Oil is suspiciously light for 6000 miles... hit or stay?

[nedfunnell]

I bought a 2000 Echo this summer and immediately changed the oil, at about 172k. It now has over 178k on it, and I'm surprised to see that the oil looks pretty clear, still. Wiped on my receipt from the dentist, it looks like this:

Not the black I am used to seeing from 6k mile oil. I am thinking about when to change it.
1. Toyota's recommended drain interval is strange- they call out an oil change at irregular intervals in their "At 15,000 miles..." guide. I saw a 6000 mile one in there, though.
2. The oil is Quaker State dino 5W-30.
3. The car is driven in a mild climate, with a mixture of short and long trips, but most of the miles are highway.
4. I drive with a light foot to get good MPG.
4. I'm not going to get a UOA.

I've seen plenty of people talking about oil color the other way (don't worry about dark oil) but not much discussion this way. Would you say that light color is a good indicator that the oil is not being stressed out and is still good for another few thousand?

 

[Jimzz]

6000miles is a good range for regular oil. I would change it if it was my car.

 

[soccerballtux]

I would change it and spend $20 for a UOA from blackstone labs to learn if I can change it every 15k, but that's just me

 

[phucheneh]

If the level is good, I wouldn't worry about the color. I've seen cars come in for regular 3k changes and observed a wide gamut of different colors. I know their previous change was with the same brand of bulk 5w30 I'm putting back in it, yet sometimes the oil looks remarkably clean, and sometimes it is a much more common 'waste oil' black.

I don't know what causes the difference. There are probably some common factors, but I can't venture anything other than pure speculation. Same advice goes both ways: don't say an oil change is needed because the oil is dark, don't say it isn't because it's light. Just keep intervals within a reasonable mileage (and time) limit.

 

[tortillasoup]

If the level is good, I wouldn't worry about the color. I've seen cars come in for regular 3k changes and observed a wide gamut of different colors. I know their previous change was with the same brand of bulk 5w30 I'm putting back in it, yet sometimes the oil looks remarkably clean, and sometimes it is a much more common 'waste oil' black.

I don't know what causes the difference. There are probably some common factors, but I can't venture anything other than pure speculation. Same advice goes both ways: don't say an oil change is needed because the oil is dark, don't say it isn't because it's light. Just keep intervals within a reasonable mileage (and time) limit.

If the oil isn't dark and started off light, then that likely means the oil hasn't been polluted by fuel/combustion however dark oil doesn't mean contaminated oil as some oil is natively dark due to the molybdenum that is used as an anti-wear additive. So yes some oils are darker than others but I would think it would stand to reason that an oil that started off light and stayed light is probably still good.

 

[thedarkwolf]

In my TDI the oil is blacker than night after 30 seconds lol

 

[deadken]

... I would think it would stand to reason that an oil that started off light and stayed light is probably still good.

The oil can break down to the point where it will still provide pressure, but not the same level of lubrication.

As soccerballtux stated, now might be a good time for a Oil Analysis. That will determine if the oil is still within acceptable ranges. Why are you not interested in getting one?

In my opinion, I'd change the oil and filter figuring that I've gotten my monies worth at 6k miles. If I wasn't going to spend the money on an oil change, I'd spend the money on an oil analysis.

FWIW: I used to schedule oil samples, review oil samples, and then schedule the repairs necessary (if contimination was found), or schedule re-samples for the 200+ Diesel bus engines used by my employer.

 

[BUTCH1]

If the level is good, I wouldn't worry about the color. I've seen cars come in for regular 3k changes and observed a wide gamut of different colors. I know their previous change was with the same brand of bulk 5w30 I'm putting back in it, yet sometimes the oil looks remarkably clean, and sometimes it is a much more common 'waste oil' black.

I don't know what causes the difference. There are probably some common factors, but I can't venture anything other than pure speculation. Same advice goes both ways: don't say an oil change is needed because the oil is dark, don't say it isn't because it's light. Just keep intervals within a reasonable mileage (and time) limit.

Maybe cars with stuck PCV valves??.

 

[Meghan54]

That's a lot like our '06 Lexus GX 470. After ~7K miles, oil still looks "clean". I attribute it to a clean engine to begin with and a clean running engine. Of course, other factors certainly play into this as well....additives in the particular brand of oil used, etc.

I'd just dump it and replace. The cost of the oil analysis is about the cost of changing the oil, so why bother? Even if the analysis says you can go to 15K, you've just added the cost of an oil change to that extension, negating any savings you may have realized by extending the oil change interval.

And the oil itself really doesn't "wear out", per se. The additives do, tho, as does the ability of the oil to remove and suspend dirt/grit/etc. The base oil will stay "oily" and still lubricate, albeit with dirt/etc. suspended within.

 

[tortillasoup]

A used oil analysis not only saves money but it saves time as well. I think it's worth doing especially considering how clean the oil appears.

 

[EagleKeeper]

changing the oil every 5-6K miles is not going to hurt the engine.

 

[nedfunnell]

I mostly don't want to do a UOA because I could do an oil change for the cost, and I'm sure it would take a long time to recoup the cost of the UOA. On a newer car that I plan to keep for another 100k miles? Sure, or on a $20k diesel engine. It doesn't seem like a winner on this car, though.

