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NVIDIA demos GPU-accelerated Flash video

Wreckage

Banned
Jul 1, 2005
5,529
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http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=20471

The below video compares playback of a 720p Flash trailer for 2009's Star Trek movie on an Atom-based netbook with integrated Intel graphics and an NVIDIA ION-based netbook with GeForce 9400M graphics. The difference is like night and day - one stutters along, whilst the other provides silky-smooth video.

What's useful is that Flash acceleration is supported on the majority of NVIDIA's GPUs - including Tegra, resulting in the possibility of high-def Flash video on portable handhelds such as Microsoft's Zune HD and various upcoming smartphones.
:cool:
 

SergeC

Senior member
May 7, 2005
484
0
71
GPU accelerated flash (or even better, OpenCL-accelerated flash) would be fantastic.
 

bfdd

Lifer
Feb 3, 2007
13,312
1
0
Originally posted by: SergeC
GPU accelerated flash (or even better, OpenCL-accelerated flash) would be fantastic.
i want to slap you.... you realize OpenCL wouldn't do any accelerating right? It'd still be the GPU and/or CPU doing it...
 

ViRGE

Elite Member, Moderator Emeritus
Oct 9, 1999
31,516
165
106
It's about damn time. Most Flash is just H.264 in Adobe's FLV container anyhow, so there's no reason not to accelerate it.

Originally posted by: bfdd
Originally posted by: SergeC
GPU accelerated flash (or even better, OpenCL-accelerated flash) would be fantastic.
i want to slap you.... you realize OpenCL wouldn't do any accelerating right? It'd still be the GPU and/or CPU doing it...
More specifically, VP3/UVD would be doing it. You're offloading decoding on to dedicated DSP on the die of the GPU. So you wouldn't use OpenCL, you would just need to know how to talk to the DSP. This would be DXVA on Windows.
 

nitromullet

Diamond Member
Jan 7, 2004
9,031
36
91
I wonder if this is going to be cross platform between Windows, OS X, and Linux. If the API they are usig is OpenCL it should be easy to make it function cross platform. I know the Mac community is chomping at the bit to see some apps running on the gpu. I also wonder how efficiently Flash will run on the gpu because apparently Flash is a battery drainer in notebooks.
 

ViRGE

Elite Member, Moderator Emeritus
Oct 9, 1999
31,516
165
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Originally posted by: nitromullet
I wonder if this is going to be cross platform between Windows, OS X, and Linux. If the API they are usig is OpenCL it should be easy to make it function cross platform. I know the Mac community is chomping at the bit to see some apps running on the gpu. I also wonder how efficiently Flash will run on the gpu because apparently Flash is a battery drainer in notebooks.
It won't be cross-platform; in fact it can't be. They'll have to write a different interface for each OS. And Linux would be completely SOL, it doesn't have a (modern) standardized acceleration API.
 

nitromullet

Diamond Member
Jan 7, 2004
9,031
36
91
Originally posted by: ViRGE
Originally posted by: nitromullet
I wonder if this is going to be cross platform between Windows, OS X, and Linux. If the API they are usig is OpenCL it should be easy to make it function cross platform. I know the Mac community is chomping at the bit to see some apps running on the gpu. I also wonder how efficiently Flash will run on the gpu because apparently Flash is a battery drainer in notebooks.
It won't be cross-platform; in fact it can't be. They'll have to write a different interface for each OS. And Linux would be completely SOL, it doesn't have a (modern) standardized acceleration API.
I thought that was the point of OpenCL... to provide a cross platform API for gpu accelerated applications. I know OS X supports OpenCL in Snow Leopard, but I really don't use Linux anymore so I don't really know what's going on there.
 

ViRGE

Elite Member, Moderator Emeritus
Oct 9, 1999
31,516
165
106
Originally posted by: nitromullet
Originally posted by: ViRGE
Originally posted by: nitromullet
I wonder if this is going to be cross platform between Windows, OS X, and Linux. If the API they are usig is OpenCL it should be easy to make it function cross platform. I know the Mac community is chomping at the bit to see some apps running on the gpu. I also wonder how efficiently Flash will run on the gpu because apparently Flash is a battery drainer in notebooks.
It won't be cross-platform; in fact it can't be. They'll have to write a different interface for each OS. And Linux would be completely SOL, it doesn't have a (modern) standardized acceleration API.
I thought that was the point of OpenCL... to provide a cross platform API for gpu accelerated applications. I know OS X supports OpenCL in Snow Leopard, but I really don't use Linux anymore so I don't really know what's going on there.
As I've said before, GPUs aren't accelerating video decoding using their standard shader hardware. They're accelerating it using fixed-function DSPs, which we know as VP3 and UVD2. Specialized DSPs are tiny and use much less power than trying to do it in a shader, which is why even things like the 9300M have one.

