One SC Justice gave advice to Democrats to Countermand the SC Hobby Lobby Decision

[nehalem256]

Birth control prevents a costly medical condition, like teeth cleanings and vaccines. Viagra treats a medical condition.

Sunscreen prevents a costly medical condition. Why isn't it covered?

Pregnancy isn't a medical condition. Its a normal bodily function. Is digestion a medical condition?

 

[nehalem256]

Do you honestly think no men or conservatives enjoy sex?

If a man has sex with a woman who claims to be on the BC, that he is paying for, and turns out to be lying about it should the man be free from paying child support?

EDIT: And apparently women don't enjoy sex otherwise they wouldn't be so upset about having to pay for their own BC

 

[senseamp]

If sunscreen required a prescription, it would be covered. It's not covered because it's OTC.

 

[nehalem256]

If sunscreen required a prescription, it would be covered. It's not covered because it's OTC.

Why does that matter?

You are essentially saying the government doesn't require sunscreen to be covered because the government says it doesn't have to be covered.

 

[JockoJohnson]

Birth control prevents a costly medical condition, like teeth cleanings and vaccines. Viagra treats a medical condition.

Viagra lets men have boners to have sex. I see that as optional. Sure, it's fun and feels good but so do breast implants.

 

[senseamp]

Why does that matter?

You are essentially saying the government doesn't require sunscreen to be covered because the government says it doesn't have to be covered.

Not sure what the substance of your post is, but I am sure you think there is one. Sunscreen is OTC. OTC medicines aren't covered by insurance. It's like vitamins. You want to buy OTC ones at the store, they aren't covered, but the fancy prescription only prenatal ones are covered. Or pain medicine, Tylenol vs codeine. I guess if you don't see the distinction by now, no point explaining it to you.

 

[FerrelGeek]

Do women not pay for insurance? I am pretty sure it comes out of my wife's pay check the same as it does mine.

So what? Health insurance is just that, insurance. It doesn't mean everything is guaranteed to be free. Policies are set up to cover / not cover many things. The policy atone of my older companies used to cover quite a bit as part of the annual preventative care allowance: full blood panels, urinalysis, EKG, etc. The policy at me current company only covers a very limited blood panel, no urinalysis, and no EKG. I'm less than pleased at what it covers, but I'm not out there crying that it's not all free. Stop whining.

Ah, so you admit that free BC isn't about "preventative healthcare", but pushing the liberal social agenda.

Of course this is all political. HL covers 16 different BC options, but still libs choose to get all pantie-wetting outraged that HL won't cover the remaining 4.

 

[FerrelGeek]

Old and stupid, the perfect type of people that vote republican.

Wrong on all counts; I'm middle-aged, not old and I have NO love for republicans. Enlighten me with why you think it's wrong? Or are you just young and stupid, which is why you vote democrat?

 

[Oldgamer]

Why is any form of birth control or Viagra or anything similar even covered? Shouldn't these be considered elective? Are breast implants covered? If not, they should be since birth control is. I just need a better understanding of why birth control should even be covered.

Actually breast implants are covered but under circumstances like if you have breast cancer and need to have a breast removed or have a congenital defect of the breast...ect.

 

[Oldgamer]

Viagra lets men have boners to have sex. I see that as optional. Sure, it's fun and feels good but so do breast implants.

To this day I have never understood why Viagra and other "boner" pills are covered by insurance. I am a man, and getting older, sure it gets harder to get..well, harder..lol But that is just natural. It doesn't mean your health is in jeopardy if you can't get a hard on. But with certain types of birth control it is in fact a health issue. Many women need hormonal birth control to control ovarian cysts or painful menstruation, or minimize endometriosis and other life threatening health issues.

 

[FerrelGeek]

Not sure what the substance of your post is, but I am sure you think there is one. Sunscreen is OTC. OTC medicines aren't covered by insurance. It's like vitamins. You want to buy OTC ones at the store, they aren't covered, but the fancy prescription only prenatal ones are covered. Or pain medicine, Tylenol vs codeine. I guess if you don't see the distinction by now, no point explaining it to you.

This. Sunscreen was a very poor analogy. And BC is also used to treat certain female issues besides preventing pregnancy.

