Obama vs. Clinton Craziness

statusquobuster

Junior Member
Jun 25, 2007
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Obama Hope Beating Clinton Help

Joel S. Hirschhorn

Hope mongering has been working much better than experience mongering. Now, the rest of the story?.

As befits American culture, politics is all about slick selling to the masses. Hillary Clinton is selling Day-1 help to victims and sufferers. Barack Obama is selling effervescent hope to yes-we-can dreamers. This media hyped horse race is like a fight between diet Coke and diet Pepsi, artificially sweetened candidates devoid of real nourishment.

The least educated, least sophisticated and least wealthy along with Hispanics are sipping Clinton?s fizzled-out drink. The most educated, most privileged, and most financially successful along with African-Americans are gulping down Obama?s charismatic pick-me-up.

As to who is buying what, consider these data: Clinton won the non-college-educated voters by 22 points in California, 32 points in Massachusetts, 54 points in Arkansas, and 11 points in New Jersey. In a Pew Research national survey, Obama led among people with college degrees by 22 points. In Connecticut, Obama beat Clinton among college graduates by 17 points and in New Jersey by 11 points. And note this: 39 percent of Virginia and 41 percent of Maryland Democratic primary voters reported incomes of $100,000 or more ? clearly well educated people that would favor Obama.

A simplistic conclusion is that the dumber you are the more likely you prefer the first woman president because you believe this experience-selling status quo, corporate candidate. And the smarter you are the more likely you prefer the first black president because you embrace the change-promises and platitudes from the more authentic, inspirational candidate with the short resume. Clinton supporters appreciate the 10-point-plan-for-every-problem political pragmatist. Obamatons swoon over the big-picture, unity-promising political messiah.

Working-class Clinton supporters are like weary shoppers seeking decent food at low prices at Safeway and good coffee at Dunkin? Donuts. Obama yes-we-can-happy-facers gladly pay exorbitant prices for the Whole Foods experience and Starbucks shtick.

Here are some realities that neither group wants to face:

Both candidates are establishment insiders.

Both are corporate-state politicians. Note that Robert Wolf, the CEO of UBS Americas, a major banking company, has raised more than $1 million for the Obama campaign. Large sources of Obama money are law firms, investment houses, and real estate companies, and 80 percent of his donors are affiliated with business, compared to 85 percent for Clinton.

Neither are true progressives or populists, like Kucinich and Edwards.

Both Clinton the fighter and Obama the talker will sell out once they confront presidential realities. Why? Because plutocracies know how to retain power AFTER elections. After two years it will be clear that the new president will have failed to extract the US from Iraq, will have failed to deliver universal health care, will have failed to address illegal immigration, will have done nothing to get a new and serious 9/11 investigation, will have done nothing to stop middle-class-killing globalization, and will have utterly disappointed the vast majority of Americans. The president?s most pressing priorities will be lowering expectations and getting reelected, despite raising taxes. The only people truly surprised at all this will be those lacking what the Greeks thought is a virtue: cynicism.

Finally, for those seeking serious political system reforms, it is troubling that neither Clinton nor, especially, Obama have the courage to advocate needed constitutional amendments, such as replacing the Electoral College with the popular vote for president, getting all private money out of politics, making universal health care a right, and preventing presidential signing statements that undermine laws.

Knowing that Congress is unlikely to propose such amendments, these candidates could advocate using, for the first time, what the Founders gave us in Article V: a convention of state delegates that could propose amendments, as described at www.foavc.org. If Abraham Lincoln and Dwight D. Eisenhower could support using the convention option, certainly Day-1-Clinton and new-direction-Obama should.

[Contact Joel S. Hirschhorn through www.delusionaldemocracy.com.]

Allow me to quote a wise man:

Thanks for sharing, but posting the same encyclopedia length articles you have posted elsewhere on the web without the courtesy of participating in any ensuing discussion of the issues you address is useless propogandizing.

This is the third one of your threads we have locked for the same reason. If this is all you have to offer, please post elsewhere. If you repeat this behavior, your account will be locked.

Harvey
Senior AnandTech Moderator

Your account is now locked.

