Obama = Carter II

[Craig234]

Obama = Carter II

Carter was the worst president in my lifetime, LBJ is next, but BHO is close to winning this contest.

Yes, see my posts for how bad he was, and how good your favorites were.

 

[woodie1]

Yes, see my posts for how bad he was, and how good your favorites were.

Well, you're my favorite tool.

 

[senseamp]

But but but BOOOOOSH.

Those who fail to learn from history are bound to repeat it.

 

[Painman]

I'm not going to pass judgement 1/4 of the way into his administration. I'm not pleased as punch, but there's still 3 years to go.

I know you Cons are chomping at the bit already... welcome to 2006. STFU and work at it.

 

[nobodyknows]

A thread discussing a past president sure makes it inappropriate to discus... a past president. Idiot.

Patuanus is pretty high up on the possibles to be next on my ignore list.

 

[LegendKiller]

The comparison is stunningly stupid, not to mention it casts Carter in the revisionist history light as worse than he really was.

 

[earthman]

If Obama goes down as a bad president, it will probably be as Johnson II, not Carter II. Johnson was a very progressive guy sunk by his insistence on fighting an unpopular war, and I think Obama is playing with fire by pursuing these wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, not to mention bankrupting the country. Carter was a decent, honest guy who suffered from the fallout of the Iran hostage crisis more than anything else. Maybe he made the wrong decisions on that, but he avoided getting us into a war, and the hostages did eventually come back. Under Carter we also saw the smallest budget growth of any president in the modern era...he was very frugal.

 

[alphatarget1]

Maybe he made the wrong decisions on that, but he avoided getting us into a war, and the hostages did eventually come back. Under Carter we also saw the smallest budget growth of any president in the modern era...he was very frugal.

I was under the impression that Reagan sold Iranians weapons in order to secure the release of the hostages? (Iran Contra scandal) Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[k3n]

Well, we finally got an idiot post on this.

Carter lacked leadership, but his policies were far better than anyone since.

Carter *inherited* an economic mess from the war criminals Nixon and Ford (sound familiar?)

It was CARTER who put in place Paul Volcker who did so much to fix the economy - continuing under Reagan - the same Volcker who is NOW saying good advice Obama is ignoring.

One of many ways Obama is NOT Carter - to Carter's credit.

It was Carter who made human rights a priority in our foreign policy, and he was right. It was Carter who decreased our use of tyrrany for US influence, and he was right.

The mass murderering criminals before and after him can't hold a candle to that.

Even an area I am not endorsing - the Reagan backing of the Mujahideen to hurt the Soviet Union - turns out Carter started that policy, secretly.

Carter made energy independance a top national priority before it was cool - and his oil-linked successors reversed him, with big bad results. He was right and ahead of his time, sort of.

Not really - they were good ideas then - but he was promoting them before we're reurning now.

You didn't see the skyrocketing deficits, the backing of death squads, the criminality of Iran Contra, the corrupt deregulation of the financial industry leading to disaster, the war on the middle class.

You did see the Camp David peace accords, pretty much our only real middle east diplomatic accomplishment.

We'd better if Obama were more like Carter on policy.

What the hell are you talking about? i agreed with you until you mentioned how great volker was. Volker was the "trilateral commission" underdog who raised interest rates to usurious levels which effectively made life much harder for blue collar workers and the US industrial complex. This is one of the main reasons you had desperate blue collar workers vote for reagan, who in turn screwed them by making it harder for them to form unions, LOL. Reagan remedied volker's harsh interest rates by literally forcing or "encouraging" companies like general motors to outsource to mexico, remember the michael moore movie "Roger and Me" ?.

Too bad carter's talk on energy independence was all a sham due to fact he passed laws that made it near impossible to make new nuclear reactors as a result of the "three mile island" hoax. Gates (who worked for Brzezinski during the carter years), Volker, and many of the people under obama's administration are members of the Trilateral commission, the same people that ran carter's administration into the ground.

