oh, no he didn't... (Biden)

palehorse

Lifer
Dec 21, 2005
11,521
0
76
On Larry King Live last night, Vice President Joe Biden said Iraq "could be one of the great achievements of this administration. You're going to see 90,000 American troops come marching home by the end of the summer. You're going to see a stable government in Iraq that is actually moving toward a representive government."
LOL! Yeah... right!

Let's get something straight: I will lose my f'n mind if anyone in this administration tries to take credit for anything in Iraq, up to and including the withdrawal.

I do not condone our initial invasion of Iraq, and I'm no fan of Bush; but, everything that has occurred there, including the withdrawal and the SOFA, are solely to the credit of the previous administration's positive efforts (and follies). Obama's admin has done absolutely nothing to alter the course of events and status' that Bush's admin had already refined and set into motion -- nothing.

Biden is quite the jokester, isn't he?
 
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dammitgibs

Senior member
Jan 31, 2009
477
0
0
I love Biden, every time he opens his mouth hilarity ensues. Funny how he and Obama both opposed the surge in Iraq, and they are now following Bush's exit strategy. Not to mention the time when Biden suggested it would be a good idea to divide Iraq up into 3 different parts. Obama has done a good job keeping him away from a microphone but sooner or later he's gonna get out there and make a fool of himself.

Check out the picture on the foxnews page of Biden, classic!
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/02/11/republicans-object-biden-taking-credit-success-iraq/
012210_obiden_doomsday_604x341.jpg
 

Generator

Senior member
Mar 4, 2005
793
0
0
The Republicans have already forgotten that the Great Recession happened with Bush in the presidency. If you actually listened to a Republican you will hear things like "it happened on his watch". So by using voodoo logic of the Republicans, Biden may as well declare victory for Obama.

See thats what happens when politics devolves into this stupidity. Obama in a year is going to start his campaign in full gear. And its going to be headlined with "I won the war when Bush couldn't." Ask al-Maliki, he'll tell you the same!!
 

cganesh75

Elite Member | For Sale/Trade
Super Moderator
Oct 8, 2005
9,542
34
101
hey if Obama is responsible for all those trillions of dollars in debt and deficit, he is responsible for victory in Iraq too
 

RyanPaulShaffer

Diamond Member
Jul 13, 2005
3,434
1
0
Let us also remember that both of these clowns (Obama and Biden) were against the surge.

Exactly. Rush played clip after clip after clip yesterday of Obama and Biden trashing the war in Iraq, saying the surge was wrong, the mission is lost, we have failed, we need to withdraw, etc. Now, all of a sudden, Iraq is a huge victory for the O-Team! :rolleyes:

Someone on their team really needs to inform them about all of the stupid comments they made on camera and on record. Or...maybe not, because every time they open their mouths, it makes them look even more hypocritical and foolish. :D

Sounds fair.

No it doesn't...not at all. Obama and Biden were squarely against the surge and victory in Iraq. They had nothing to do with victory in Iraq. In fact, they hindered it. Many trillions of the debt, however, are on the O-Team. Look at the debt skyrocket in the last year, and look at the projected, official Obama deficits scored based on his new spending agenda. If you think that comment "sounds fair", I suggest you look at the US public debt charts and also revisit some Obama/Biden soundclips circa 2007.

Put the Bush bashing aside and please focus on the facts.
 
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RyanPaulShaffer

Diamond Member
Jul 13, 2005
3,434
1
0

Nope.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:2010_Budget_-_Deficit_and_Debt_Increases.png

Only by 2012 will the Obama debt and deficits be "as good as" Bush's worst debt and deficits! And these are best case projected scenarios with GDP growths that right now look impossible.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Debt_and_Debt_%25_to_GDP_-_2010_Budget.png

Ouch...nope again.

