Optimization Esp for SSDs via Perfect Disk!!

[Virgorising]

What I want to know is how Raxco knows what the SSD algorithms for each company's individual controller and firmware version are? Also, even if Raxco did know all this, which they don't, how will they do a better job of optimizing the SSD than the company that actually made the product?

PS: Could you in the future consolidate multiple consequential posts into a larger one? It is annoying to see a whole list of posts containing single sentences cluttering the thread when you could have clearly edited the post you made first.

I could never answer this question. But, if someone has serious interest, and the capacity to understand a response technically....I would think they would be moved to contact Raxco. Roxco doesn't claim to do a better job, they claim they are augmenting what is already in place.

And, how can you say third party apps don't often do a far better job than onboard? Witness Perfect Disk itself for mechanical drives! It offers viable, carefully arrived at configurable strategies which do a far better job than what is inherent in any Windows OS. In that cased, it doesn't augment, cause it turns off Windows defrag altogether and replaces it. In the SSD optimization, it doesn't turn off/replace TRIM or anything related, they say it augments.

Re posts, I often make addenda and edit an existing post. But when I don't, it's often cause anyone following the thread would not get new notification after an edit, but only a new post. I have sometimes missed important data when an OP would made an addendum in an existing post, rather than making a new post in a thread I was following and involved in.

Whichever I choose, it is purposeful, as per above, not inconsiderate.

As we say, form is meant to always follow/honor/foster function.

 

[Virgorising]

Am delving again, just found below. Apparently they evolved this a while back. I only learned about it after having installed my first SSD and seeing that red message when Raxco recognized the new drive, and then, of course, following up.

http://blog.raxco.com/2011/02/28/ssd-optimization-software/

If U use above link and hit Contact Us. You will see U could call them, email them, etc. If my technical expertise were higher, and, I felt I could therefore evaluate a detailed response objectively, I would do that in a heartbeat.
______________________________________
Addendum:

It seems O & O...considered the next best of all such apps..does something similar re SSD optimization.

http://bestdiskdefragmenter.com/

Specifically:
http://www.oo-software.com/en/products/oodefrag/ssd

My take increasingly, is this is not snake oil.

 

[Ketchup]

Congrats on the SSD Virgorising.

This post is not going to be as technical than the others, but something to ponder:

The drive itself is at least a 200% performance improvement over the Black you had.

At best, this app it going to make your drive 10% faster.

At worst, this app is going to cut the lifespan of your drive in half (or greater).

Hmm, adding an app to your drive that is 200% faster than you had, to add 10% more performance, at the cost of half of your drive's life?

Not worth it in my book.

 

[Virgorising]

Congrats on the SSD Virgorising.

This post is not going to be as technical than the others, but something to ponder:

The drive itself is at least a 200% performance improvement over the Black you had.

At best, this app it going to make your drive 10% faster.

At worst, this app is going to cut the lifespan of your drive in half (or greater).

Hmm, adding an app to your drive that is 200% faster than you had, to add 10% more performance, at the cost of half of your drive's life?

Not worth it in my book.

Thank you, Ketchup! But I still luv my now backup Black YOU inspired the purchase of.

And my take still is this will do the opposite of hurt the life of the drive. Just found another reference, I think, given the spelling of optimisation, something from a tech guy in the UK:

http://www.wegotserved.com/2011/05/10/perfectdisk-12-offer-enhanced-solid-state-drive-optimisation/

Yep....Terry Walsh lives in the UK with his fambly.

 

[ignatzatsonic]

PS: Could you in the future consolidate multiple consequential posts into a larger one? It is annoying to see a whole list of posts containing single sentences cluttering the thread when you could have clearly edited the post you made first.

I'd think that consolidation would be a very low priority for anyone quoting Proust in a signature file, given Proust's prolix nature.

 

[gizbug]

Ive never had an issue running perfectdisk on any of my drives (ssd or non-ssd)
I just use the default setting

 

[flexy]

I always considered Raxco reputable in the past, but this is obvious BS.

The argument of "extending the life time"....is bunk.

Several websites did calculations that even with TLC NAND, such as is used in the (fantastic) Samsung 840 EVO and where it's said it has a lower life-span than MLC NAND, it would takes DECADES of normal use until a SSD "wears out", I am talking about 20, 30 years or so.

SSD endurance for 99% of normal users today is a NON-issue, neither is (like happened in the past) that people are concerned about writes happening on the SSD.

My SSD (Samsung 840 EVO 250GB) is my OS drive but I also use it for all the games I play.

It's hideous how little writes happen in general on HDs or SSDs, UNLESS you run a server or something.

Even if I would write Gigabytes of Gigabytes of data on the SSD every single day, life-time and endurance would not be an issue whatsoever.