Read the book "Obama The Postmodern Coup" for more info. This book is written by an FDR democrat, not a right wing nut job as you'd like to think.

 

[earthman]

I was under the impression that Reagan sold Iranians weapons in order to secure the release of the hostages? (Iran Contra scandal) Correct me if I'm wrong.

That may be correct in the technical sense, but it still shows that it was the right decision. A war with Iran would have killed thousands and maybe dragged on for years.

 

[Slew Foot]

Well, we finally got an idiot post on this.

Carter lacked leadership, but his policies were far better than anyone since.

Carter *inherited* an economic mess from the war criminals Nixon and Ford (sound familiar?)

It was CARTER who put in place Paul Volcker who did so much to fix the economy - continuing under Reagan - the same Volcker who is NOW saying good advice Obama is ignoring.

One of many ways Obama is NOT Carter - to Carter's credit.

It was Carter who made human rights a priority in our foreign policy, and he was right. It was Carter who decreased our use of tyrrany for US influence, and he was right.

The mass murderering criminals before and after him can't hold a candle to that.

Even an area I am not endorsing - the Reagan backing of the Mujahideen to hurt the Soviet Union - turns out Carter started that policy, secretly.

Carter made energy independance a top national priority before it was cool - and his oil-linked successors reversed him, with big bad results. He was right and ahead of his time, sort of.

Not really - they were good ideas then - but he was promoting them before we're reurning now.

You didn't see the skyrocketing deficits, the backing of death squads, the criminality of Iran Contra, the corrupt deregulation of the financial industry leading to disaster, the war on the middle class.

You did see the Camp David peace accords, pretty much our only real middle east diplomatic accomplishment.

We'd better if Obama were more like Carter on policy.

So Obama is worse than Carter? Holy shit were fucked.

 

[FerrelGeek]

Those who fail to learn from history are bound to repeat it.

Which is precisely why were stuck with Obama.

 

[her209]

Did Carter inherit two wars?

 

[Craig234]

Which is precisely why were stuck with Obama.

Because the lesson from the decade of failed conservatism was "elect the conservative".

 

[Craig234]

I was under the impression that Reagan sold Iranians weapons in order to secure the release of the hostages? (Iran Contra scandal) Correct me if I'm wrong.

Those were other hostages. The ones in the embassy with Carter were released without any known conditions 20 miuntes after Reaqgan was sworn in. Read the link I posted before for what some say.

 

[Craig234]

If Obama goes down as a bad president, it will probably be as Johnson II, not Carter II. Johnson was a very progressive guy sunk by his insistence on fighting an unpopular war, and I think Obama is playing with fire by pursuing these wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, not to mention bankrupting the country. Carter was a decent, honest guy who suffered from the fallout of the Iran hostage crisis more than anything else. Maybe he made the wrong decisions on that, but he avoided getting us into a war, and the hostages did eventually come back. Under Carter we also saw the smallest budget growth of any president in the modern era...he was very frugal.

Ironically, it appears Johnson's main motive for starting war with Vietnam was the domestic politics to help his Great Society legislatin get passed. Many wanted that war.

 

[ericlp]

This is like a sad slow motion replay of the Carter years.

For the hipster losers out there that have no clue. Bush Jr was the most worthless President this nation has ever seen - since Grover Cleaveland.

Fixed for ya....

 

[Mani]

Jesus, this forum is getting overrun by idiotic troll threads.

 

[ericlp]

Jesus, this forum is getting overrun by idiotic troll threads.

What do you suggest we do? Ban the 10% that are total idiots and just come up with these ideas because they heard rush or their church tell em it was a good idea?

 

[Mani]

What do you suggest we do? Ban the 10% that are total idiots and just come up with these ideas because they heard rush or their church tell em it was a good idea?

As appealing as that sounds, I'm not a fan of restrictions on expression. I say we just exercise our right to ridicule them, or not feed them in the first place.

