Nvidia or ATI gpu due to the recent gameworks program?

[vanguard27]

I've used HD 6970 for 3 years and thought of upgrading to r9 280x tri X edition recently. But after the watch dogs release and also some other Ubisoft games like AC4 also had a great nvidia driver optimization. Not to mention the exclusive physX and AMD's mantle. Alot of future games and mostly all other upcoming Ubisoft games will also be gameworks titles. So should I buy a GTX 770 or the radeon? my reach isn't any higher than these. Personally I wanted to stick to ATI since I've used it long and have faith in the brand but seems like nvidia's recent marketing strategy is creating a huge confusion among alot of buyers like me these days :/

 

[PPB]

Gameworks is smoke and mirrors, I would rather focus on getting features that actually benefit my gaming experience, like mantle. I would go for the 280x

 

[BrightCandle]

I think its unlikely gameworks will have an impact. Everyone is well aware of its potential problems and the developers are in the position to ensure that the worst case scenario doesn't actually happen. I don't think gameworks is a good reason to buy an Nvidia card, I do not think it will swing the balance of power because the market will scream at them if they try to use it to break AMD's card performance.

 

[DarkKnightDude]

Gameworks certainly did not help Watch Dogs.

 

[Genx87]

I've used HD 6970 for 3 years and thought of upgrading to r9 280x tri X edition recently. But after the watch dogs release and also some other Ubisoft games like AC4 also had a great nvidia driver optimization. Not to mention the exclusive physX and AMD's mantle. Alot of future games and mostly all other upcoming Ubisoft games will also be gameworks titles. So should I buy a GTX 770 or the radeon? my reach isn't any higher than these. Personally I wanted to stick to ATI since I've used it long and have faith in the brand but seems like nvidia's recent marketing strategy is creating a huge confusion among alot of buyers like me these days :/

Buy what you need now. By the time any of these "technologies" are utilized. Whatever you buy today will be low end or not used at all.

 

[Flapdrol1337]

Gameworks might add a proprietary feature here and there, like txaa, some people like the effect, others dont. If you like to play older or otherwise undemanding games with downsampling it's much easier to setup with nvidia.

for price/performance the 280x is a better deal than the 770.

 

[Mand]

I can't see any reason for the presence of Gameworks to play a role in your GPU choice, either for or against.

 

[raghu78]

Gameworks isn't a major factor. go with the vendor you are comfortable with. in your case it means AMD.

 

[Attic]

Please don't support gameworks through a GPU purchase. From what i've seen it is bad for the gaming community and is used to the detriment of gamers like you and me rather than to our nuetrality let alone our benefit.

Read some more if interested in gameworks negatives for gamers and the gaming community

 

[Flapdrol1337]

Please don't support gameworks through a GPU purchase. From what i've seen it is bad for the gaming community and is used to the detriment of gamers like you and me rather than to our nuetrality let alone our benefit.

Read some more if interested in gameworks negatives for gamers and the gaming community

These allegations are pretty ridiculous considering amd is pushing a proprietary graphics api.

 

[RussianSensation]

IMO you should either consider a card such as MSI Gaming 280 and overclock it. It costs just $220 and is an awesome stop gap card since it can beat both the 280X and 770:

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/graphics/display/msi-r9-280-gaming-3g_5.html#sect3

Considering 290 costs $340-360, I don't see any point in considering a 770 2-4GB. Also, I wouldn't recommend a 2GB card to keep for 2-3 years. I honestly think grabbing a 280 and overclocking as a stop gap card may be a great idea. This way if get 95% of the performance of an overclocked 280X/770 4GB and if games start taking serious advantage of GameWorks, you can sell it and add $100-150 you put side now towards a next gen NV GPU.

 

[Mand]

Please don't support gameworks through a GPU purchase. From what i've seen it is bad for the gaming community and is used to the detriment of gamers like you and me rather than to our nuetrality let alone our benefit.

Read some more if interested in gameworks negatives for gamers and the gaming community

Those allegations have been rather thoroughly debunked. Most of them are just factually inaccurate.

 

[Topweasel]

These allegations are pretty ridiculous considering amd is pushing a proprietary graphics api.

Proprietary only to those companies that refuse to develop drivers for it. I understand why Nvidia wouldn't want to support it an would want it to die a quick death. But it can't be proprietary if its open for everyone to use.

 

[Mand]

Proprietary only to those companies that refuse to develop drivers for it. I understand why Nvidia wouldn't want to support it an would want it to die a quick death. But it can't be proprietary if its open for everyone to use.

AMD has control over it, AMD determines what it does and does not support and how it does support things. There are no other entities who determine Mantle code. A SDK is not the same thing as open source.

That's the very definition of proprietary.

 

[DaveSimmons]

Both sides have per-game deals that affect a few titles. Unless you're a huge fan of one of those titles and expect to play it a lot (DudeBroShoota XXII) I wouldn't buy a card for either side's exclusives.

I have a GTX 680 but hardware PhysX hasn't improved any of the games I play. Mantle improves the minimum framerate on a couple of games but if you don't play those games it doesn't help you at all.

 

[3DVagabond]

These allegations are pretty ridiculous considering amd is pushing a proprietary graphics api.

AMD isn't forcing nVidia to run Mantle and not releasing the source or allowing the devs to share the source with nVidia to hinder optimizing. You can argue Mantle being proprietary all you want to. In this example though, it doesn't apply.

Those allegations have been rather thoroughly debunked. Most of them are just factually inaccurate.

Exactly what has been debunked?

 

[SlickR12345]

It really depends on the price/performance ratio, I tend to favor all AMD cards all the way to 280x over the Nvidia equivalents and even after I think unless you are going for the 780ti, a $300 290 is one of the best price to performance ratio graphic cards, especially with a great custom cooler.

