Official "Marijuana is legal in CA" Countdown Thread ***UPDATE: California Sucks***

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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
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Narmer

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2006
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Class. Do you have any? You're acting like this is a sports game, and the losers are being poor sports.

The losers aren't being poor sports. They're appalled that in this day and age, there are still people like you.

I don't think you've answered any of my questions. Do you drink alcohol? Have you ever drank alcohol? Do you support the prohibition of alcohol?

If you can answer no/no/yes, I support your views even if I disagree with them. If you answer yes/yes/no, then I do not support your "loser lifestyle". Two can play that game. I loathe alcohol. I think it's a terrible, terrible drug. And I think that if you drink alcohol, you're a loser.

:rolleyes:

Sorry but I don't feel sorry for losers. Worse are sore losers. I laugh at those. They are in this thread and complain about how America doesn't "get it".
 

Narmer

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2006
5,292
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Narmer,

Answer me one thing. What gives you the right to determine what I can and cannot ingest? I think that is the bottom line here.

What is the point of a law that doesn't work? What is the point of a law that costs taxpayers untold amounts of money - for nothing? It has never been hard to get marijuana. It will never be hard to get marijuana. Instead of forcing it underground, why don't we tax the fuck out of it and make some money rather than spending money in a failed attempt to enforce it?

You said that the reason it shouldn't be legal is because of all the stoners. You mean all of the stoners that exist right now? Your coworkers, neighbors, possibly even friends? Just like the people who use alcohol, the vast majority of people that use marijuana are normal people that contribute to society.

Do you think S&M should be banned? I don't identify with pain and suffering when it comes to sex, but I'm not going to say that other people can't do it. If you cannot see the hypocrisy that is alcohol being legal while marijuana is not, then you are blind and ignorant. Please, at least tell me that you want alcohol to be illegal also....

Who is the smart one around here? My arguments are a lot more thought out and logical than "It's a gateway drug", "there will be a lot of stoners". Can you please think for yourself instead of repeating the same illogical garbage that you were fed?
The republic gives you the right. Don't like it, change the laws via democratic means? Still don't like the results? Leave.
 

Narmer

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2006
5,292
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these were posted in clinics. I haven't been there, because I don't smoke MMJ. Those publishing anti-prop 19 arguments are professed members of the industry, as well.


again, the point is that despite all of the other factors (I know them, talked about them AT THE BEGINNING OF THIS THREAD YOU FUCKING CLUELESS DOLT), what really pushed this over are the people that would actually benefit from this legislation having been convinced to vote against it.

THAT'S THE FUCKING POINT. the slim margin would have easily been overcome by the kids that don't vote for anything (except Obama), and the users that were afraid they would lose their supply.

I never said anything about other issues (typical naivete and ignorance, which you understand in spades) not being a major factor. The simple fact that a large number of users--representing that losing margin--having voted against it, is crucial.

HOW DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND THIS WERE YOU DROPPED ON YOUR HEAD AS A BABY DID YOU EAT PAINT CHIPS OR SOMETHING?

Would've. Could've. Should've. That changes nothing.
Get over yourself.
 

Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,418
1,599
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The republic gives you the right. Don't like it, change the laws via democratic means? Still don't like the results? Leave.

nah it's cool. I'll stay in CA, buy my unregulated weed from some mexican cartel, cutting out the state board of equalization.

if I get caught, it'll be no worse than getting a parking ticket.


status quo FTW.
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
50,419
8
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The republic gives you the right. Don't like it, change the laws via democratic means? Still don't like the results? Leave

...

Uhh.. Duh? Isn't that what we're trying to do? lol

The republic doesn't give me the right. I have the right as a human being.

It's not like a 7% loss is a crushing defeat. The sad thing is that you're so against this, when it being illegal doesn't mean anything.. Nothing will change.

How can you deny that legalizing it is a step in the right direction? It doesn't matter if the money made off taxation isn't going to solve California's budget crisis. Obviously, it will not. But it is still a step in the right direction. It is a positive change because we can stop spending money on failed enforcement and start making at least some back from taxation. How is this a bad thing?!
 
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Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,418
1,599
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How can you deny that legalizing it is a step in the right direction? It doesn't matter if the money made off taxation isn't going to solve California's budget crisis. Obviously, it will not. But it is still a step in the right direction. It is a positive change because we can stop spending money on failed enforcement and start making at least some back from taxation. How is this a bad thing?!