 

[Craig234]

What do you suggest we do? Ban the 10% that are total idiots and just come up with these ideas because they heard rush or their church tell em it was a good idea?

I think there are different types of forums. Banning that 10% does have an enormous benefit for the quality of the forum's content. Some forums who allow them have countless unread "lol !1!!" posts.

Other forums are more social where more freedom is allowed, at the expense of the quality.

An analogy is MMO's. THere are forums where everyone can post any post good or bad, and there's a site called "elitist jerks" where they threaten posters that only very high quality posts are accepted.

Both have a purpose.

 

[woodie1]

Ironically, it appears Johnson's main motive for starting war with Vietnam was the domestic politics to help his Great Society legislatin get passed. Many wanted that war.

Johnson started the Vietnam war? Hold the presses, time to print new history books.

 

[Craig234]

Johnson started the Vietnam war? Hold the presses, time to print new history books.

Yes, he did. You can trace the history, from the US supporting France in the 50's, to our having up to about 16,000 'advisors' under Eisenhower and Kennedy, but the first US ground troops were Johnson.

That's when the 'war' really started for the US, quickly escalating up to undreds of thousand of US troops, and casualties from tiny to thousands.

That's why people discuss whether Kennedy 'would have gone to war'. Calling what prededed a war is a pedantic, misleading use of the word.

 

[Greenman]

The comparison is stunningly stupid, not to mention it casts Carter in the revisionist history light as worse than he really was.

He sets the standard by which every other failed president is measured, does it really matter if the bar gets pushed down a bit?

I remember only being able to buy gas on odd numbered days.
I remember only being allowed to buy twenty gallons of gas at a time.
I remember out of control inflation.
I remember price and wage freezes.
I remember 18% mortgage interest rates.
I remember Iran telling us to fuck off, and Carter apologizing to them.
I remember Khadafy telling us to fuck off, and again, Carter ended up kissing his ass.
I remember people talking about the declining years of the US, that it was time we accepted our "new role" in world politics.

As I said before, Carter was a good man, and a very bad president.

 

[LegendKiller]

He sets the standard by which every other failed president is measured, does it really matter if the bar gets pushed down a bit?

I remember only being able to buy gas on odd numbered days.
I remember only being allowed to buy twenty gallons of gas at a time.

How was this Carter's fault? Rationing began under Nixon and caused price distortions. What was left over was what Carter had to deal with. He then deregulated oil, allowing it to increase in price, giving the US oil industry impetus to increase production in other areas.

I remember out of control inflation.
I remember price and wage freezes.

Some nice revisionist history. The price/wage controls began under Nixon, Carter had no option but to continue some of them, lest the oil crisis exacerbate the problem, causing bigger shocks in a self-fulfilling prophesy and feedback loop. Nixon was the one who loved controlling everything (unified executive and all of that, lead by Cheney and Rummy).

Then, when Carter knew something needed to be done, he got the pain over, but also brought Volker in to get it done.

I remember 18% mortgage interest rates.

The mortgage rates were a natural reflection of the inflationary tendencies unleashed by energy crisis and price controls (started by Nixon). Interest rates were ratcheted up to prevent a further exacerbation of the problem. It wasn't Carter's fault, but it was his mess to deal with.

I remember Iran telling us to fuck off, and Carter apologizing to them.
I remember Khadafy telling us to fuck off, and again, Carter ended up kissing his ass.
I remember people talking about the declining years of the US, that it was time we accepted our "new role" in world politics.

As I said before, Carter was a good man, and a very bad president.

And what exactly were we supposed to do with Iran and "Khadafy"? Invade? That sounds good to warmongers like you, but you're distorting the truth anyway (not that you care).

So what about people "talking" of that? People were talking of that after the .bombs.

I do love how people vilify Carter for the past mistakes of the Repuglicans. Even now we have pretty solid proof Reagan was working behind the scenes to embarrass Carter and scoring a home-run by getting the hostages free right away.