003
1,379
0
0
I guess instead of just being an ass, I should recommend that if the Beretta 92 is giving you too much recoil to control, it's likely that you have something wrong with your hold on the weapon, not that you're too weak to actually handle it. Next time you shoot, I'd take the hit to your ego, and ask someone down at the range to help you with it - see if they can see anything wrong. Other guys at the range are almost always eager to help out others. Without seeing what you're doing, it's likely a grip problem. My mom could probably man-handle a 92FS. :)
 

GRIFFIN1

Golden Member
Nov 10, 1999
1,403
6
81
It's hard to beat the Glock 19. My second choice would be a Sig 239. Most Glocks are the same thickness, so the only difference in size is barrel length and grip length. I prefer the Glock 19 over the 26 because I like to have all four fingers wrapped around the grip.

The C-tac holster is very popular for concealed carry.

If you have problems limp wristing the gun, then you need to make sure you are using the proper grip and stance. Look at figure 2-2 on this page. That's the grip I like to use.

If you want to save money, then you should try to find a used gun. Look in local newspapers and websites like Glocktalk.com for someone that is selling a gun in your area. It's possible to buy a gun from someone out of state, but you will have to have the gun shipped to a gun dealer.
 

crumpet19

Platinum Member
Feb 10, 2002
2,189
1
0
Originally posted by: foofoo
hi,
one small concealable pistol i recently purchased and quite like is this one
http://www.springfield-armory.com/prod-xdpstl-sub-compact.shtml
in .40 s&w. but it does come in 9mm. go to the range and rent one if you can.
good luck
I've got the XD-9 Sub Compact in 9mm. I love this gun. OP, check into it.
ALso, you're misfeeds are likely caused by 'limp-wristing' the firearm. Keep your strong arm (grip hand) wrist locked. Support about 60% of the firearms weight with your off hand.

Hell, even with my XD i can limp wrist and it still chambers fine... accuracy goes to shvt... but it chambers fine. :p
 

msi1337

Diamond Member
Apr 16, 2003
7,810
60
101
I had a Sprinfield XD-9 Sub Compact as well...easily my favorite small 9mm... however, you might also consider the Bersa Thunder 380...it is an excellent gun as well..not as good as the XD-9, but close.

 

pontifex

Lifer
Dec 5, 2000
43,806
44
91
i own a Taurus PT99, which is basically a Beretta 92, but its way too big for concealed carry. All of the 9mms I've ever used or held were large frame guns, so I'm not sure what to tell you. best thing to do is go to a shop or range and hold them and fire them if you can to get a good feel for them.
 

JEDI

Lifer
Sep 25, 2001
27,289
1,340
126
Originally posted by: fuzzymitx
forget the G26 if you are concerned abour recoil and just use a G19.... if you are really really concerned you can get a G19C (compensated... the barrell/slide are ported)...

Don't believe any of the bullcrap you hear about ported and ruining night vision, try shooting just one shot in low light and enjoy the blast of flame out the barrel and the poofing of night vision.
How much more recoil does the Glock 26 have than the Glock 19? And why is there much more recoil? (weight of gun???)

G19c... wont the gases escaping increase the probablility of the next round not chambering correctly? (energy of the shot is used to chamber the next round?)
 

franksta

Golden Member
Jun 6, 2001
1,967
6
81
If you like those Glock triggers I'd go with the Glock. A lot of people also like the Springfield XDs but I've never held one. If I was looking to get a 9mm I'd go with a SIG P229 but they are a bit more expensive than the Glocks and Springfields.
 

harrkev

Senior member
May 10, 2004
659
0
71
You might also want to check out these for concealed carry without blowing close to $1000:
http://www.kel-tec.com/pf9.html
http://www.kahr.com/pistols_9mm.html

Neither one should break the bank, and I have not heard anything bad about either.
The compact Springfield XD might be worth a look, too. I own a full-size XD-9, and I love it!

The only bad thing that I can say about the Glocks is that if the trigger is pulled back, it goes boom. There is no other external safety. XD has a grip safety, and the others that I have listed are true DAO, so they likely have a longer and stiffer trigger than a Glock (a good thing in a carry pistol). Of course, the trigger should NEVER go back unless you want to shoot something. That is basic gun safety 101. However, things have happened while holstering firearms. I consider myself to be a safe person, but anybody can make a mistake, especially if you are handling a firearm multiple times per day, 365 days a year. Familiarity breeds complacancy. Complacancy breeds a dangerous situation. I want all the safety that I can get.

Just for fun, do a google search on the Orlando DEA agent giving a talk on firearms when his Glock goes off while holstering it. Of course, it is easy to call him an idiot, but let him who is without error cast the first stone. Have you ever made a foolish turn while driving, and been only a couple of inches away from a crash? Have you ever caused a car crash? Nuff said.
 
Feb 24, 2001
14,550
4
81
Just remember...if it's too big you won't carry it, thus making it useless. I don't see how folks carry something like a Glock 19, how can you even sit down...

Even more so with a white collar job. If you have to tuck your shirt in for work, that's a big disadvantage for an IWB hoslter. If it doesn't fit in my front pocket, I really can't carry it.

Other ones to look at in the small 9mm area are:

Robaugh 9mm (expensive!, but smallest there is)
Kahr PM9
Kel-Tec PF9 (my recommended)
Kel-Tec P11 (a bit larger than the PF9, but more rounds)

I'd suggest getting a stapler or something and trying carrying it around "concealed" to get an idea of what you're in for...
 

jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
48,502
214
106
Just for fun, do a google search on the Orlando DEA agent giving a talk on firearms when his Glock goes off while holstering it. Of course, it is easy to call him an idiot, but let him who is without error cast the first stone. Have you ever made a foolish turn while driving, and been only a couple of inches away from a crash? Have you ever caused a car crash? Nuff said.
Sure I have, but I don't believe I've ever holstered a firearm with my finger on the trigger...how did it manage to go off? :confused:

Originally posted by: K1052
SIG P239


Edit: and stop limp wristing the automatics
:thumbsup:

That'll definitely help with the jamming issues. ;)
 

K1052

Lifer
Aug 21, 2003
37,354
11,818
136
Originally posted by: harrkev
You might also want to check out these for concealed carry without blowing close to $1000:
http://www.kel-tec.com/pf9.html
http://www.kahr.com/pistols_9mm.html

Neither one should break the bank, and I have not heard anything bad about either.
The compact Springfield XD might be worth a look, too. I own a full-size XD-9, and I love it!

The only bad thing that I can say about the Glocks is that if the trigger is pulled back, it goes boom. There is no other external safety. XD has a grip safety, and the others that I have listed are true DAO, so they likely have a longer and stiffer trigger than a Glock (a good thing in a carry pistol). Of course, the trigger should NEVER go back unless you want to shoot something. That is basic gun safety 101. However, things have happened while holstering firearms. I consider myself to be a safe person, but anybody can make a mistake, especially if you are handling a firearm multiple times per day, 365 days a year. Familiarity breeds complacancy. Complacancy breeds a dangerous situation. I want all the safety that I can get.

Just for fun, do a google search on the Orlando DEA agent giving a talk on firearms when his Glock goes off while holstering it. Of course, it is easy to call him an idiot, but let him who is without error cast the first stone. Have you ever made a foolish turn while driving, and been only a couple of inches away from a crash? Have you ever caused a car crash? Nuff said.
SIGs and Glocks are easily obtainable at $500 and less if you bother to look around.
 

misle

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2000
3,371
0
76
I would buy a CZ P-01. Be sure to try before you buy. Handguns are not one size fits all.
 

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