Facts > Bush bashing and Obama excuses

Edit: In before the, "But Wikipedia...!" excuses. First chart has the listed sources as (with links to the .gov documents provided):

2010 Budget: 2010 Budget - See table S9 for debt and S1 for Deficits 2008-2015 and beyond.
2007 CBO Data: CBO Data - See page 12 of 13 for 2007 deficit

Second chart has the source listed as (with link to the .gov document provided):

2010 Budget Summary Tables
 
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Nov 30, 2006
15,456
389
121
Thank you Mr. President...mission accomplished...like Joe says, this is truly one of your greatest achievements!

Now where did I put that bong?
 

QuantumPion

Diamond Member
Jun 27, 2005
6,010
1
76
Let us also remember that Obama was against the war in the first place.

It's easy to be retroactively against something that was popular at first and unpopular later on when you aren't an elected official that has to actually make a vote on the record.
 

heyheybooboo

Diamond Member
Jun 29, 2007
6,278
0
0
LOL! Yeah... right!

Let's get something straight: I will lose my f'n mind if anyone in this administration tries to take credit for anything in Iraq, up to and including the withdrawal.

I do not condone our initial invasion of Iraq, and I'm no fan of Bush; but, everything that has occurred there, including the withdrawal and the SOFA, are solely to the credit of the previous administration's positive efforts (and follies). Obama's admin has done absolutely nothing to alter the course of events and status' that Bush's admin had already refined and set into motion -- nothing.

Biden is quite the jokester, isn't he?

Not defending Biden but your 'partisanship' is showing, PH.

Biden is one of the few who recognize the bottom line in Iraq. Without the complete integration of the 'competing' interests into a representative gov't (including former members of the Ba'ath Party who were not Saddams 'guys'), Iraq will remain a cauldron of Fail.

Nouri al-Maliki has led a blanket purge, or blacklist, of hundreds of Sunni election candidates. Even Jalal Talabani (a Kurd) has questioned the legitimacy of the vetting panel (supported by al-Maliki) that issued the blacklist.

Biden is not 'taking sides' but has tried to work with Iraq to improve the legitimacy of the upcoming election in March.

So. Troll on, PH.





--
 

CallMeJoe

Diamond Member
Jul 30, 2004
6,938
5
81
It's easy to be retroactively against something that was popular at first and unpopular later on when you aren't an elected official that has to actually make a vote on the record.
That might be a valid criticism had State Senator Obama not gone on the record at the time with his opposition to the war, at a time when it would have been more politically prudent to say nothing and see which way the wind would blow.
 

Robor

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
16,979
0
76
It's easy to be retroactively against something that was popular at first and unpopular later on when you aren't an elected official that has to actually make a vote on the record.

Retroactively?

Quoted for perspective...

Against Going to War with Iraq (2002)
by Barack Obama​

Delivered on Wednesday, October 2, 2002 by Barack Obama, Illinois State Senator, at the first high-profile Chicago anti-Iraq war rally (organized by Chicagoans Against War in Iraq) at noon in Federal Plaza in Chicago, Illinois; at the same day and hour that President Bush and Congress announced their agreement on the joint resolution authorizing the Iraq War, but over a week before it was passed by either body of Congress.


Good afternoon. Let me begin by saying that although this has been billed as an anti-war rally, I stand before you as someone who is not opposed to war in all circumstances.

The Civil War was one of the bloodiest in history, and yet it was only through the crucible of the sword, the sacrifice of multitudes, that we could begin to perfect this union, and drive the scourge of slavery from our soil. I don’t oppose all wars.

My grandfather signed up for a war the day after Pearl Harbor was bombed, fought in Patton’s army. He saw the dead and dying across the fields of Europe; he heard the stories of fellow troops who first entered Auschwitz and Treblinka. He fought in the name of a larger freedom, part of that arsenal of democracy that triumphed over evil, and he did not fight in vain.

I don’t oppose all wars.

After September 11th, after witnessing the carnage and destruction, the dust and the tears, I supported this Administration’s pledge to hunt down and root out those who would slaughter innocents in the name of intolerance, and I would willingly take up arms myself to prevent such a tragedy from happening again.

