Old HP LJet4+ turns OFF new eMachine w/ Cat5 surge?

[DrJeff]

This is confusing; help please.

I hooked up a new eMachines 2700+ box from CCity on a LAN using a D-link fast *switch*. On this, I hang an old HP laserjet 4+ from a JetDirect EX external print server, as well as 2 other desktops and a laptop. When I turn the LJ on, something immediately turns off the eMachine but does nothing to the other 3 computers. The eM is on a few year old UPS. As a troubleshooting step, I unplugged the eM's Cat5 cable and restarted the LJ, and nothing went wrong. I was about to blame some power surge in the electrical line and replace the old UPS, but it seems to be triggered across the network. Again, nothing affected the other 3 computers, including a kids computer cobbled up from parts and probably containing an old PS, flaky at best.

I had previously tried hooking the LJ directly to the parallel port of my desktop, but the same eM cutoff thing happened when I powered up the LJ.

What am I missing here? Is there a surge suppressor just for the Cat5 line?
And why is it just happening to the brand new eMachines box? (It uses the nForce2 chipset with onboard networking.) Is there some network card setting that is making this happen? Is the new eMachines a lemon?

Thanks for the help,
Jeff

 

[pyrojunkie]

Many eMachines use low wattage PSU's. Since the problem happens even when its not plugged into the network suggests that its not related. It really sounds like a brownout in the power. Try hooking up the eMachine on a different circuit in the house to see if it still happens.

 

[DrJeff]

I'm sorry. My shorthand might have made the details confusing. When the new eMachines is disconnected from the network, I can cycle the laserjet on and off at will and there is no bad effect on the eMachines.

For good measure, I checked the PS :
Bestec 250W, model ATX-250-12x, rev. P7
Outputs: +12V = 13A, +5V = 25A, +3.3V - 20A
+5V & +3.3V = 150W max.
It has no AGP card inserted. Has DVD, CD-RW, 2 HDs, PCI modem, and the Barton 2700+.

Does that sound like enough juice? It is a nice little box and nForce2 mobo, but I don't mind slipping in a good PS.

 

[pyrojunkie]

EMachines usually use non standard PSU's, so a better replacement may be more expensive then standard PSU's. The PSU seems to be a little overloaded, but as you said, the issue only arises with a network connection. If you have a spare PSU laying around, I would recommend trying it out before purchasing a specific PSU to fit the eMachine. Also I would try a different network cable.

They do sell surge protectors that protect rj45 cables, but without any serious power problem, I don't think the printer would send the surge over the network to the eMachine. If there were a power problem, it would spread out amongst all the computers on the network. The switch would likely assorb anything the printer might send to it on its own.

 

[DrJeff]

I understand.
The laserjet is getting old, and might be drawing more power than it used to for powering up. It is one of those that sounds like a jet engine starting up when you hit the power switch.
If you plug a laserjet into a UPS for its power, does that also shield the electrical circuit in the wall from any power surges the LJ might cause?

Do you mean the eMachines use low-profile PSUs or some proprietary plug setup?

 

[pyrojunkie]

EMachines usually have small form factor PSU's, the plug setup is the same as any ATX PSU. A UPS and/or surge protector will protect both ways on a power spike.

 

[LiLithTecH]

Does the eMachine have a WAKE-On-LAN option enabled?

 

[DrJeff]

Originally posted by: LiLithTecH
Does the eMachine have a WAKE-On-LAN option enabled?

Actually, after the last reply yest. aft., I thought about that and turned off the WOL switch and other power management features of WinXP that allowed the network card to govern anything, and that seems to have solved the problem. Good thing, since I was about to spend some money on RJ45 suppressors, PSUs, new UPS or something to fix this.

I don't know if it is the nForce2 chipset that is sensitive or the FIC AU31 motherboard design. I am glad it was not the PSU.

 

[jackschmittusa]

It is not a good idea to plug a laser printer into a UPS that has anything else plugged into it. Laser printers can kick a surge out of a UPS.

 

[DrJeff]

Originally posted by: jackschmittusa
It is not a good idea to plug a laser printer into a UPS that has anything else plugged into it. Laser printers can kick a surge out of a UPS.

Really? Well, SH%T! Just when I thought that was safe.
I guess the UPSs that have network protection plugins for RJ45 suppression would be a sucker bet also?

 

[DrJeff]

Come to think of it, once when I did try to plug the laserjet into a UPS, it set off the alarm each time the LJ was turned on. I guess that was the reason. It was sending a surge into the UPS that was making it mad.

 

[pyrojunkie]

I am sure the alarm was about too much power being drained from the battery and not about the printer spiking the UPS. I have never heard of any issues of plugging a laser printer into a UPS other than draining a UPS battery. Laser printers will use a lot of power, but if you have a high rated UPS, there should be no problem in plugging one into it.

 

[DrJeff]

For "High-rated", do you mean bigger than the 350VA models you see on sale every weekend in the ads? What might be a reasonable output for UPSing a laserjet? And does it matter old vs. new laser printer; like does an oldtimer start using more juice to get revved up?

 

[redbeard1]

It is not recommended to have any printer on a UPS. You can actually burn printers out because of a lack of power coming from the UPS.

 

[DrJeff]

Can you at least plug a laser printer into a surge strip?

 

[lobadobadingdong]

yes, and the newer low power ink jets are fine to use on battery back ups as long as they aren't a multifunction device, many of these have high powered led banks for the scanner and can have issues. although I'd recommend using at least a 350VA for that, higher if your pc uses a lot of power.

 

[jackschmittusa]

Laser printers can indeed kick a spike through the output side and damage other devices plugged into it. Go to some ups manufactures' site and read the FAQs.

 

[pyrojunkie]

350VA models are very low power. I use one and it doesn't even have enough juice to keep my one computer on it for more than 3 minutes. If I have the monitor plugged into it, the UPS will just beep indicating more power is being used than the battery can output at once.

Since an older laser would likely use much more power than models of today, its hard to say on what would be an appropiate rating to use for it. UPS's work just like any normal surge protector, just with the addition of extra power to keep a device on a little longer when power goes out. No device on a surge protector should hurt another device on the same protector. If it does you have a reason to collect on those lifetime warranties.

 

[Mnementh]

Using a laser printer on a UPS will invalidate those warranties as the manuals and FAQ's specifically tell you not to connect a laser printer to them, they draw too much current on startup damaging the UPS and therefore removing the protection it affords you.

Mnementh

 

[lobadobadingdong]

Originally posted by: pyrojunkie
350VA models are very low power. I use one and it doesn't even have enough juice to keep my one computer on it for more than 3 minutes. If I have the monitor plugged into it, the UPS will just beep indicating more power is being used than the battery can output at once.

Since an older laser would likely use much more power than models of today, its hard to say on what would be an appropiate rating to use for it. UPS's work just like any normal surge protector, just with the addition of extra power to keep a device on a little longer when power goes out. No device on a surge protector should hurt another device on the same protector. If it does you have a reason to collect on those lifetime warranties.

sounds like you either have a really cheap ups or one with a dying battery. my 350VA holds a 17" monitor, a pretty stout pc (uses at least 275 W) and an athlon 2200+ laptop, runs for around 10-12 min. on battery.