I think its a valid point.. there are quite a few people here who absolutely hate Israel and would prefer they not exist. I don't see how me pointing that out is an issue, its a fact.
*Raises Hand*
I think I'll buy it (if I can) just because of what they said. And I don't even use Linux. I'll just buy it to support the dude.
What are the reasons for the hatred? It is one thing to disagree with the Israeli Government and it's policies but an entirely different thing to want to wipe an entire nation off the face of the Earth. I suspect these people are nothing more but racist and anti-Semites. It seems parts of Western Europe and parts of the US are embracing anti-Semitism once again out of pure hatred of the Jews and nothing more.
If you want to blame some one for the mess in the Middle East, the UN is squarely responsible for creating the Nation of Israel, along with the UK and the US. The Palestinians were after all offered the same nation status, but their leaders refused to compromise. It was a policy disaster that many warned would come to just this back in 1948.
The best solution for this policy disaster is to get the voices of moderation on both sides to the table, though I doubt seriously that will happen. The radicals on both sides are holding the peace process hostage, and it is a damned shame.
@ Perknose: Thanks for the complement, I highly appreciate it. :beer:
you're putting words in people's mouths if you say they hate Israel.
and if it makes you feel better to do that - it's your way of dealing with an unpleasant part of Israel's history - knock yourself out. just don't tell the rest of use that you have any sincerity about "human rights".
as far as why people disapprove of Israel's foreign policy, it's because of a history of incidents like the Lavon Affair.
genuine Israel-sponsored false flag terrorism, nothing theoretical about it.
"The Lavon Affair refers to the scandal over a failed Israeli covert operation in Egypt known as Operation Susannah, in which Israeli military intelligence planted bombs in Egyptian, American and British-owned targets in Egypt in the summer of 1954 in the hopes that "the Muslim Brotherhood, the Communists, 'unspecified malcontents' or 'local nationalists'" would be blamed.[1] It became known as the Lavon Affair after the Israeli defense minister Pinhas Lavon, who was forced to resign because of the incident, or euphemistically as the Unfortunate Affair (Hebrew: ???? ?????, HaEsek HaBish). Egypt retaliated against its Jewish community. The spies acted seemingly without Prime Minister Moshe Sharett's knowledge, and Prime Minister David Ben-Gurion would later resign from his post after being unable to get the full investigation he insisted on.[2] Israel admitted responsibility in 2005 when Israeli President Moshe Katzav honored the nine Egyptian Jewish agents who were involved.[3]"
from that bastion of Israel-disappoval, Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavon_Affair
and if it makes you feel better to do that - it's your way of dealing with an unpleasant part of Israel's history - knock yourself out. just don't tell the rest of use that you have any sincerity about "human rights".
as far as why people disapprove of Israel's foreign policy, it's because of a history of incidents like the Lavon Affair.
genuine Israel-sponsored false flag terrorism, nothing theoretical about it.
"The Lavon Affair refers to the scandal over a failed Israeli covert operation in Egypt known as Operation Susannah, in which Israeli military intelligence planted bombs in Egyptian, American and British-owned targets in Egypt in the summer of 1954 in the hopes that "the Muslim Brotherhood, the Communists, 'unspecified malcontents' or 'local nationalists'" would be blamed.[1] It became known as the Lavon Affair after the Israeli defense minister Pinhas Lavon, who was forced to resign because of the incident, or euphemistically as the Unfortunate Affair (Hebrew: ???? ?????, HaEsek HaBish). Egypt retaliated against its Jewish community. The spies acted seemingly without Prime Minister Moshe Sharett's knowledge, and Prime Minister David Ben-Gurion would later resign from his post after being unable to get the full investigation he insisted on.[2] Israel admitted responsibility in 2005 when Israeli President Moshe Katzav honored the nine Egyptian Jewish agents who were involved.[3]"
from that bastion of Israel-disappoval, Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavon_Affair
kylebisme
Diamond Member
- Mar 25, 2000
- 9,396
- 0
- 0
That would be a rather superficial attempt at slander, especially considering neo-Nazis have been suppressing their Judophobia and cheering on Israel's conquest of Palestine. Granted, even the Nazis themselves supported the Zionist cause. On the other hand, there are progressive Jews who condemn Israel's conquest of Palestine, and some who even go so far as to call for boycotting Israel. Just to drive the point home, here is a Jewish member of British parliament compairing Israeli's policies to that of Nazis.