Narmer: It's govt job to protect us from ourselves. So stop smoking and do the other million legal things that'll kill you instead. Here, have a McRib.

:mcrib:
 

Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,418
1,599
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Holy shit, cooley is going to lose

praise jesus. I don't even give a fuck about prop 19 anymore.


Harris , Kamala Dem 3,292,836 46%
Cooley , Steve GOP 3,277,998 46%
California - 24845 of 24845 Precincts Reporting - 100%
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,125
30,076
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Would've. Could've. Should've. That changes nothing.
Get over yourself.

you're right, it doesn't change anything. just less revenue..

oh, and I'll now choose to buy weed from Mexican drug cartels, to further fuel the drug violence.

oh, and terrorism. yes terrorism.

--you continue to ignore the debate here, so I'll just start making shit up, too, play along with you. rofl.
 

Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,418
1,599
126
oh, and I'll now choose to buy weed from Mexican drug cartels, to further fuel the drug violence.

oh, and terrorism. yes terrorism.

everytime you smoke a blunt al qaeda kills a camel. please, think of the camels.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,125
30,076
146
Oh, here's an argument:

CDB has been proven to kill tumor cells. It actually ignores healthy cells.

Therefore, Narmer loves cancer. This is the only logical reason that he would support prop 19. He wants to keep cancer alive! keep cancer alive! keep cancer alive!

:awe:
 

Narmer

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2006
5,292
0
0
...

Uhh.. Duh? Isn't that what we're trying to do? lol

The republic doesn't give me the right. I have the right as a human being.

It's not like a 7% loss is a crushing defeat. The sad thing is that you're so against this, when it being illegal doesn't mean anything.. Nothing will change.

How can you deny that legalizing it is a step in the right direction? It doesn't matter if the money made off taxation isn't going to solve California's budget crisis. Obviously, it will not. But it is still a step in the right direction. It is a positive change.
you are given rights, otherwise what you do would mostly be illegal. And I'm a Texan living in New York City. If the people of California had voted for this I wouldn't have had any problems with it either. But I would've enjoyed seein the Federal Government squeezing the genie back into the bottle.

For the record, I rarely drink and I've smoked twice in my life. I don't mind people doing these things but I would never advocate people doing them. They're just not good. If it was up to me, all the people that drank alcohol and smoked and did other things that were knowingly bad for their health would be forced to pay for their health bills out of pocket. No subsidy in any form (because the general public and government would be subsidizing their medical bills). If you are an adult of legal age you should know better. If you decide to continue destroying your body anyway, no one should help you lengthen your life. No compassion for the stupid.
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
50,419
8
81
Oh, here's an argument:

CDB has been proven to kill tumor cells. It actually ignores healthy cells.

Therefore, Narmer loves cancer. This is the only logical reason that he would support prop 19. He wants to keep cancer alive! keep cancer alive! keep cancer alive!

:awe:

:thumbsup:

:D
 

Narmer

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2006
5,292
0
0
you're right, it doesn't change anything. just less revenue..

oh, and I'll now choose to buy weed from Mexican drug cartels, to further fuel the drug violence.

oh, and terrorism. yes terrorism.

--you continue to ignore the debate here, so I'll just start making shit up, too, play along with you. rofl.
Ahh liberals. So long as the Mexican drug wars kill in Mexico, I don't give a fuck. Your heart may bleed for them but mine doesn't. When they bring their war over the border then we can get our 51st state.
 

Narmer

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2006
5,292
0
0
fucking hypocrite

government should ban alcohol because government needs to protect you from yourself.
Actually, you're partially right. Government needs to protect people from themselves. Some may not like to hear this but it is no different from a parent-child relationship sometimes.
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
50,419
8
81
you are given rights, otherwise what you do would mostly be illegal. And I'm a Texan living in New York City. If the people of California had voted for this I wouldn't have had any problems with it either. But I would've enjoyed seein the Federal Government squeezing the genie back into the bottle.

For the record, I rarely drink and I've smoked twice in my life. I don't mind people doing these things but I would never advocate people doing them. They're just not good. If it was up to me, all the people that drank alcohol and smoked and did other things that were knowingly bad for their health would be forced to pay for their health bills out of pocket. No subsidy in any form (because the general public and government would be subsidizing their medical bills). If you are an adult of legal age you should know better. If you decide to continue destroying your body anyway, no one should help you. No compassion for the stupid.


Well, now I'm confounded because at least you appear to be consistent.