Perknose
AnandTech ESM

 

M0RPH

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2003
3,302
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Excellent article, I agree with every word. And the reason Obama is doing so well in these primaries is because his type of people are more likely to vote in them than Hillary's.

needed constitutional amendments, such as replacing the Electoral College with the popular vote for president, getting all private money out of politics, making universal health care a right

He's so right that we need these things, but who knows when, if ever, we'll get them. Obama certainly isn't going to give us universal health care.
 

Robor

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
16,979
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Isn't I_B_T_L supposed to be against the rules too? :eek:

If he's a spammer he's pretty slow. Only 4 posts since 6/25/07. :p
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
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Originally posted by: Robor
Isn't I_B_T_L supposed to be against the rules too? :eek:

If he's a spammer he's pretty slow. Only 4 posts since 6/25/07. :p

Yeah, but he posts that same article on about 1000 forums, so it takes him a while to get around :)
 

M0RPH

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2003
3,302
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Spammer or not, it's an insightful article, so why don't we discuss it?
 

StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
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I expect this when Obama is elected: more taxes, less imbalanced budget, better foreign relations.
 
Jun 27, 2005
19,216
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Originally posted by: Robor
Isn't I_B_T_L supposed to be against the rules too? :eek:

If he's a spammer he's pretty slow. Only 4 posts since 6/25/07. :p

If you look at his post history, all four of them have the same link to the same blog site. Me thinks he is trying to drive a little traffic his way.

Plus he never adds any comment to his copy/paste.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,508
6,698
126
There is no hope. There can't be any hope. There must be no hope. Please please don't let there be any hope. I hate hope. I want to be emotionally dead and believe it's the right thing to be. Hope would ruin everything. No more pain, please.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
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Originally posted by: M0RPH
Spammer or not, it's an insightful article, so why don't we discuss it?

I'm happy to discuss it. I liked the article, but somehow feel I've seen it b4. But first:

OP, add your own comments or this will be locked


One of the odd things I find about his observation - Clinton is great at policy and is supported by blue collar types, Obama is all style no substance but is supported by college educated - is that one would think educated voters would be more concerned with policy, and blue collar types less so.

I don't think he has that right.

The educated going for a candidate based on emotion?

The blue collar types going for a candidate based on the issues?

Too simplistic IMO.

I think many college types are very interested in the issues, but realize no matter how good you are at policy it's gonna take a new attitude to get anything done in Washington.

I also suspect that teh blue collar-types are going on emotion too, just a different one than Obama is offering.

Maybe some of us college educated types have a few other thoughts:

1. A presidential candidate can get as specific as they want about policy, but at the end of the day the legisltion is gonna have to be passed through the House & Senate. It's gonna undergo compromise and change, getting to deep in the details at this point is a waste of time.

2. Maybe we don't like some of HRC's "details" - like her forced participation in UHC.

3. Might be nice to see a black guy get to be president, and have him do it without using race as a "weapon" in dividing voters. Maybe racism will be put a bit further behind as a nation.

Fern

 

SSSnail

Lifer
Nov 29, 2006
17,458
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I ROFLMAO at the thread and the article's general direction... what a freaking joke.

So now everybody will go out and vote for Obama because they don't want to be: stupid, uneducated, make less money, not black, hopeless...

What a contriving stinking idea.

Here's what I think of it.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
136
Mod comments from this spammer's last thread.

Thanks for sharing, but posting the same encyclopedia length articles you have posted elsewhere on the web without the courtesy of participating in any ensuing discussion of the issues you address is useless propogandizing.

This is the third one of your threads we have locked for the same reason. If this is all you have to offer, please post elsewhere. If you repeat this behavior, your account will be locked.

Harvey
Senior AnandTech Moderator

You were warned. You'll find you'll have a little trouble doing a spam & run here next time.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
136
Originally posted by: M0RPH
I've seen worse spamming by Pabster.

:roll:

Just because you happen to agree with what he says is no excuse to approve of his methods.

This guy (assuming that he actually is Joel S. Hirschhorn) is using message boards as free advertising for his book. That is spamming, by definition.