Therefore the claim to "defragment" SSD for extending the life-time of a SSD is plain BS.

 

[Virgorising]

I'd think that consolidation would be a very low priority for anyone quoting Proust in a signature file, given Proust's prolix nature.

Please know how taken aback I was seeing this unexpected, rich with sharp human insight offering.

I am gob smacked. In all the best ways, I mean.()

 

[Virgorising]

I always considered Raxco reputable in the past, but this is obvious BS. The argument of "extending the life time"....is bunk.

I submit....it is neither BS nor bunk. No operation of the caliber of Raxco could even afford do do any such thing; it would cost them everything they've built since 1979.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raxco

And, from what I've found online, O&O has evolved something very similar.

Someone with authentic, uber tech knowledge should reach out formally to Raxco, this Mr. Nolan......or Mark Zuckerberg.

K...kidding about the latter, but it would take him two nanos to assess this, and, betcha, affirm its viability.

 

[flexy]

I submit....it is neither BS nor bunk. No operation of the caliber of Raxco could even afford do do any such thing.

What they FOR SURE cannot afford is openly admitting that the concept of "defragmenting" has become obsolete with SSDs since there IS nothing to "defragment" any longer.

Without going into details, IF there is any measurable benefit with those "mysterious" new SSD optimization methods they and other companies claim then this only applies to rare cases, eg. if provisioning space on a SSD would be low/needs to be re-claimed. (Which NORMALLY is not the case with modern SSDs where you can pre-allocate provisioning space...or when you have plenty of free space left anyway so that provisioning is not an issue).

Give us hard numbers that show that Raxco, OO etc. does anything beneficial which is measurable on a SSD - NOT intentionally vague "PR blah-blah".

 

[imagoon]

What they FOR SURE cannot afford is openly admitting that the concept of "defragmenting" has become obsolete with SSDs since there IS nothing to "defragment" any longer.

Without going into details, IF there is any measurable benefit with those "mysterious" new SSD optimization methods they and other companies claim then this only applies to rare cases, eg. if provisioning space on a SSD would be low/needs to be re-claimed. (Which NORMALLY is not the case with modern SSDs where you can pre-allocate provisioning space...or when you have plenty of free space left anyway so that provisioning is not an issue).

Give us hard numbers that show that Raxco, OO etc. does anything beneficial which is measurable on a SSD - NOT intentionally vague "PR blah-blah".

Defragging isn't completely obsolete.... just mostly. We can see a real difference in performance on an SSD hosting SQL when the database is in 3000 fragments vs 3million fragments. OS File system overhead starts to have an effect. Do home users see this? Not often.

 

[Virgorising]

Defragging isn't completely obsolete.... just mostly. We can see a real difference in performance on an SSD hosting SQL when the database is in 3000 fragments vs 3million fragments. OS File system overhead starts to have an effect. Do home users see this? Not often.

Fascinating, and, bet anything, true.

Again, I have set my PD to optimize this wee drive ongoing via Raxco's optimize SSDs....set it to 1% not 0%, and, unless and until I have evidence there is some downside to that, i am stickin to it.

Even if having done this will not bring a discernible, dramatic difference, my take is it does augment TRIM and, over time, extends the life of the drive.

 

[Ketchup]

Defragging isn't completely obsolete.... just mostly. We can see a real difference in performance on an SSD hosting SQL when the database is in 3000 fragments vs 3million fragments. OS File system overhead starts to have an effect. Do home users see this? Not often.

That is interesting. Do you think, given time, the drive would optimize these files, or is it a lost hope once you get over a million or so?

 

[Virgorising]

That is interesting. Do you think, given time, the drive would optimize these files, or is it a lost hope once you get over a million or so?

Wut? Is this atypical sarcasm from our Ketchup79?:sneaky:

 

[Cerb]

That is interesting. Do you think, given time, the drive would optimize these files, or is it a lost hope once you get over a million or so?

The drive can't optimize those files. The file system has to choose what parts of what files go to what LBAs, and the SSD's job is to put them there. With tons of scattered tiny fragments, the software overhead and firmware/hardware overhead is going to be significant, regardless of anything in the SSD.

 

[imagoon]

That is interesting. Do you think, given time, the drive would optimize these files, or is it a lost hope once you get over a million or so?

You would use something like contig to defragment the offending file. If you care, you can also then compact the MFT to release that space.

You also wack the side of the DBA's head and tell them to set the database expansion size to something sane like 128MB, compact only on a certain amount of free space, proper temp table management and proper index management / defragmentation or what ever is appropriate for your data set.

 

[Ketchup]

Thanks to you both for the info on this.