 

[Zorba]

So what? Health insurance is just that, insurance. It doesn't mean everything is guaranteed to be free. Policies are set up to cover / not cover many things. The policy atone of my older companies used to cover quite a bit as part of the annual preventative care allowance: full blood panels, urinalysis, EKG, etc. The policy at me current company only covers a very limited blood panel, no urinalysis, and no EKG. I'm less than pleased at what it covers, but I'm not out there crying that it's not all free. Stop whining.



Of course this is all political. HL covers 16 different BC options, but still libs choose to get all pantie-wetting outraged that HL won't cover the remaining 4.

Concerning I was responding to a post that basically said only men pay for insurance, with a statement that said so do women, your response make no sense.

 

[Zorba]

Viagra lets men have boners to have sex. I see that as optional. Sure, it's fun and feels good but so do breast implants.

I am not going to defend praying for Viagra, I think that should be up to the company. But having acl surgery so you can keep paying football is also optional, but always covered. Hell so is setting a broken foot, sure you can't walk right, but you don't have walk in right, just feels good to.

 

[Zorba]

This. Sunscreen was a very poor analogy. And BC is also used to treat certain female issues besides preventing pregnancy.

Ibprofin is not covered when OTC, is when it is prescription. Make BC OTC and cheap, and this wouldn't be much of an issue.

 

[senseamp]

Ibprofin is not covered when OTC, is when it is prescription. Make BC OTC and cheap, and this wouldn't be much of an issue.

Explaining something common sense to a Republican is always good fun.

 

[nehalem256]

Not sure what the substance of your post is, but I am sure you think there is one. Sunscreen is OTC. OTC medicines aren't covered by insurance. It's like vitamins. You want to buy OTC ones at the store, they aren't covered, but the fancy prescription only prenatal ones are covered. Or pain medicine, Tylenol vs codeine. I guess if you don't see the distinction by now, no point explaining it to you.

http://alphamom.com/pregnancy/prescription-vs-over-the-counter-prenatal-vitamins/

So the big difference, usually, between prescription vs. OTC vitamins is the amount of folic acid. 400 to 600mcg is generally what you’ll see in an OTC version, while the prescription pills sometimes contain up to 1000mcg. There’s not really any evidence that 1000mcg of folic acid is really “better” than the recommended minimum, and the truth is that sometimes expensive vitamin supplements simply mean expensive pee, as your body filters out whatever is in excess of your actual need. 1000mcg of folic acid is actually considered to be the absolute upper limit of “tolerable intake,” which might explain why many women complain that prescription prenatals make them feel sick. But this is usually why women chose to stick with prescription versions, if they’re holding up the labels and doing a straight line-by-line comparison.

Seems like the idea of prescription prenatal vitamins is totally arbitrary and just a way to scam money. Not exactly a good example I would think.

To this day I have never understood why Viagra and other "boner" pills are covered by insurance. I am a man, and getting older, sure it gets harder to get..well, harder..lol But that is just natural.

Erectile dysfunction is clearly a medical condition.

By your argument we shouldn't be paying for any medical care for old age conditions.

It doesn't mean your health is in jeopardy if you can't get a hard on. But with certain types of birth control it is in fact a health issue. Many women need hormonal birth control to control ovarian cysts or painful menstruation, or minimize endometriosis and other life threatening health issues.

Problem with your argument is that its suppose to be free because it counts as "preventative care". Treating ovarian cysts doesn't count as preventative care.

Also pretty sure that Plan B isn't used to treat painful menstruation

 

[senseamp]

http://alphamom.com/pregnancy/prescription-vs-over-the-counter-prenatal-vitamins/
Seems like the idea of prescription prenatal vitamins is totally arbitrary and just a way to scam money. Not exactly a good example I would think.
Erectile dysfunction is clearly a medical condition.
By your argument we shouldn't be paying for any medical care for old age conditions.
Problem with your argument is that its suppose to be free because it counts as "preventative care". Treating ovarian cysts doesn't count as preventative care.
Also pretty sure that Plan B isn't used to treat painful menstruation

Thanks for your insightful medical opinions, doc. Clearly women need people like you between them and their actual doctors. I just don't know how they'll manage without your expertise.