Rather Israel has been blocading Gaza since they withdrew to it's boarders and holding the rest of Palestinian terrtory under martial law while colonizing it constantly over the course of decades, killing thousands of Palestinians every year, as demonstrated by the statistics here, click the figures for details.
And if people were holding your homeland under military occupation while colonizing it out from under you, what would you expect then?
As RandomStuff went on to explain, both sides are predominately in favor of peaceful resolution, as evidenced by countless polls, this being one example. It is the extremists on both sides who are flat-out wrong, and ignoring one side while pointing fingers at the other is wrong too.
You left out the two-state solution. It isn't easy or perfect, but the most pragmatic solution available by any reasonable account I've seen. That is what our US government officially endorses as it has for decades, though not so far as to vote in favor if it at the UN as the vast majority of the world does every year. Granted, our media ignores that solution, and it seems most of our population does as well. Why do you ignore it?
I think you made a respectable effort to avoid bias and appreciate your comments and agree with you on much of what you said. However, I do want to point out that this isn't simply an issue of past mistakes but rather the ongoing colonization of the West Bank while your government holds the Palestinian territories and the millions of people living there under it's control. In effect, while Israelis in general want peace, the extremists who run your government, Likud to Labor, while some playing lip service to peace more than others, have been actively wiping Palestine off the map in their quest for "Greater Israel" with settlement population increasing much faster than that of that within Israel and over 40% of the West Bank now under full Israeli control.
As for Egypt and Jordan, their dictators play friendly with Israel, but their populations watching Israel's ongoing conquest of what little is left of Palestine is further radicalising their populations all the time. That simply isn't a sustainable situation in the long run.
Also, the teaching of propoganda is an issue on both sides, see "Reports on Palestinian kids? hatred grossly exaggerated". From the article, a note on the teaching of propoganda in Israeli textbooks:
Though it is worth noting that more recently in Israel has been improving their textbooks, at least outside of ultra-Orthodox circles. Regardless, there is much confusion and animosity on both sides, and the rest of the world needs to take a stand and resolve this conflict, for the sake of the majorities on both sides and the world at large.
I won't be recommending Mint until Clem 'mans-up' to his mistake!
All Clem did was puss out, start his own blog, and try to deflect damage away from the Official LM site. He's STILL telling Israel supports to quit using Mint, blah, blah, blah...
And, IMHO, his 'mistake' was NOT holding extreme views and acting on it - it was mixing politics with OS!
There's always a certain amount of in-fighting with developers, but Clem has taken it to a whole new level... and, in the process, damaged not only his reputation but the cause(s) for which he has supposedly done this.
I didn't give two woots about Palestinians before this happened, but now I'm pissed off at the prospect of being viewed as supporting them by using Linux Mint!
If I continue to use Mint, I'm not only going to be put in the position of defending it against Mint Haters, but political hacks on both sides of the Middle East dilemma.
I know what's gonna happen...
"He's a Jew hating Linux Mint troll. Don't pay any attention to him!"
Or...
"Yeah, and the only reason he doesn't recommend Mac OS X is because he's homophobic!"
This whole thing, that Clem started, he sooo bad!!! :thumbsdown:
Originally posted by: VinDSL
I *think* Bill meant political views shouldn't be a requisite for using an OS... or not!
LoL!
Can you imagine if Bill Gates or Steve Jobs had said this?
Ya, LOL! Can you imagine if IBM had said they didn't want to sell the Nazis their machinery to be used as an essential tool for efficiency in the Holocaust? Politics has no place!
Or more symbolically, that idiot democrat John Mellenkamp among other musicians who said they didn't want the John McCain campaign using his songs at their campaign events.