For the record, I am not advocating that people smoke just because I want it legalized. There is a distinct difference. I have always preached that the key to drug use prevention is education. That encompasses all drugs - legal, illegal and prescription alike.

I want it legalized because the needless torment of our own citizens needs to stop. I want it legalized because I believe it is my right as a human being to be able to ingest what I want to ingest, whether that be coffee, cigarettes, alcohol, LSD, marijuana, mushrooms, etc. I want it legalized because I see money being wasted on a failed a attempt at enforcement when instead we could be making money off of taxation, and nothing would change - except the fact that we aren't spending money prosecuting people for a victimless crime. Again - those that want to smoke marijuana are going to. Just like the people that want to drink alcohol are going to. I don't like alcohol, but I don't think people should be prohibited from drinking it.

I completely agree with you that people who destroy themselves should have to pay for their health care out of their own pockets.

There's one big problem with that viewpoint when it comes to marijuana, though - marijuana does not, and can not kill you. You can't say the same for alcohol. You can't even say the same for Tylenol.

This post is the most intelligent, thought provoking paragraph you've provided in the entire thread. I think we're starting to get somewhere now.

Do you realize that there are many scientists that believe that the desire to alter our state of consciousness is part of our evolution? Humans have been doing it since the beginning of our timeline. There is a reason generally lawful people(like myself) blatantly ignore such laws, laws that seem to go against the very foundation of what makes us human.

Again, the key to preventing people from wanting to do drugs is education. True education, not lies, like DARE. What happens when kids grow up and they realize that they've been lied to? They try things. Or worse, they don't realize it and continue to bleat the same lies over and over.

Again, I have never tried a hard drug like cocaine, meth or heroin and I never will. Why? Because I don't want to. I know how bad they are.

That's what you're missing here. Someone who smokes marijuana is not a loser by default, just like someone who drinks alcohol or smokes cigarettes is not a loser by default. They're just people, suffering from the human condition.

*shrug*
 

Narmer

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2006
5,292
0
0
Well, now I'm confounded because at least you appear to be consistent.

For the record, I am not advocating that people smoke just because I want it legalized. There is a distinct difference. I have always preached that the key to drug use prevention is education. That encompasses all drugs - legal, illegal and prescription alike.

I want it legalized because the needless torment of our own citizens needs to stop. I want it legalized because I believe it is my right as a human being to be able to ingest what I want to ingest, whether that be coffee, cigarettes, alcohol, LSD, marijuana, mushrooms, etc. I want it legalized because I see money being wasted on a failed a attempt at enforcement when instead we could be making money off of taxation, and nothing would change - except the fact that we aren't spending money prosecuting people for a victimless crime. Again - those that want to smoke marijuana are going to. Just like the people that want to drink alcohol are going to. I don't like alcohol, but I don't think people should be prohibited from drinking it.

I completely agree with you that people who destroy themselves should have to pay for their health care out of their own pockets.

There's one big problem with that viewpoint when it comes to marijuana, though - marijuana does not, and can not kill you. You can't say the same for alcohol. You can't even say the same for Tylenol.

This post is the most intelligent, thought provoking paragraph you've provided in the entire thread. I think we're starting to get somewhere now.

Do you realize that there are many scientists that believe that the desire to alter our state of consciousness is part of our evolution? Humans have been doing it since the beginning of our timeline. There is a reason generally lawful people(like myself) blatantly ignore such laws, laws that seem to go against the very foundation of what makes us human.

Again, the key to preventing people from wanting to do drugs is education. True education, not lies, like DARE. What happens when kids grow up and they realize that they've been lied to? They try things. Or worse, they don't realize it and continue to bleat the same lies over and over.

Again, I have never tried a hard drug like cocaine, meth or heroin and I never will. Why? Because I don't want to. I know how bad they are.

That's what you're missing here. Someone who smokes marijuana is not a loser by default, just like someone who drinks alcohol or smokes cigarettes is not a loser by default. They're just people, suffering from the human condition.

*shrug*
I am a very abstract person so here goes.

You should not have the right to do whatever you want to yourself simply because it's your body. There are after-affects. Here is a simple example. If you have a family and decided to swallow a box of needles and die. Now your family will encounter disharmony and others will have to take care of them. If you did not want the responsibility of a family you should not have had them. Of course, in today's world anyone can do such a thing but my point is that it would put a drag on society. Something similar happens when people do drugs. It can bring disharmony to their family and the larger society. That is one reason why government disallows it. Becuase it reduces your productivity, increases the costs to society, it is deemed harmful. Do you really think government cares if it wasn't affecting government's ability to function and costs? This is why suicide and most drugs are illegal.