 

[FerrelGeek]

Concerning I was responding to a post that basically said only men pay for insurance, with a statement that said so do women, your response make no sense.

I understood what you meant. I was using your post more as a springboard. Men/wome, old/young, we all pay. But that still doesn't mean that everything is guaranteed to be covered. My rant on this whole mess is that it's devolved to political hackery. If a company has a health insurance policy, they have the right to craft it how they choose. In those choices there will be 'winners' and 'losers', for lack of a better term. I'm a middle aged man paying for a policy that, quite frankly, isn't profoundly geared for the needs of many middle aged men, especially given what I had at a prior company. Oh well. It doesn't please me, but I'm not out there screaming 'war on middle aged men!!!' because certain things aren't covered.

 

[nehalem256]

Thanks for your insightful medical opinions, doc. Clearly women need people like you between them and their actual doctors. I just don't know how they'll manage without your expertise.

Your welcome.

Now if you don't mind on off to repackage normal sunscreen as Nehalem's Special Prescription Sunscreen, which I will charge 5 times as much for, but no worries ACA will pick up the tab for "free" since its preventative care!:sneaky:

 

[FerrelGeek]

Ibprofin is not covered when OTC, is when it is prescription. Make BC OTC and cheap, and this wouldn't be much of an issue.

That's certainly an option.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

You miss the point. IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO GET THE PRESCRIPTION IF IT'S NOT ON THE FORUMLARY. No doctor in the system will just give you the prescription and send you off. Walmart doesn't just take your word that you need it. People who have healthcare that won't cover contraceptive based care will have to seek out of coverage doctors. You're assuming everyone's insurance/healthcare works the exact same way when it in fact does not.

I have never ever come across a state which would allow any insurance company to prohibit the writing of a legal prescription. In all cases a physician may write as he or she believes best, but that does not guarantee that the medication itself will not have to be paid for entirely out of pocket. An insurance company can say what it will pay for but you are going to have to back up any claim that any insurance can force a physician to do as you claim. I deal with formularies every day and in all cases without exception it means that a medication isn't paid for. Again in all cases the patient has the right to pay and the prescriber the right to write. Any attempt around this in any state I've ever been in would result in criminal charges against the insurance company. What screwed up state do you think this applies to?

 

[JockoJohnson]

To this day I have never understood why Viagra and other "boner" pills are covered by insurance. I am a man, and getting older, sure it gets harder to get..well, harder..lol But that is just natural. It doesn't mean your health is in jeopardy if you can't get a hard on. But with certain types of birth control it is in fact a health issue. Many women need hormonal birth control to control ovarian cysts or painful menstruation, or minimize endometriosis and other life threatening health issues.

And if that is the case, I am all for the coverage. Companies/corporations shouldn't have the right to deny just because a product happens to be labeled as "birth control" if it can be used to aid with those conditions.

 

[nehalem256]

And if that is the case, I am all for the coverage. Companies/corporations shouldn't have the right to deny just because a product happens to be labeled as "birth control" if it can be used to aid with those conditions.

Pretty sure that IUDs and Plan B are not used to treat those conditions.

 

[FerrelGeek]

And if that is the case, I am all for the coverage. Companies/corporations shouldn't have the right to deny just because a product happens to be labeled as "birth control" if it can be used to aid with those conditions.

Pretty sure that IUDs and Plan B are not used to treat those conditions.

No, they're not. And once again, HL is NOT denying coverage for 16 of the 20 BC methods. This is all politics and liberals whining cuz they're not getting their way.

 

[senseamp]

No, they're not. And once again, HL is NOT denying coverage for 16 of the 20 BC methods. This is all politics and liberals whining cuz they're not getting their way.

There is nothing in the ruling that limits it to just 4 forms of birth control. It's up to the employer to pick and choose what his religion objects to his employees using. Other companies are already using this ruling to deny all birth control, so your point is moot. And secondly, it should be up to the woman and her doctor to pick her birth control method, not her employer.
It is good politics as well, no doubt. SCOTUS created an issue out of thin air for the Democrats to use to drive a wedge between religious conservatives and middle class women. This is now about contraception, not just abortion, and contraception use has overwhelming approval. It would be political malpractice for the Democrats to not use it to its full advantage and put GOP on record as blocking this amendment.