OH, TX Must Win's for Clinton

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: Nebor
I think neither Hillary or Obama are winners when it comes to the general election. Hillary will motivate HUGE amounts of anti-Hillary voters to go to the polls. And if it comes down to Obama vs. McCain, McCain has more cross-party appeal, plus gets the big GOP base who will hold their nose and vote for McCain, even though he's a liberal douchebag.

The point is, the democrats lose with their candidates, but win with McCain.

Based on primary numbers, the Dems are going to have vastly better turnout. McCain wont get the evangelicals to come out, and some of the core republicans dont support him. The only way I see core republicans supporting McCain is if Clinton gets the dem nom, then the GOP base will be out in full force. Either way theres very little chance the Republicans are going to have stonger GOTV campaigns.

For this cycle
Dems have more money
Dems have a a more appealing message
Dems have better GOTV campaigns

 

[Pabster]

Originally posted by: SSSnail
If Hillary drops out, mark my words that we'll have a Republican president comes next year.

--- Bill Clinton

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: loki8481
imo, any candidate running on a promise to withdraw from Iraq in a short time period of either a liar or a fool.

Me and the wife were talking about that yesterday. It's going to be interesting to see how Obama backs off that if he gets elected. I imagine the first sit down meeting with high level CIA and pentagon officials will temper a freshly elected presidents idealism pretty quick.

 

[Train]

Ohio is a tough nut to crack, I think its probably one of (if not the) most politically diverse states in the country.

While it usually tips red in presidential races, its not by much, and thier issues vary wildly.

Obama will probably take the dem nomination, but I dont see him beating McCain in Ohio. The run of the mill conservatives would rather vote for a so-so republican than a socialist democrat.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: loki8481
imo, any candidate running on a promise to withdraw from Iraq in a short time period of either a liar or a fool.

Me and the wife were talking about that yesterday. It's going to be interesting to see how Obama backs off that if he gets elected. I imagine the first sit down meeting with high level CIA and pentagon officials will temper a freshly elected presidents idealism pretty quick.

Boohoo for them. This country has spent far far too long being enslaved to the Pentagon and its special interests. It's nothing less than a harmful form of socialism at gunpoint, cynically sold to the public as "capitalism" and "defense." Nothing is worse IMO than the wingnuts who support a million man standing army, a trillion dollar military budget controlled by clandestine officials and special interests, and our forces spread out to every corner of the globe, but who freak out at the mere mention of UHC as "socialist." Wake up, eh?

Anyway, Obama has not promised a complete withdrawal. That would be infeasible regardless of who is elected. What he has promised is to end Bushie's little "war."

 

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: loki8481
imo, any candidate running on a promise to withdraw from Iraq in a short time period of either a liar or a fool.

They're liars.

Their supporters, those who believe them are the fools.

Fern

No one is offering to withdrawal troops immediately, well Ron Paul does but he doesnt count.

Clinton and Obama have all hedged. They say they will start withdrawaling but doing it safely and only draw down as long as it continues to be safe.

Realistically, we could withdrawal all troops within side 1 year. It would have some consequences if we dont plan on what to do after we leave.

 

[Pabster]

Clinton Sycophant Ed Randell Says "Whites May Not Be Ready To Vote For An African-American"

Yep, desperation hits an all-time high.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: Pabster
Clinton Sycophant Ed Randell Says "Whites May Not Be Ready To Vote For An African-American"

Yep, desperation hits an all-time high.

Somebody better send Rendell the memo, Bill Clinton already tried this line of attack in SC and it didn't work out to well for HRC.

Fern

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: Pabster
Clinton Sycophant Ed Randell Says "Whites May Not Be Ready To Vote For An African-American"

Yep, desperation hits an all-time high.

"I think there are some whites who are probably not ready to vote for an African-American candidate"

are you really going to argue that there's no whites anywhere who might have a problem voting for someone of a different skin color? there's probably even more people who wouldn't vote for a woman and think that bitch hillary should get the hell back in the kitchen... I don't see how either statement would make the person saying it a racist or misogynist.

 

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: Pabster
Clinton Sycophant Ed Randell Says "Whites May Not Be Ready To Vote For An African-American"

Yep, desperation hits an all-time high.

Hes basically calling his party racist.

 

[Pabster]

House Speaker Pelosi 'Leaning' Towards Obama

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: loki8481

Originally posted by: Pabster
Clinton Sycophant Ed Randell Says "Whites May Not Be Ready To Vote For An African-American"

Yep, desperation hits an all-time high.

"I think there are some whites who are probably not ready to vote for an African-American candidate"

are you really going to argue that there's no whites anywhere who might have a problem voting for someone of a different skin color? there's probably even more people who wouldn't vote for a woman and think that bitch hillary should get the hell back in the kitchen... I don't see how either statement would make the person saying it a racist or misogynist.

No, it doesn't make HIM a racist. It makes him a political douchebag.

He's saying too many other white people are racist, that's why you should NOT vote for a black guy.

Fern

 

[Pabster]

New York Hispanics Question Clinton Aide Exit

If she messes up with Hispanics, she's definitely through.

 

[Lemon law]

On the last page I noticed something. The same people who were convinced the republicans
would win the election of 11/06 are now convinced neither Obama or Hillary stand a chance.

 

[jonks]

Originally posted by: loki8481

Originally posted by: Pabster
Clinton Sycophant Ed Randell Says "Whites May Not Be Ready To Vote For An African-American"

Yep, desperation hits an all-time high.