I don’t oppose all wars. And I know that in this crowd today, there is no shortage of patriots, or of patriotism. What I am opposed to is a dumb war. What I am opposed to is a rash war. What I am opposed to is the cynical attempt by Richard Perle and Paul Wolfowitz and other arm-chair, weekend warriors in this Administration to shove their own ideological agendas down our throats, irrespective of the costs in lives lost and in hardships borne.

What I am opposed to is the attempt by political hacks like Karl Rove to distract us from a rise in the uninsured, a rise in the poverty rate, a drop in the median income — to distract us from corporate scandals and a stock market that has just gone through the worst month since the Great Depression.

That’s what I’m opposed to. A dumb war. A rash war. A war based not on reason but on passion, not on principle but on politics.

Now let me be clear — I suffer no illusions about Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal man. A ruthless man. A man who butchers his own people to secure his own power. He has repeatedly defied UN resolutions, thwarted UN inspection teams, developed chemical and biological weapons, and coveted nuclear capacity.

He’s a bad guy. The world, and the Iraqi people, would be better off without him.

But I also know that Saddam poses no imminent and direct threat to the United States, or to his neighbors, that the Iraqi economy is in shambles, that the Iraqi military a fraction of its former strength, and that in concert with the international community he can be contained until, in the way of all petty dictators, he falls away into the dustbin of history.

I know that even a successful war against Iraq will require a US occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences. I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the Middle East, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of al-Qaeda.

I am not opposed to all wars. I’m opposed to dumb wars.

So for those of us who seek a more just and secure world for our children, let us send a clear message to the president today. You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s finish the fight with Bin Laden and al-Qaeda, through effective, coordinated intelligence, and a shutting down of the financial networks that support terrorism, and a homeland security program that involves more than color-coded warnings.

You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s fight to make sure that the UN inspectors can do their work, and that we vigorously enforce a non-proliferation treaty, and that former enemies and current allies like Russia safeguard and ultimately eliminate their stores of nuclear material, and that nations like Pakistan and India never use the terrible weapons already in their possession, and that the arms merchants in our own country stop feeding the countless wars that rage across the globe.

You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s fight to make sure our so-called allies in the Middle East, the Saudis and the Egyptians, stop oppressing their own people, and suppressing dissent, and tolerating corruption and inequality, and mismanaging their economies so that their youth grow up without education, without prospects, without hope, the ready recruits of terrorist cells.

You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s fight to wean ourselves off Middle East oil, through an energy policy that doesn’t simply serve the interests of Exxon and Mobil.

Those are the battles that we need to fight. Those are the battles that we willingly join. The battles against ignorance and intolerance, corruption and greed, poverty and despair.

The consequences of war are dire, the sacrifices immeasurable. We may have occasion in our lifetime to once again rise up in defense of our freedom, and pay the wages of war. But we ought not — we will not — travel down that hellish path blindly. Nor should we allow those who would march off and pay the ultimate sacrifice, who would prove the full measure of devotion with their blood, to make such an awful sacrifice in vain.

-Delivered on Wednesday, October 2, 2002
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
Once again, its long past time, to once again debunk the myth that the SURGE caused Iraq to straighten around. When in fact, the surge envisioned by GWB was a totally busted play.

What straightened out Iraq was various backdoor deals made with various Sunnis leaders.
And once the level of violence came down, Iraq could start to rebuild.

As for the Iraqi withdrawal date we are committed to, its not like its something GWB gets credit for, but when GWB made such botches of his twin quagmires, it was the international community acting through the UN that refused an extension of the US occupation of Iraq. So the USA had to set a schedule to leave.

But food for thought, Obama has done a fairly decent job of making sure Iraq does not go off the tracks, but if Cheney were still in office, I wonder if he would be engineering some sort of monkey business in Iraq to extend the US occupation.
 

feralkid

Lifer
Jan 28, 2002
16,843
4,941
136
If anyone can get us out of the useless cluster-fuck that is "Operation Iraqi Freedom, they deserve full credit.


Palehorse, you defy logic...Do you actually think the fool who marched us into that mess should somehow get "credit" for ending this disaster?


Dreamworld living at affordable rates!
 