I'm sure that if government could find a way to lower the costs and increase the benefits of some of these drugs (not just revenue but safety) then it would do so. However, as they stand, they are unattractive endeavours.
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
50,419
8
81
I am a very abstract person so here goes.

You should not have the right to do whatever you want to yourself simply because it's your body. There are after-affects. Here is a simple example. If you have a family and decided to swallow a box of needles and die. Now your family will encounter disharmony and others will have to take care of them. If you did not want the responsibility of a family you should not have had them. Of course, in today's world anyone can do such a thing but my point is that it would put a drag on society. Something similar happens when people do drugs. It can bring disharmony to their family and the larger society. That is one reason why government disallows it. Becuase it reduces your productivity, increases the costs to society, it is deemed harmful. Do you really think government cares if it wasn't affecting government's ability to function and costs? This is why suicide and most drugs are illegal.

I'm sure that if government could find a way to lower the costs and increase the benefits of some of these drugs (not just revenue but safety) then it would do so. However, as they stand, they are unattractive endeavours.

I completely agree with everything you've said here in principle.

The problem is that alcohol and cigarettes are legal. Alcohol alone causes far more pain and suffering on a societal level than marijuana ever has. I know that is anecdotal, but it does not take much thought to realize this. People do not smoke a bowl and drive, only to mow down a family. Marijuana does not make you violent like alcohol does. Marijuana does not cause cancer like tobacco does. Would you agree that these statements are true?

If so, what are we supposed to do about it? There is disharmony, as you put it, in our laws. Obviously, this is going to make some of us cock our heads and go, "Huh? This makes no sense.".
 

Locut0s

Lifer
Nov 28, 2001
22,205
43
91
I am a very abstract person so here goes.

You should not have the right to do whatever you want to yourself simply because it's your body. There are after-affects. Here is a simple example. If you have a family and decided to swallow a box of needles and die. Now your family will encounter disharmony and others will have to take care of them. If you did not want the responsibility of a family you should not have had them. Of course, in today's world anyone can do such a thing but my point is that it would put a drag on society. Something similar happens when people do drugs. It can bring disharmony to their family and the larger society. That is one reason why government disallows it. Becuase it reduces your productivity, increases the costs to society, it is deemed harmful. Do you really think government cares if it wasn't affecting government's ability to function and costs? This is why suicide and most drugs are illegal.

I'm sure that if government could find a way to lower the costs and increase the benefits of some of these drugs (not just revenue but safety) then it would do so. However, as they stand, they are unattractive endeavours.

Suicide should most definitely be legal. 100 FUCKING PERCENT! Yes sure it's selfish and sure on some puritanical narrow minded point of view it's "bad of society". But this kind of talk, actions that largely harm yourself being bad for society, reducing productivity as you put it are exactly the same kind of things that are mouthed by communists and fascists. I'm not claiming you are one but it's the same wrong headed viewpoint.
 

Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,418
1,599
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If so, what are we supposed to do about it? There is disharmony, as you put it, in our laws. Obviously, this is going to make some of us cock our heads and go, "Huh? This makes no sense.".

But alcohol is legal.


Seriously we've had this argument with Narmer dozens of times.

it makes no sense but DON'T SMOKE WEED because government told you so.

er correction, don't smoke because government needs to protect you from yourself.
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
50,419
8
81
Suicide should most definitely be legal. 100 FUCKING PERCENT! Yes sure it's selfish and sure on some puritanical narrow minded point of view it's "bad of society". But this kind of talk, actions that largely harm yourself being bad for society, reducing productivity as you put it are exactly the same kind of things that are mouthed by communists and fascists. I'm not claiming you are one but it's the same wrong headed viewpoint.

The suicide thing threw me a little also, but I decided to ignore it.

AFAIK, suicide is not illegal. I mean, what are they going to do.... kill you? :D

I guess he probably meant assisted suicide?

I agree that he's treading on a very fine line, though. You can't put "the greater good" above peoples' rights as individuals.

Then we have the issue of.. who decides what is good and bad for society? I'm sure there are a lot of people that think eliminating homosexual people from society would be a very good thing. It probably wouldn't technically do any harm. But such actions would be unacceptable because of the freedoms we enjoy in this country.