Oil & Gas, an interesting CNN report

[Witling]

A CNN article Link quotes OPEC sources as saying that the problems with gas prices in the U.S. aren't due to OPEC production but are rather related to U.S. laws. The article has some interesting observations. Among them are:

"There has not been a refinery built in America in the last 20 years. So if you produce more crude oil but you can't refine it, it's not going to translate into gasoline," he said.

If that statement is accurate, I wonder why we've got the hots for drilling in the Alaskan National Wilderness Area.

 

[ElFenix]

thats the same reason given for the california rolling blackouts a few summers ago, that there wasn't enough capacity in the system! that can't be right!

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Witling
A CNN article Link quotes OPEC sources as saying that the problems with gas prices in the U.S. aren't due to OPEC production but are rather related to U.S. laws. The article has some interesting observations. Among them are:

"There has not been a refinery built in America in the last 20 years. So if you produce more crude oil but you can't refine it, it's not going to translate into gasoline," he said.

If that statement is accurate, I wonder why we've got the hots for drilling in the Alaskan National Wilderness Area.

I know it's long but it's all in there. In the Oil thread has many statements by the OPEC family that there is a Glut of Oil and latest U.S. Government reports confirming this "Glut".

This is the reason the OPEC family is saying they will cut back production. They don't want to lose their high profits when the U.S. finally decides to getting around to refining the glut of Oil.

 

[Red Dawn]

Can you imagine the havoc that would result to our economy if Terrorists were able to destroy some of our refineries?

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Can you imagine the havoc that would result to our economy if Terrorists were able to destroy some of our refineries?

They obviously need re-building anyway and new additional ones, so would it be that big of a deal to force the Oil Thugs into building back into their business???

I'm not abdicating Terrorism of course. Looking at strictly the derilection of business duty by the Oil Exec Greedy Thugs.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Can you imagine the havoc that would result to our economy if Terrorists were able to destroy some of our refineries?

They obviously need re-building anyway and new additional ones, so would it be that big of a deal to force the Oil Thugs into building back into their business???

I'm not abdicating Terrorism of course. Looking at strictly the derilection of business duty by the Oil Exec Greedy Thugs.

You think the companies who have refineries don't want to build more? Are you that naive? Do you have any idea WHY there haven't been more refineries built?

CkG

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Can you imagine the havoc that would result to our economy if Terrorists were able to destroy some of our refineries?

They obviously need re-building anyway and new additional ones, so would it be that big of a deal to force the Oil Thugs into building back into their business???

I'm not abdicating Terrorism of course. Looking at strictly the derilection of business duty by the Oil Exec Greedy Thugs.

You think the companies who have refineries don't want to build more? Are you that naive? Do you have any idea WHY there haven't been more refineries built?

CkG

"Do you have any idea WHY there haven't been more refineries built?"

Let's hear your explanation.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Can you imagine the havoc that would result to our economy if Terrorists were able to destroy some of our refineries?

They obviously need re-building anyway and new additional ones, so would it be that big of a deal to force the Oil Thugs into building back into their business???

I'm not abdicating Terrorism of course. Looking at strictly the derilection of business duty by the Oil Exec Greedy Thugs.

You think the companies who have refineries don't want to build more? Are you that naive? Do you have any idea WHY there haven't been more refineries built?

CkG

"Do you have any idea WHY there haven't been more refineries built?"

Let's hear your explanation.

Do you think it's because of the "Oil Thugs"?

CkG

 

[chess9]

New refineries, as I recall, are subject to newer environmental regulations that are much more stringent. The old facilities have been grandfathered in.

Why update your refinery to improve air quality if you aren't forced to do so at gun point?

-Robert

 

[Witling]

CAD, why refineries haven't been built isn't as simple as you (conspiracy theorist that you are) think.

DW, sorry I missed the earlier posts on the oil process. It's not a subject in which I'm terribly interested. I do know that OPEC has consistently tried to get the U.S. to conserve oil. They're not villains.

As to Red Dawn. Red, this is why I don't believe in the terrorist bit. In the U.S., destroying property receives a whole lot more toleration than destroying human life. Seriously, seriously damaging the U.S. infrastructure isn't that hard. There simply aren't the terrorists here to do it. I mean, if you wanted to seriously hurt the U.S., you would . . . ah, but let's nto go into that.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: chess9
New refineries, as I recall, are subject to newer environmental regulations that are much more stringent. The old facilities have been grandfathered in.

Why update your refinery to improve air quality if you aren't forced to do so at gun point?

-Robert

"Do you think it's because of the "Oil Thugs"?

CkG


Let's hear your explanation CAD.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: chess9
New refineries, as I recall, are subject to newer environmental regulations that are much more stringent. The old facilities have been grandfathered in.

Why update your refinery to improve air quality if you aren't forced to do so at gun point?

-Robert

Yeah, I wonder why

Time, air-pollution rules and racial issues are squeezing plans for an oil refinery south of Phoenix.

Arizona has no oil refinery, making it dependent on gasoline shipped from California and Texas. Clean Fuels has said that an Arizona-based refinery would provide a reliable fuel supply to the Valley, estimating it would sell half of its production to the Arizona market.

If approved, it would be the first refinery built in the nation in 24 years. Clean-air regulations and local concerns have blocked projects proposed since a refinery was built in Gary, Ind., in 1979.

CkG

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: chess9
New refineries, as I recall, are subject to newer environmental regulations that are much more stringent. The old facilities have been grandfathered in.

Why update your refinery to improve air quality if you aren't forced to do so at gun point?

-Robert

"Do you think it's because of the "Oil Thugs"?

CkG


Let's hear your explanation CAD.

Do you think it's the "Oil Thugs"?

CkG

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Originally posted by: chess9
New refineries, as I recall, are subject to newer environmental regulations that are much more stringent. The old facilities have been grandfathered in.