CADsortaGUY

Lifer
Oct 19, 2001
25,162
1
76
www.ShawCAD.com
Once again, its long past time, to once again debunk the myth that the SURGE caused Iraq to straighten around. When in fact, the surge envisioned by GWB was a totally busted play.

What straightened out Iraq was various backdoor deals made with various Sunnis leaders.
And once the level of violence came down, Iraq could start to rebuild.

As for the Iraqi withdrawal date we are committed to, its not like its something GWB gets credit for, but when GWB made such botches of his twin quagmires, it was the international community acting through the UN that refused an extension of the US occupation of Iraq. So the USA had to set a schedule to leave.

But food for thought, Obama has done a fairly decent job of making sure Iraq does not go off the tracks, but if Cheney were still in office, I wonder if he would be engineering some sort of monkey business in Iraq to extend the US occupation.

And the revisionism has started...
 
Nov 30, 2006
15,456
389
121
Once again, its long past time, to once again debunk the myth that the SURGE caused Iraq to straighten around. When in fact, the surge envisioned by GWB was a totally busted play.

What straightened out Iraq was various backdoor deals made with various Sunnis leaders.
And once the level of violence came down, Iraq could start to rebuild.

As for the Iraqi withdrawal date we are committed to, its not like its something GWB gets credit for, but when GWB made such botches of his twin quagmires, it was the international community acting through the UN that refused an extension of the US occupation of Iraq. So the USA had to set a schedule to leave.

But food for thought, Obama has done a fairly decent job of making sure Iraq does not go off the tracks, but if Cheney were still in office, I wonder if he would be engineering some sort of monkey business in Iraq to extend the US occupation.
So you're the one who stole my bong !!!
 

Orignal Earl

Diamond Member
Oct 27, 2005
8,059
55
86
LOL! Yeah... right!



I do not condone our initial invasion of Iraq, and I'm no fan of Bush; but, everything that has occurred there, including the withdrawal and the SOFA, are solely to the credit of the previous administration's positive efforts (and follies). Obama's admin has done absolutely nothing to alter the course of events and status' that Bush's admin had already refined and set into motion -- nothing.

Agreed
The total mess that Iraq is STILL in is totally Bush's fault

Feb 12 Iraq expels 250 ex-Blackwater staff
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2010/02/2010211193234658851.html
Feb 12 Five killed as U.S., Iraqi troops raid border village.Provincial Iraqi officials said many of the dead were innocent bystanders, and demanded compensation.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE61B24Y20100212
Feb 10 Iraq Oil Line Bombed; Output Drops
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/11/world/middleeast/11baghdad.html
Feb 8 Former Iraq PM: poll ban risks civil war
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6173KS20100208
Feb 6 Shia group posts video of US man abducted man in Iraq
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8502112.stm
Feb 3 Iraq bombing kills at least 20 as pilgrims converge on Karbala
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/02/03/AR2010020300415.html?hpid=topnews
Feb 6 40 Dead in Iraq Bombing
http://www.thedailybeast.com/cheat-sheet/item/40-dead-in-iraq-bombing/terror/?cid=hp:justposted2
Jan 25 Bomb Attacks On Iraq Hotels Kill At Least 36
http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Wo...owntown_Hotel_District_In_The_Capital_Of_Iraq

And of course the list goes on and on
I would recommend a lot of you guys should set your homepage to google news for a month
Wake up every morning and take a gander of the shit hole Iraq still is and will be for along time
Is this what Americans will settle for victories ?
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,133
38
91
I love Biden, every time he opens his mouth hilarity ensues. Funny how he and Obama both opposed the surge in Iraq, and they are now following Bush's exit strategy. Not to mention the time when Biden suggested it would be a good idea to divide Iraq up into 3 different parts. Obama has done a good job keeping him away from a microphone but sooner or later he's gonna get out there and make a fool of himself.

Check out the picture on the foxnews page of Biden, classic!
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/02/11/republicans-object-biden-taking-credit-success-iraq/
012210_obiden_doomsday_604x341.jpg

What the fuck is on top of his head? It looks like lint.