Obama proposes 'grand bargain' for jobs. Wut?

[s0me0nesmind1]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/obamas-latest-grand-bargain-proposal-171951807.html
Obama's Latest 'Grand Bargain' Proposal Isn't Much Of A Bargain At All


Anyone who knows business knows that the last thing Republcians want is a simplified tax code for business. It's one thing to say such for simple american's doing theirs every year, but sadly he is mistaken if he thinks he is offering anything in regards to business.

This is nothing but a lose-lose as far as the right is concerned. Typical Obama bargaining. Don't get me wrong, I want loopholes closed for the sake of corporations paying their fair share of taxes, but if you think simplified tax code is the answer to that, you are sorely mistaken.

 

[justoh]

It doesn't seem to be much of a bargain at all.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

It doesn't seem to be much of a bargain at all.

It's a complete lose-lose, there is absolutely nothing of value for the right. What the fuck is this guy smoking with his offers? Inyet people wonder why Congress won't pass anything, they have their stubborn stupidity - but if you're not willing to REASONABLY COMPROMISE, it's you're own damn fault.

 

[berzerker60]

Poor Obama, wants to get shit done but anything he proposes, no matter how exactly it's worded just like what Republicans were just demanding, becomes evil tyrannical communist dictating.

Nothing for the right? How about jobs for their constituents and a lower corporate tax rate, both of which Republicans have been demanding for years?

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Not to mention it doesn't make sense. If you want more jobs, you need companies that are willing to take risks. WHY THE FUCK would you - as a legitimate business - want to take more risks just after a tax hike? WHAT?

If anything that says hold on to your money and see what the market does before you do anything. This type of activity does nothing but demolish more jobs.

 

[Pr0d1gy]

Wool, meet eyes.

 

[PokerGuy]

It's a complete lose-lose, there is absolutely nothing of value for the right. What the f*ck is this guy smoking with his offers?

Of course his offers are complete BS. He doesn't really want to compromise or offer anything. Instead, he "offers" this "bargain" that is anything but, knowing that the useful idiots on the left / media will lap it up and present it as him trying to compromise. They can then bash the other side for being obstructionists and not compromising.

In other words, the same political bs instead of leadership.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Of course his offers are complete BS. He doesn't really want to compromise or offer anything. Instead, he "offers" this "bargain" that is anything but, knowing that the useful idiots on the left / media will lap it up and present it as him trying to compromise. They can then bash the other side for being obstructionists and not compromising.

In other words, the same political bs instead of leadership.

The only loser is the middle class... oh, and people that would be his son if he were to have a son.

 

[ivwshane]

What's crazy is that if the right really wanted a good deal they could propose something themselves!

But I guess it's easier to complain, hell, the righty lap dogs eat that shit up!


Poor Obama, working with retards is hard.

 

[HomerJS]

And the GOP idea to create jobs besides tax cuts for the rich is????

 

[ivwshane]

And the GOP idea to create jobs besides tax cuts for the rich is????

Well lower tax rates does lead to economic growth!


/sarcasm

 

[berzerker60]

Well lower tax rates does lead to economic growth!


/sarcasm

Unless Obama proposes them. Then it's a trick.

 

[Incorruptible]

Well lower tax rates does lead to economic growth!


/sarcasm

Taxes should be lower not raised. You don't have a right to other peoples money.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Well lower tax rates does lead to economic growth!


/sarcasm

...Because during these tough economic times.... Obama...raised taxation all around...

Propertly taxes... he raised...
Income taxes.... he raised...
Social Security taxes.... he raised...


OHHHHHHHH wait :sneaky:

*Hint* You're a dumbass.

 

[Fern]

Poor Obama, wants to get shit done but anything he proposes, no matter how exactly it's worded just like what Republicans were just demanding, becomes evil tyrannical communist dictating.

Nothing for the right? How about jobs for their constituents and a lower corporate tax rate, both of which Republicans have been demanding for years?

Looks like you didn't read the article. If you read it, you didn't understand it.

Corporate tax won't be lowered under Obama's plan. In fact, in the short term corporate taxes will be raised to pay for Obama's 'infrastructure' costs.

Don't let the talk of rates confuse you. There are many ways of increasing taxes without raising rates, or even raise them while decreasing rates.

His "bargain" sounds like the usual 'tax & spend'.

Fern

 

[Black Octagon]

Anyone who knows business knows that the last thing Republcians want is a simplified tax code for business. It's one thing to say such for simple american's doing theirs every year, but sadly he is mistaken if he thinks he is offering anything in regards to business.

This is nothing but a lose-lose as far as the right is concerned. Typical Obama bargaining. Don't get me wrong, I want loopholes closed for the sake of corporations paying their fair share of taxes, but if you think simplified tax code is the answer to that, you are sorely mistaken.[/QUOTE]

I don't 'know business', but I do have this nasty habit of not accepting the views of people on internet fora unless I'm offered evidence and reasoned argument.

With that in mind, why is a simplified tax code an inherently bad thing?

('cos you know, you kinda failed to provide any substantive reason there...)

 

[woolfe9998]

Looks like you didn't read the article. If you read it, you didn't understand it.

Corporate tax won't be lowered under Obama's plan. In fact, in the short term corporate taxes will be raised to pay for Obama's 'infrastructure' costs.

Don't let the talk of rates confuse you. There are many ways of increasing taxes without raising rates, or even raise them while decreasing rates.