JohnOfSheffield
Lifer
- Jun 26, 2007
- 11,925
- 2
- 0
Israel is right and he can go fuck himself, i wouldn't use that fuckjob of a distro based on a distro that is a fuckjob of another distro even if i had to. I'd rather go back to pen and paper than using that frustration of bullsheit.
Go to the source, Debian Sid is faster, newer and if you don't know how to fucking configure your desktop then don't use a computer.
Go to the source, Debian Sid is faster, newer and if you don't know how to fucking configure your desktop then don't use a computer.
Or, the US could support the UN and put its pressure on both sides to make the compromises needed for an actual peace deal.
JohnOfSheffield
Lifer
- Jun 26, 2007
- 11,925
- 2
- 0
It's the preferred operating system of all NATO forces, including the US, UK and other elite forces communication systems.
So it is a security blanket, but not for peanuts, for sane human beings who are sick and tired of botching systems because they let their men use google.
JohnOfSheffield
Lifer
- Jun 26, 2007
- 11,925
- 2
- 0
You don't know shit abut the UN, do you? I used to work for the UN in three different locations and i can tell you one thing, the UN is absolutely nothing without the support of it's member states.
The US fucked that up royally even though it was originally put forth by the US as a continuance of the League of nations.
Hell even people that hate Bush believe that they should crawl on their knees to US commands and if they don't, they are useless.
Truth is, the UN armed forces have done a LOT of good, WAY more than the US could everh hope for and their efforts in crisis areas are second to NONE, absolutely fucking NONE.
The US can't do shit about the UN and that is why Americans don't like the UN, it works as a democracy among countries and Americans are all about nationalism, not patriotism, nationalism.
Once again, you post something in agreement with what I said, as an attack on what I said.
I'd ask what you think you said that disagreed, but your head might explode trying.
JohnOfSheffield
Lifer
- Jun 26, 2007
- 11,925
- 2
- 0
Did you EVER in your arrogant mindset consider that what you wrote could be the opposite of my reply you stupid fucking twat?
You think the US can pressure the UN if they participated, my reply was a NO to that one with added insults because your daft self deserved just that for being an arrogant twat.
I don't answer to that, but you should, but to answer the question, yes, I considered it, and then applying the reading comprehension you so terribly lack, rejected it as wrong.
Your failure here was to misread what I wrote for the US to "SUPPORT" the UN to pursue peace betwen the parties - you know the word support, the same word YOU used:
My post: "Or, the US could support the UN "
Your post: "the UN is absolutely nothing without the support of it's (sic) member states."
Now, crawl back under your rock until you learn to sht the hell up before engaging your brain. I agree with your post on the *issue*, or more accurately, you agree with mine.
But you are an obnoxious idiot as you fail to comrepehend the simple post I wrote.
I did not call for the US to pressure the UN - I called for the US and the UN to pressure both sides in the Israel-Palestenian conflict to compromise and reach a peace agreement.
As predicted, you failed to find any point on which your post disagreed with mine. It's always interesting to see buffoons who have to fight with people they are agreeing with.
You have posted before how you 'blow off steam' posting here. If making a fool of yuourself helps you sleep at night, that's your business, but that's what you are doing.
There is no correlation to it being "libbies." Of course, you already knew that.
Just more trolling. The ban is definitely needed.
I can think of another land where people migrated, and where the natives were systematically pushed out bit by bit over a period of decades - because after all, god was on their side. The native population resisted by means we would today label terrorism, disparate tribes banded together against their common enemy, and many peace deals over the years were struck and then violated by both sides. But the natives simply didnt have the military technology or strength to hold back the migrants forever. Over many generations, the status quo slowly creeped to where it was hardly clear who was the natives, but it was clear who "won" in the end.
On the whole, right or wrong seems to depend almost entirely on which side you're on. And how could it ever be any other way?
But who am I to complain or moralize about imperialism? It's great when you're on the winning end.
On the whole, right or wrong seems to depend almost entirely on which side you're on. And how could it ever be any other way?
But who am I to complain or moralize about imperialism? It's great when you're on the winning end.
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