But the difference between the 770 and 280x is small, so it really depends on your preference really.

 

[Topweasel]

AMD has control over it, AMD determines what it does and does not support and how it does support things. There are no other entities who determine Mantle code. A SDK is not the same thing as open source.

That's the very definition of proprietary.

As it applies to computing it proprietary means that only the original developer can use it or that it requires other users to buy a license. Neither apply here. In your example something freely used by everyone would be a proprietary standard. USB. USB is an Intel developed open standard I/O system. No one here would suggest that USB is proprietary even though Intel gets the jump on having USB controllers available in the market.

There are lot of reasons why Nvidia doesn't want Mantle to survive, the fact that it was developed and will be developed by their main competitor is one major reason. But being proprietary isn't one of them. An example on a proprietary API would be Physx.

 

[SirPauly]

PhysX is a middle ware! Cuda is a proprietary API!

 

[Genx87]

As it applies to computing it proprietary means that only the original developer can use it or that it requires other users to buy a license. Neither apply here. In your example something freely used by everyone would be a proprietary standard. USB. USB is an Intel developed open standard I/O system. No one here would suggest that USB is proprietary even though Intel gets the jump on having USB controllers available in the market.

There are lot of reasons why Nvidia doesn't want Mantle to survive, the fact that it was developed and will be developed by their main competitor is one major reason. But being proprietary isn't one of them. An example on a proprietary API would be Physx.

Mantle is proprietary, DX is proprietary, PhysX is proprietary. Just because more than one manufacturer uses a proprietary standard or has access to one. Doesnt make that proprietary standard not proprietary. Mantle is proprietary by its very nature it requires GCN.

 

[BrightCandle]

Propritry in regards to software has nothing to do with cost. VESA the standards body for Displayport for example charges for access to the Displayport standard. You either need to be a VESA member (expensive yearly cost) or pay for access to the standard in order to implement it. Yet it is a standard, because there is a body looking after its future, a body made up of all the interested parties. Some standards are free to implement, but that isn't what makes something a standard, its about who controls, who can update it and how the future of the software is made.

AMD's mantle is propriety, because only they control its future. There is no body of interested parties, there is no intention even to pass it into such a body because AMD intends to release updates that allow direct access to their hardware as soon as the hardware is available. It is without a doubt propriety, so far based on their statements they absolutely intend to keep it that way. AMD might be saying its a standard because you can implement the driver interface for free, but they misunderstand the key elements of a standard which is that all interested parties get to participate in the future direction. AMD is misusing the word and is dead wrong on that point.

PhysX = Proprietry, as is gamesworks, as is CUDA, as is gsync.

DirectX is a little different, its clearly Microsoft's but its developed with input from AMD, Nvidia and Intel, they have some control over its future. It can't be considered a standard really but its been implemented via WINE on Linux reasonably well, so its possible to say its a standard. Its certainly a lot closer than most of technologies I mentioned.

 

[MeldarthX]

Mantle is proprietary, DX is proprietary, PhysX is proprietary. Just because more than one manufacturer uses a proprietary standard or has access to one. Doesnt make that proprietary standard not proprietary. Mantle is proprietary by its very nature it requires GCN.

No it doesn't require GCN...as mantle is thin layer api; GCN is what AMD is using in mantle; once the SDK is release; intel will be able to op for its igpu; and nvidia could for their graphics.....*they won't most likely but I can easily see Intel adopt it*

I wish this myth would die.....

http://www.dsogaming.com/news/amds-mantle-does-not-require-gpus-with-gcn-architecture/

it will work on any modern gpu; reason it won't work on 6000 series and below is the hardware its as flexible.

 

[Stuka87]

Mantle does not make nVidia cards perform worse, and developers are not prevented from helping nVidia to optimize their cards for that game. It has zero effect on DirectX.

Gameworks on the other hand directly impacts the performance of AMD cards, and since it is closed source, AMD cannot optimize their cards for the DirectX games that use it. The devs are also forbidden from helping AMD to optimize their cards for that game.

So they are simple not comparable.

 

[Genx87]

No it doesn't require GCN...as mantle is thin layer api; GCN is what AMD is using in mantle; once the SDK is release; intel will be able to op for its igpu; and nvidia could for their graphics.....*they won't most likely but I can easily see Intel adopt it*

I wish this myth would die.....

http://www.dsogaming.com/news/amds-mantle-does-not-require-gpus-with-gcn-architecture/

it will work on any modern gpu; reason it won't work on 6000 series and below is the hardware its as flexible.

On one hand you say it will work on any hardware but then admit it doesnt work on AMDs older hardware. If this api is closer to the metal like it claims. Then it cant work across multiple hardware types.

And you better let AMD know their API doesnt need GCN to work.

http://www.amd.com/en-us/innovations/software-technologies/mantle#overview

Mantle is the harmony of three essential ingredients:

A driver within the AMD Catalyst™ software suite that lets applications speak directly to the Graphics Core Next architecture;
A GPU or APU enabled with the Graphics Core Next architecture;
An application or game written to take advantage of Mantle.

 

[Stuka87]

On one hand you say it will work on any hardware but then admit it doesnt work on AMDs older hardware. If this api is closer to the metal like it claims. Then it cant work across multiple hardware types.

And you better let AMD know their API doesnt need GCN to work.

http://www.amd.com/en-us/innovations/software-technologies/mantle#overview

I think what he meant is there is nothing locking it to GCN. AMD has stated that in order for it to work, a card has to support a list of features. For AMD, GCN was the first card to support all those features. For nVidia, it is Fermi as I recall. Not sure what Intel GPU's would be supported. Most likely HD4000 and above.