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*OFFICIAL*: Anandtech Off-Topic 2008 Virtual Stock Exchange Competition

Page 6 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.
Originally posted by: fawhfe


I'm guessing on average, individual stockpickers probably underperform mutual funds. Few traders will tell you about it if they are losing money, whereas all mutual funds report their earnings. It's just biased data. Heck, if you just look at this competition for example, a lot more people are losing money than making it. Though I have to say that the strategy for this game is way different than with real money.

The market is in a world of pain after TMA and NLY yesterday and the jobs numbers today...
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Keep in mind that it is a down market. While people can always make money in those markets, it's usually far more difficult for the vast majority of "regular" investors. The results are a bit skewed on here since you can use a tremendous amount of leverage, you can short stocks far easier than normal, and you can take bigger, more extreme, bets than you'd normally take with your own portfolio.


Look at me, I shorted PPHM (albeit, a bit early) was down 60%, now I am back up with a + return. I'd never do this if I were investing real money.
 
Alright so I got deleted but I just rejoined and set up some transactions for tomorrow based on little to no research since I didn't have the time but didn't want to get deleted. Hopefully a couple of them work out for me.
 
Originally posted by: Special K
Originally posted by: Lothar
Originally posted by: Special K
Originally posted by: Lothar


As long as I do better than the S&P 500, I don't care so much about rankings.
So far since I started Jan 17th(my 1st purchase)
ATOT VSE portfolio: +10.42%
S&P 500: +0.43%
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Doesn't risk matter here though? I've seen emerging markets funds brag about how well they did relative to the S&P500, when in fact the EM fund had a much higher beta. Wouldn't risk-adjusted returns be a better measure?
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Every stock my portfolio has a lower beta than the S&P500 index, therefore my portfolio overall carries a lot less risk.

My portfolio was only down -1.02% today.
Compare that with the -2.20% and -2.30% drop in the S&P500 and Nasdaq.
There's no EM funds there.

All money made so far has been on longs.
I could go the easy route and short Citi, Capital One, Washington Mutual, Ambac/MBIA, but I don't believe in short selling stocks that much.
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If it's that easy to beat the S&P500 on a risk-adjusted basis, then why invest in mutual funds at all? Heck, if you can do that, why not be a fund manager, since 80% of them cannot beat their benchmark index in the long term after expenses are subtracted?

My question is somewhat rhetorical, but as a novice investor who stumbled onto the diehards forum, I often question their strategy of buying and holding low expense index funds when everywhere I look, someone claims to be making a fortune through trading.
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Because most mutual/index funds offer something I can't get or don't want to waste time getting.
For US/domestic stocks I generally pick my own stocks(FAIRX is the only exception).
I can easily use my friends CapitalIQ info or the SEC website to look up information.
In the US I can easily search and lookup financial statements myself which isn't too much of a hassle and I actually know about the company's product.

For foreign companies, it's a different matter.
I'm only directly in 4 foreign companies for her. Everything else(majority) foreign is in index funds. I don't want to waste time researching the hundreds/thousands of companies on the Mexican Bolsa index when I can just pick a Mexican or Latin American fund and be done with.

I'm in VIPSX because I know little about treasuries other than they're good to hold at certain times and they add diversification.

I like my current job as a healthcare professional and wouldn't trade it for the world.
I also like that my job won't be a cyclical business.
The same reason why eventhough I built my own computer, I'd never major in computer science(or anything related to it).

"fortune"? The term in itself is relative.
Just because a person says they have a 10% return doesn't mean anything.
Do you know if that return is from a $100 investment portfolio or a $1 million one?
In fact the bigger your portfolio, the less chances of you making big returns. That's why some mutual funds are closed to new investors. I'm sure you've heard Buffett and many others complain that it's hard to make juicy returns when you control billions of dollars worth of portfolio.

And yes for MOST people, holding index funds will be better than going to buy stocks in companies you know nothing about because someone else told you so or because you drink their coffee every morning.

Anyone IRL who mentions investment advice, I give them the evil eye look and tell them index funds.

In conclusion, diehards forum has the correct strategy. Stay with them.
 
Originally posted by: fawhfe
I'm guessing on average, individual stockpickers probably underperform mutual funds. Few traders will tell you about it if they are losing money, whereas all mutual funds report their earnings. It's just biased data. Heck, if you just look at this competition for example, a lot more people are losing money than making it. Though I have to say that the strategy for this game is way different than with real money.
Click to expand...

No need to guess. It's pretty much a known fact.

This competition is flawed in itself in that not everyone is joining and starting at the same time.
I don't use a margin account(even if people here do in their real accounts, I doubt they're 100% like in this game).
I don't short stocks.
I don't do options.
I'm also guessing most people here(I hope at least) don't gamble their retirement savings on a penny stock like PPHM either.

I try not to dabble into things in which I know nothing about. That's how I stay out of trouble.


I lost money on VLO and sold it at a loss last year. Luckily for me, the almost 100% gain from NOV was more than enough to offset any loss I made from the stupid VLO purchase.
I knew little about the oil market when I bought it and was one of those newbs who thought "Buy any oil company" because I expected oil to go up to $80/barrel(it was trading at $59 then I believe). Little did I know then that high price of oil actually hurts refiners like Valero and many others.
See this Thread for more information.
The dates and time stamps are on the record.
 
99% of the people playing VSE would never buy/sell short on margin

and VSE doesnt offer options, which is a big factor in the stock market
 
Question on limits and stops. Can I use one or the other to sell a stock when it passes an upper bound? Would a limit sell work or would it just work like a limit buy and sell off the stock if it's below the price. To me it makes sense to inverse the logic between sell and buy but I found thatwhat makes sense to me is not how the world works.
 
Originally posted by: JTsyo
Question on limits and stops. Can I use one or the other to sell a stock when it passes an upper bound? Would a limit sell work or would it just work like a limit buy and sell off the stock if it's below the price. To me it makes sense to inverse the logic between sell and buy but I found thatwhat makes sense to me is not how the world works.
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if u bought in at $3 and want to sell at $3.50, you would set a sell limit to $3.50.

if you wanted to prevent losses, u could set a stop at $2.90 or something and it would sell if it got below $2.90
 
Wow, I haven't checked this game in over a month.

I didn't experience the same issues you experienced when I logged on 5mins ago.
Try a different browser?
 
I recall having issues roughly a month ago so it may have been the site.

Anyway, I just got on to say that I'm disappointed I've fallen off the front page. I had been at a solid 5-7% range and ranked 21-23 for the longest time, and all the sudden I checked this morning to find myself bumped.

Oh well, I figure my only goal is to get a port with a gain of 25-33% by the end of the year.
 
Just bumping this shiz so I can brag. 30% returns this month. Woot woot! I was getting beat up for like a half a year!
 
Funny how much 7 months changes your goals. I'd be satisfied ending the year at only a 10% loss.

Is there going to be a 2009 competition? Because one of my buddies who visits here challenged me to a port competition and I told him we should just do this one if it's set up again for next year.
 
Originally posted by: manlymatt83
Originally posted by: aplefka
I joined in January then never had the time to research any stocks. Maybe I should do it now that the market has taken such a dive.
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HA.

If only you knew...
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Yeah, this thread is definitely a time capsule of the economy. Gotta love it. I remember when AAPL was my big gainer. Should've sold everything off and re-invested in new stocks back when I was up around 8%.
 
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