Maybe it would be worth it to get a UOA, change it with a quality synthetic oil (Mobil 1) and let the UOA guide how long I keep the Mobil 1 in there- if my engine was kind enough to the dino oil that it was still in good shape after 6k miles, then the M1 should be able to go 10k.

 

[Viperoni]

I drive the crap out of my Echo and my synthetic oil is almost black after 6k miles.

Has it been burning any?

Although it's not a good way to guage, because oil can still be worn out even though it's clean, I'd go to 8k with it.

 

[jagec]

I'd just dump it and replace. The cost of the oil analysis is about the cost of changing the oil, so why bother? Even if the analysis says you can go to 15K, you've just added the cost of an oil change to that extension, negating any savings you may have realized by extending the oil change interval.

The idea behind it is that once you're established a regular driving pattern, you analyze once or twice, and then follow that OCI for as long as your driving pattern remains similar, maybe with the occasional analysis to make sure things are still solid.

If you extend your interval from, say, 5k to 15k, your analysis has already saved you money in the first extended interval. If you don't analyze at EVERY oil change, those savings continue to accumulate.

That said, I don't analyze my oil.

 

[deadken]

I mostly don't want to do a UOA because I could do an oil change for the cost, and I'm sure it would take a long time to recoup the cost of the UOA....

While I understand your reasoning I do disagree with it for the simple reason that you are here asking others for opinions as to whether your oil is good or not based on a picture of that oil wiped on a receipt. Whereas, IMHO, you could know in fact whether your oil is good or not for certain for a $25 test.

Now, if you spent $25 on an oil analysis you would know where to space your oil change intervals without worrying about the condition of your oil. Let's say: Person A changes his oil every 3.5k for $25 each time. Person B changes his oil every 7k based on the results of an oil analysis test showing that his oil lasts that long. In that scenario Person B has recouped the cost of the test in only 1 extended interval. Every time after that, he is saving $25 over person A.

...
Maybe it would be worth it to get a UOA, change it with a quality synthetic oil (Mobil 1) and let the UOA guide how long I keep the Mobil 1 in there- if my engine was kind enough to the dino oil that it was still in good shape after 6k miles, then the M1 should be able to go 10k.

While this sounds reasonable, the reason that I don't suggest it is that you are assuming that the oil is still in good shape after 6k without any tests to prove it. You could be correct, but you could be very wrong.


Here is a link to the 2000 Toyota Echo Owners Manual:
http://www.toyota.com/owners/web/pa....portlet.action=processRequest#Owners-Manuals

If you read the last section, it'll tell you to refer to the Scheduled Maintenance Guide for service intervals.

So, here is a link to the 2000 Toyota Echo Scheduled Maintenance Guide:
http://www.toyota.com/t3Portal/document/omms/SMG100_MS0001/pdf/2000_Toyota_SMG_PDF.pdf

I suggest you read page 17 and then move to page 24.

 

[nerp]

Don't waste money on an oil analysis. Just change it. It's a Toyota Echo. Change it regularly and drive the crap out of it. This is not a high performance engine.

 

[Meghan54]

Don't waste money on an oil analysis. Just change it. It's a Toyota Echo. Change it regularly and drive the crap out of it. This is not a high performance engine.

Exactly. Pick the service interval appropriate to your use and just do that. No need or oil analysis or anything else. Millions of people manage to get well over 200K on their vehicles without doing one single oil analysis during the vehicle's entire life. Imagine that.

 

[Pray To Jesus]

I didn't change my oil for ~1.5 years a while back.

 

[nedfunnell]

While I understand your reasoning I do disagree with it for the simple reason that you are here asking others for opinions as to whether your oil is good or not based on a picture of that oil wiped on a receipt. Whereas, IMHO, you could know in fact whether your oil is good or not for certain for a $25 test.

Now, if you spent $25 on an oil analysis you would know where to space your oil change intervals without worrying about the condition of your oil. Let's say: Person A changes his oil every 3.5k for $25 each time. Person B changes his oil every 7k based on the results of an oil analysis test showing that his oil lasts that long. In that scenario Person B has recouped the cost of the test in only 1 extended interval. Every time after that, he is saving $25 over person A.


While this sounds reasonable, the reason that I don't suggest it is that you are assuming that the oil is still in good shape after 6k without any tests to prove it. You could be correct, but you could be very wrong.


Here is a link to the 2000 Toyota Echo Owners Manual:
http://www.toyota.com/owners/web/pa....portlet.action=processRequest#Owners-Manuals

If you read the last section, it'll tell you to refer to the Scheduled Maintenance Guide for service intervals.

So, here is a link to the 2000 Toyota Echo Scheduled Maintenance Guide:
http://www.toyota.com/t3Portal/document/omms/SMG100_MS0001/pdf/2000_Toyota_SMG_PDF.pdf

I suggest you read page 17 and then move to page 24.

Thank you for your well-researched and thoughtful reply. I will give consideration to changing my oil with M1 and doing a UOA after 7500 miles.

 

[deadken]

Thank you for your well-researched and thoughtful reply. I will give consideration to changing my oil with M1 and doing a UOA after 7500 miles.

No problem. I'm glad to help and I'm glad you found my advice helpful.

If you could post back with the results (maybe even in this thread) it might help others decide if the UOA was worth it or not. I'd certainly be interested in hearing the results and, as a guy who used to schedule maintenance base on oil analysis results, perhaps I could offer some insight in decyphering the results.