"I think there are some whites who are probably not ready to vote for an African-American candidate"

are you really going to argue that there's no whites anywhere who might have a problem voting for someone of a different skin color? there's probably even more people who wouldn't vote for a woman and think that bitch hillary should get the hell back in the kitchen... I don't see how either statement would make the person saying it a racist or misogynist.

ya beat me. additionally from the link:
"instead of winning by 22 points, I would have won by 17 or so."

Thus, "some" = approx 5% in his opinion. I can't say that's far off. Can you?

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: Lemon law
On the last page I noticed something. The same people who were convinced the republicans
would win the election of 11/06 are now convinced neither Obama or Hillary stand a chance.

who's that? the only ones I remember really thinking that the Reps were going to win in '06 were Bush, Rove, and others who got paid to think it.

 

[Nitemare]

Originally posted by: sirjonk
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23119050/

Regardless of the outcome today, HRC needs to win Ohio and Texas, comfortably even, to stay in it, and even then may not be ahead in pledged delegates unless she does considerably well there.

While I will continue to think Hillary is the better choice, if after the primaries she is behind in pledged delegates, I will not advocate the supers give her the necessary majority as it would be bad for everyone in the party. If at any point it becomes mathematically impossible for her to go to the convention leading in pledged delegates, she should concede. Obama has built up a ton of momentum not only in the primary race, but heading towards november, and a messy infight will only hurt all democrats.

Until such time however, it's still anybody's game.

Well Texas hosts open primaries, so republicans could be voting for Obama just to keep the wicked witch out of the white house

 

[jonks]

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: sirjonk
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23119050/

Regardless of the outcome today, HRC needs to win Ohio and Texas, comfortably even, to stay in it, and even then may not be ahead in pledged delegates unless she does considerably well there.

While I will continue to think Hillary is the better choice, if after the primaries she is behind in pledged delegates, I will not advocate the supers give her the necessary majority as it would be bad for everyone in the party. If at any point it becomes mathematically impossible for her to go to the convention leading in pledged delegates, she should concede. Obama has built up a ton of momentum not only in the primary race, but heading towards november, and a messy infight will only hurt all democrats.

Until such time however, it's still anybody's game.

Well Texas hosts open primaries, so republicans could be voting for Obama just to keep the wicked witch out of the white house

and in closed primary states they could register as democrat and do the same thing i suppose

 

[Nitemare]

Originally posted by: sirjonk

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: sirjonk
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23119050/

Regardless of the outcome today, HRC needs to win Ohio and Texas, comfortably even, to stay in it, and even then may not be ahead in pledged delegates unless she does considerably well there.

While I will continue to think Hillary is the better choice, if after the primaries she is behind in pledged delegates, I will not advocate the supers give her the necessary majority as it would be bad for everyone in the party. If at any point it becomes mathematically impossible for her to go to the convention leading in pledged delegates, she should concede. Obama has built up a ton of momentum not only in the primary race, but heading towards november, and a messy infight will only hurt all democrats.

Until such time however, it's still anybody's game.

Well Texas hosts open primaries, so republicans could be voting for Obama just to keep the wicked witch out of the white house

and in closed primary states they could register as democrat and do the same thing i suppose

that's probably what I'll be doing, but then again who wants to wait at the DMV 2 hours to switch their parties?

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Pabster
Clinton Sycophant Ed Randell Says "Whites May Not Be Ready To Vote For An African-American"

Yep, desperation hits an all-time high.

Pssh, he's no sycophant. He was one of the best mayors and is one of the best governors in the country. He's been a friend to the Clintons for a long time, but you can be a friend without being a sycophant. Sadly enough for America, what he is saying might very well be true. It certainly has historical support. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

I lived in Philadelphia for his tenure as mayor, and my family still lives in Pennsylvania for his governorship. He says what he believes, even when maybe he shouldn't, and this is one of those cases. You guys know as well as I do that there's a good chance there are five percent or so of the population that won't vote for a black guy, and that's exactly what he said. Interesting to see the people who always complain about political correctness flying off the handle on this one.

Pabster, not every person who supports Clinton is some sort of party hack or a paid shill. Your blind hatred of her now has you lashing out at everyone else who could possibly support her. I can't imagine what she could have done to you that would engender this sort of rabid loathing, but... jesus man.

 

[SViscusi]

Originally posted by: loki8481

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: Nebor
I think neither Hillary or Obama are winners when it comes to the general election. Hillary will motivate HUGE amounts of anti-Hillary voters to go to the polls. And if it comes down to Obama vs. McCain, McCain has more cross-party appeal, plus gets the big GOP base who will hold their nose and vote for McCain, even though he's a liberal douchebag.

The point is, the democrats lose with their candidates, but win with McCain.

Heh no. I suggest you get used to hearing "President Obama" because that's what you're going to be hearing all the time starting next year.

I just don't think it will happen. I think McCain has more overall support. Though I would definitely say McCain vs. Obama would be a closer fight than McCain vs. Hillary.

the only thing that gives me pause about Obama is the fact that he's been losing primaries... seems hard to gauge his overall support by swing voters and centrists from caucuses.

He's also been winning primaries, 11 if he sweeps tonight. Obama not being able to win primaries is just b.s. put out by Clinton surrogates.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: SSSnail
If Hillary drops out, mark my words that we'll have a Republican president comes next year.

Obama will crush McCain...

all along I have said Hillary is a liability to the democrats