OpenCL only gives you access to the shader hardware. You need another API to access the video decoding DSPs; and there's no universal API for this.
 

Wreckage

Banned
Jul 1, 2005
5,529
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0
Originally posted by: nitromullet
I wonder if this is going to be cross platform between Windows, OS X, and Linux. If the API they are usig is OpenCL it should be easy to make it function cross platform. I know the Mac community is chomping at the bit to see some apps running on the gpu. I also wonder how efficiently Flash will run on the gpu because apparently Flash is a battery drainer in notebooks.
They are probably using CUDA which does support Windows\OSX\Linux.
 

Dribble

Golden Member
Aug 9, 2005
1,923
458
136
As I understand it tegra is based on geforce 6 hardware and CUDA requires geforce 8 or better. Tegra 2 is geforce 8 based I think.
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
28,164
5,226
126
I wish I could stream 720p video and just worry about my processing power. :(

*grumble* *grumble* crappy isp
 

Wreckage

Banned
Jul 1, 2005
5,529
0
0
Originally posted by: Dribble
As I understand it tegra is based on geforce 6 hardware and CUDA requires geforce 8 or better. Tegra 2 is geforce 8 based I think.
They may have some sort of CUDA lite? I think the official announcement is due next week so maybe we will find out then. I would like to see video run smoothly on an Ion based netbook.
 

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
12,842
325
126
Originally posted by: Wreckage
They may have some sort of CUDA lite? I think the official announcement is due next week so maybe we will find out then. I would like to see video run smoothly on an Ion based netbook.
Originally posted by: ViRGE
As I've said before, GPUs aren't accelerating video decoding using their standard shader hardware.
It is a cool development, regardless. Flash has been such a CPU hog, even when it plays SD material.
 

nitromullet

Diamond Member
Jan 7, 2004
9,031
36
91
Originally posted by: ViRGE
Originally posted by: nitromullet
I thought that was the point of OpenCL... to provide a cross platform API for gpu accelerated applications. I know OS X supports OpenCL in Snow Leopard, but I really don't use Linux anymore so I don't really know what's going on there.
As I've said before, GPUs aren't accelerating video decoding using their standard shader hardware. They're accelerating it using fixed-function DSPs, which we know as VP3 and UVD2. Specialized DSPs are tiny and use much less power than trying to do it in a shader, which is why even things like the 9300M have one.

OpenCL only gives you access to the shader hardware. You need another API to access the video decoding DSPs; and there's no universal API for this.
Thanks. I was not aware of that.

Originally posted by: Wreckage
They are probably using CUDA which does support Windows\OSX\Linux.
This makes sense.
 

Kakkoii

Senior member
Jun 5, 2009
379
0
0
Nvidia asked me to pull the video until October 6th lol. If only I was part of the Nvidia Focus group, then I would comply :p


This update will be great. It's good to see things moving towards using the GPU instead of aging CPU's.
 

MODEL3

Senior member
Jul 22, 2009
528
0
0
From pcper.com

NVIDIA and Adobe announce GPU acceleration for Flash 10.1

http://www.pcper.com/news.php?s=5

This news has been building for a long time - we first saw word that GPU-accelerated Flash video was coming back in June at Computex. Adobe Flash Player version 10.1 will take advantage of the GPU to accelerate not just video but all Flash applications. This could be, in my mind, the killer feature that finally pushes GPU computing into the mainstream. Netbooks and nettops based on the NVIDIA ION chipset will now have a significant performance advantage over vanilla Intel-based netbooks in a widely used and important application. As Adobe states, users of netbooks with dedicated GPUs "can take advantage of GPU-accelerated video decoding to deliver the kind of smooth Flash technology based video previously found only on higher-end PCs."

As I mention in my State of NVIDIA editorial, I know that MANY people will be excited to finally be able to use a super-cheap nettop PC on their home theater and be able to access streaming Hulu content.

While NVIDIA is the one sending out the press release this morning, it should be noted that this Flash acceleration uses the DXVA protocols - not CUDA or anything NVIDIA-specific. That means that AMD GPUs will also benefit from Flash acceleration so users of low-cost 785G platforms, for example, will also see great performance improvement.