His "bargain" sounds like the usual 'tax & spend'.

Fern

The GOP has claimed that they favor a revenue neutral reform of the tax code, eliminating deductions and other exclusions while lowering the marginal rate. This is what Obama is offering. That said, I understand why they wouldn't accept the proposal in its present form - it isn't revenue neutral for the first 2-3 years, and the excess goes toward spending which the GOP does not want.

That's why it's called a bargain. The opening proposal always favors the side making the proposal.

 

[Sonikku]

The only grand bargain we'll accept is a bargain in which our side gets everything that we want at the expense of slashing funding to all the things the other side wants.

Even then, I'll need to think about it.

 

[Patranus]

What happened to that trillion dollars of that 'obama money' that was handed out.
Thought that was going to create permeant jobs.

 

[Jhhnn]

Righties have raved about wanting a simplified tax code for decades.

That's just the truth.

Now that Obama wants it too, they disown it.

I'll take "Can't remember what they said yesterday" for $1000, Alex.

Maybe I'll get the bonus question about "talking out of both sides of their mouths".

 

[berzerker60]

Looks like you didn't read the article. If you read it, you didn't understand it.

Corporate tax won't be lowered under Obama's plan. In fact, in the short term corporate taxes will be raised to pay for Obama's 'infrastructure' costs.

Don't let the talk of rates confuse you. There are many ways of increasing taxes without raising rates, or even raise them while decreasing rates.

His "bargain" sounds like the usual 'tax & spend'.

Fern

http://www.forbes.com/sites/beltway/2012/10/29/what-exactly-is-mitt-romneys-tax-plan/

The corporate income tax: Romney would cut the corporate rate from 35 percent to 25 percent and extend the research and experimentation credit and full expensing of capital investment. He’d also propose further corporate rate reductions that would be funded by unspecified business tax increases.

http://taxpolicycenter.org/taxtopics/romney-plan.cfm

At the corporate level, the Romney plan would make two major changes: 1) reduce the corporate income tax rate from 35 to 25 percent and 2) make the research and experimentation credit permanent, It would also extend for one year the full expensing of capital expenditures and allow a “tax holiday” for the repatriation of corporate profits held overseas. The plan does not specify, however, whether repatriated earnings would face any tax and, if so, at what rate. In the longer run, Gov. Romney would reduce the corporate rate further in conjunction with base broadening and simplification and would move the corporate tax to a territorial system.

Romney always dodged providing any actual details to his plan, but to me it sounds a lot like what Obama's proposing. Naturally, the GOP can't be expected to agree to the first draft, but it seems within negotiating range to me - that is, if it were possible to negotiate with the Tea Party.

 

[woolfe9998]

Yup, it's the exact type of thing that Romney proposed during the election, simplifying the code by eliminating deductions and lowering the marginal rate. This may not be a "good deal" on balance from a strictly conservative perspective, but it's erroneous to claim that it contains literally nothing that conservatives have asked for.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Unless Obama proposes them. Then it's a trick.

You have a better clown car.

 

[Fern]

The GOP has claimed that they favor a revenue neutral reform of the tax code, eliminating deductions and other exclusions while lowering the marginal rate. This is what Obama is offering. That said, I understand why they wouldn't accept the proposal in its present form - it isn't revenue neutral for the first 2-3 years, and the excess goes toward spending which the GOP does not want.

That's why it's called a bargain. The opening proposal always favors the side making the proposal.

Washington DC has been working on comprehensive tax reform for more than a decade. Anybody, including Obama, who thinks they can blow in at the last minute with their own proposal is a fool. Too many, for too long, are invested in their own idea of what reform should look like.

See the bolded above: An agreement on which deductions/credits etc to eliminate is, IMO, be damn near impossible to reach. E.g., the Democrats have been busy giving highly profitable multinationals like GE 'green credits' and they want to raise taxes on oil companies. I don't see the Repubs going along with this. I.e., in theory everyone can agree to lower the rate and broaden the base, but the specifics of doing so is where the (huge) problem lies.

I have problems seeing how Congress can enact tax law that is revenue neutral yet increases taxes for the first 3 years. Since this would presumably be done over a ten year period as usual, clearly taxes must be lowered over the latter 7 yrs. This sounds a lot like the "if you raise spending/taxes now we promise to lower taxes later' that has burned the Repubs in the past. "Fool me once, shame on you ...etc.", I suspect the Repubs will be highly reluctant to take this position again.

And if corporate tax revenue is to be revenue neutral over ten years, the immediate increase in spending is, over that 10 yr period, additional deficit spending thus increasing our debt. Assuming tax revenue will decrease in years 4-10 the only (practical and sure) way to counter it and avoid increasing the debt is with spending cuts. Given baseline budgeting and COLA accelerators this is absurd. It's just more 'kick the can down the road' stuff.

Obama has 3 more yrs in office. So he gets extra money to blow for those 3 yrs and leaves the dirty work (reducing spending/forgoing the tax reduction/increasing the debt) up to whomever replaces him.

Fern

 

[SpatiallyAware]

<snip>

Obama has 3 more yrs in office. So he gets extra money to blow for those 3 yrs and leaves the dirty work (reducing spending/forgoing the tax reduction/increasing the debt) up to whomever replaces him.

Fern

Sums it up perfectly, and has become common with our latest Leaders.