Why update your refinery to improve air quality if you aren't forced to do so at gun point?

-Robert

Yeah, I wonder why

Time, air-pollution rules and racial issues are squeezing plans for an oil refinery south of Phoenix.

Arizona has no oil refinery, making it dependent on gasoline shipped from California and Texas. Clean Fuels has said that an Arizona-based refinery would provide a reliable fuel supply to the Valley, estimating it would sell half of its production to the Arizona market.

If approved, it would be the first refinery built in the nation in 24 years. Clean-air regulations and local concerns have blocked projects proposed since a refinery was built in Gary, Ind., in 1979.

CkG

"The complications of building a refinery close to an urban area have made some question why the company doesn't explore alternative sites. "We don't want this refinery there," he said. "First of all, it's a residential area. It's a minority community. And these folks have just been trod upon."

Mobile was founded by African-American sharecroppers from Mobile, Ala., among other places. Attorney Howard Shanker has notified Owens of his concerns that the refinery would continue a pattern of discrimination against minority communities when it comes to locating industry. The area is home to two landfills, and another large landfill is proposed."
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Oh that's Rich, figures CAD & Co and the RBC would blame the poor black folk.

24 years and it's all the African-American Community across the U.S.'s fault. :|

I'm speechless, you should be happy CAD, I think I'm done for the day.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Originally posted by: chess9
New refineries, as I recall, are subject to newer environmental regulations that are much more stringent. The old facilities have been grandfathered in.

Why update your refinery to improve air quality if you aren't forced to do so at gun point?

-Robert

Yeah, I wonder why

Time, air-pollution rules and racial issues are squeezing plans for an oil refinery south of Phoenix.

Arizona has no oil refinery, making it dependent on gasoline shipped from California and Texas. Clean Fuels has said that an Arizona-based refinery would provide a reliable fuel supply to the Valley, estimating it would sell half of its production to the Arizona market.

If approved, it would be the first refinery built in the nation in 24 years. Clean-air regulations and local concerns have blocked projects proposed since a refinery was built in Gary, Ind., in 1979.

CkG

"The complications of building a refinery close to an urban area have made some question why the company doesn't explore alternative sites. "We don't want this refinery there," he said. "First of all, it's a residential area. It's a minority community. And these folks have just been trod upon."

Mobile was founded by African-American sharecroppers from Mobile, Ala., among other places. Attorney Howard Shanker has notified Owens of his concerns that the refinery would continue a pattern of discrimination against minority communities when it comes to locating industry. The area is home to two landfills, and another large landfill is proposed."
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh that's Rich, figures CAD & Co and the RBC would blame the poor black folk.

24 years and it's all the African-American Community across the U.S.'s fault. :|

I'm speechless, you should be happy CAD, I think I'm done for the day.

Yeah

play the race card. You = moron for trying to suggest that I was blaming "poor black folk". The "not in my backyard" excuse gets used all the time - but yet people like you bitch and moan about gas prices.
Now let me ask you this dave - if we haven't built a refinery in 25 years - don't you think that we may be behind 20+ years in capacity since it didn't grow with increasing demand? Yet people bitch and moan about gas prices and pollution - well it's your choice - either high gas or it goes in your backyard.

Now run along and *TRY* to learn a little about how oil becomes gas for your weed trimmer.

CkG

 

[XZeroII]

It would be nice to have a new refinery. I'm sure technology has advanced so much that costs would be cut in half or more. Then factor in the environmental regulations...I don't know. You would think the environmentalists would realize that new refineries would be cleaner and they would be helping the environment by shutting those old ones down. It's stupid to enact such stringent rules all at once. They should do it slowly so that companies can slowly adjust. Then we get all the benefits. Instead we now have old polluting refineries and no new ones in sight because of environmentalists. Ironic, isn't it?

 

[techs]

I think we need to look at what OPEC says with a critical eye.
If crude oil were selling for 22.00 a barrell than gas would be cheap again.
They see an opportunity to keep oil prices high so they are trying to deflect criticism away from their pricing to environmental policies.
IMHO the current high prices are in effect a "punishment" for the Bush attack on Iraq. Traditionally Saudi Arabia is force for moderation in OPEC but now they are leading the charge for higher prices. They were against our invasion of Iraq. They asked our troops to leave Saudi Arabia fter the attack. Now they advocate higher prices.
What I find interesting is that the Bush energy policies which are being criticized as being written by the energy companies has surprise, surprise resulted in the highest energy prices ever.

 

[chess9]

techs:

Oil prices, adjusted for inflation, are not very high. Many businesses are using the rise in prices to justify price increases, but the airline industry, on the other hand, is being squeezed by price wars and rising oil prices. I wouldn't want to own American right now.

-Robert

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: chess9
techs:

Oil prices, adjusted for inflation, are not very high. Many businesses are using the rise in prices to justify price increases, but the airline industry, on the other hand, is being squeezed by price wars and rising oil prices. I wouldn't want to own American right now.

-Robert

yeah, taking a look at it gas prices are way cheaper than they have been in decades, maybe ever. and gas is so much cleaner and better now too.


i'm starting to think real inflation is a myth. there may be things in terms of externalities that i'm not thinking of, but it seems to me not much of anything costs more in real terms than it did years ago.

 

[ReiAyanami]

the reason is oil refineries are owned and operated by monopolies, and why build more when you can create the facade of a shortage to charge more.

the two largest US companies merging to form the US's largest oil company? do you really think they'd pass on the savings to us? do you?

Texxacon

 

[chess9]

ElFenix:

I'm serious about gas prices at least.

You aren't still upset about the Longhorns not making it to the Final Four?
(They need to join the ACC, which is where the REAL basketball is played.)

-Robert