Now for some bad news - this Flash Player 10.1 revision isn't out yet and the only release information we have is "before the end of the year." That version, when available, will be a beta version that users will have to manually go download and install. The full, auto-update version that will include DXVA support won't be pushed out until the second quarter of 2010. That still gives ION's competitors (basically Intel) a LOT of time to make up the difference 10.1 will offer.

That being said, the world of netbooks just had a major shake up
 

T2k

Golden Member
Feb 24, 2004
1,664
4
0
Originally posted by: ViRGE
It's about damn time. Most Flash is just H.264 in Adobe's FLV container anyhow, so there's no reason not to accelerate it.

Originally posted by: bfdd
Originally posted by: SergeC
GPU accelerated flash (or even better, OpenCL-accelerated flash) would be fantastic.
i want to slap you.... you realize OpenCL wouldn't do any accelerating right? It'd still be the GPU and/or CPU doing it...
More specifically, VP3/UVD would be doing it. You're offloading decoding on to dedicated DSP on the die of the GPU. So you wouldn't use OpenCL, you would just need to know how to talk to the DSP. This would be DXVA on Windows.
Considering the current GPU-accelerated Adobe CS4 features are all OpenGL (Win/OS X lowest common denom), it's unlikely to stay, I think: http://kb2.adobe.com/cps/404/kb404898.html#features

It's really nothing to do with NV or ATI, it's just Adobe haven't had the time yet, I think.
 

ViRGE

Elite Member, Moderator Emeritus
Oct 9, 1999
31,516
165
106
Originally posted by: T2k
Originally posted by: ViRGE
It's about damn time. Most Flash is just H.264 in Adobe's FLV container anyhow, so there's no reason not to accelerate it.

Originally posted by: bfdd
Originally posted by: SergeC
GPU accelerated flash (or even better, OpenCL-accelerated flash) would be fantastic.
i want to slap you.... you realize OpenCL wouldn't do any accelerating right? It'd still be the GPU and/or CPU doing it...
More specifically, VP3/UVD would be doing it. You're offloading decoding on to dedicated DSP on the die of the GPU. So you wouldn't use OpenCL, you would just need to know how to talk to the DSP. This would be DXVA on Windows.
Considering the current GPU-accelerated Adobe CS4 features are all OpenGL (Win/OS X lowest common denom), it's unlikely to stay, I think: http://kb2.adobe.com/cps/404/kb404898.html#features

It's really nothing to do with NV or ATI, it's just Adobe haven't had the time yet, I think.
You're confusing rasterization/rendering with video decoding. OpenGL is a framework to do the former, which is why it's a great fit for something like Photoshop CS4 since it's all about image manipulation.

But OpenGL doesn't include any way to interface with video decoding DSPs, so it's not something you would use for enabling video decoding.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,862
83
91
should be pretty sweet. the cuda coreavc implementation lets me time stretch hd video without much cpu involvement at all. quite impressive. plenty of headroom there.
 

KIAman

Diamond Member
Mar 7, 2001
3,342
23
81
Wow, this is nice. One of my projects must use flash video with a tiny processor (space, heat and power requirements) and no matter how clean the code was, the flash was keeping the CPU at 60-80% utilization, which killed any other use out of the processor. This might be exactly what we were looking for! Holy shiz!
 

ilkhan

Golden Member
Jul 21, 2006
1,117
1
0
is it confirmed that X4500MHD can do this as well? AFAIK it can handle DXVA, but would like to make sure.
 

Zstream

Diamond Member
Oct 24, 2005
3,396
277
136
Originally posted by: Wreckage
http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=20471

The below video compares playback of a 720p Flash trailer for 2009's Star Trek movie on an Atom-based netbook with integrated Intel graphics and an NVIDIA ION-based netbook with GeForce 9400M graphics. The difference is like night and day - one stutters along, whilst the other provides silky-smooth video.

What's useful is that Flash acceleration is supported on the majority of NVIDIA's GPUs - including Tegra, resulting in the possibility of high-def Flash video on portable handhelds such as Microsoft's Zune HD and various upcoming smartphones.
:cool:
So the Zotac Ion I purchased is doing what then in Hulu and flash based sites? How does one get to have Adobe Flash accelerated playback?

All I know is that I am getting bad performance in flash.

Win 7 professional
 

Keysplayr

Elite Member
Jan 16, 2003
21,209
50
91
Originally posted by: GlacierFreeze
How long until Nvidia pays to block Flash when non-Nvidia cards are detected?
Hmmmmm. Not a bad idea! Let me forward this to NV....









I keeed, I keeed. :D
 

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