nVidia blocks Hardware Unboxed due to rasterization focus. Update: nVidia retracts.

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BFG10K

Lifer
Aug 14, 2000
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LTT coverage


My thoughts

I think this is wrong and to be completely fair, I called out this behavior when AMD played similar shenanigans with TPU and Tech Report.

As for the "gamers" comment above, as of right now I don't give a crap about ray tracing, and even less of a crap about DLSS. I own a 2060 Super and never use any of those features by choice, for various reasons. Perhaps in 3-5 years with 2-3 new generations of cards, my opinion might change.

Rasterization is by far the most important feature for me, and I'm not a minority by any stretch of the imagination:

Survey.jpg

Update: nVidia now retracted


I'm not surprised they retracted but I expected it to take longer along with a "it was an internal draft that was never supposed to be released", or similar.
 
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DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator CPU Forum Mod and Elite Member
Super Moderator
Aug 22, 2001
28,223
19,708
146
Why turn things around for trying to pin the blame on people who criticize stealth/viral marketing. You're ignoring the fact that the AT forum moderators banned people for implying that someone was an Nvidia viral marketer without absolute proof. Did AT ever bothered to reinstate Tuttle's (I think that was him) account? You're just giving Nvidia and every company who stooped to using scummy tactics a free pass if you are not offended and go on insisting that people who don't like it have to temporarily/permanently boycott Nvidia. Instead of thanking people for bringing such matters to light, now they are part of the problem for not 'sticking up for their principles', what BS.

It boggles the mind that people like Rollo/Keys got to become mods when they were low key trolling the forums. Constantly making subtle jabs and disingenuous assertions, subtly trying to turn opinion against Radeon/AMD, making the forums a more corrosive experience. At least I get to point that AT mods/admins have to own that mistake and doubly so when the forum got DDOS'd by Rollo.
Your post contains straw man arguments; I was not blaming anyone, or giving any company a free pass. In fact everything I wrote was mischaracterized. And I will absolutely not comment on admin or mod actions, any criticism has to be taken to mod discussions, it is not permitted anywhere else. I cannot get involved as I have posted as a member, just giving you fair warning how the rules work. The same as any other member who has read them could.

I am not certain it can be made anymore clear, but I will try. It is the frog and the scorpion; can't blame someone for doing what you know they always do, even when they say they won't do it. Calling nV snake oil salesmen, guilty of the same tactics, including plants in the crowd, is definitely not a free pass, it's derisive. Seriously, I have to explain that? And yes it was comical to me that people old enough to use the forums, were naive enough to not be aware of a sales tactic that has been around for at least 100s of years, likely far longer. That is my perspective, and I have zero cares if it is popular or not. Because failure to use critical thinking, and do sufficient research, of not only tech but the purveyors, is intrinsic to being an informed consumer. I have no sympathy for those that fail to do so.

But that brings us to the other detestable parties involved: how some members reacted reminded my of Stalag 17: our protagonist points out that when they were all beating him as he lay in his bunk, the spy/plant was the one beating the hardest. My point, since it seems I have to be exhaustingly explicit to avoid having my words misinterpreted, is that a lot of the outrage was due to their having an emotional and/or financial investment involved, and were the ones "beating" nV the hardest. Never will I be handing out firm handshakes for being the worst part of an angry mob.

And why would I thank anyone? What? I am supposed to say thanks for telling me what I already know? Not gonna happen. To me, the whole thing was theater. Furthermore, nothing has changed. Shills are still shilling, and fanatics are still behaving fanatically. And Nvidia is still doing anything they want, and laughing all the way to the bank. In other news water wet. Perhaps a cold glass will help dissolve some of the saltiness.

Forums and comment sections on sites like Youtube are filled with the same tired shilling, both paid and pro bono. So what victory did that whole fiasco win? Whatever it was it was hollow. As if anything worthwhile came out of it. Here we are, discussing yet another Nvidia being the big bad. And the most amusing part for me is that they will make even more money. Because everything you guys do, just makes them a household name were they previously may not have been. The ONLY thing that changes corporate behavior beyond a South Park BP I'm sorry, is VOTING WITH YOUR WALLET. You stop buying anything they make money from, period, full stop. What is bs is thinking anything else works. There are outliers, but historically that is just the way it is, like it or lump, I care not.


Lastly, I told you it may be hard to hear. ;)
 

DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator CPU Forum Mod and Elite Member
Super Moderator
Aug 22, 2001
28,223
19,708
146
I have not bought any thing Nvidia since 2008. They are too scummy for my liking. My wallet is safe from them.
It is the only language they understand. If everyone bellyaching about how horrible they are, refused to buy their products, as you do, they might even revisit how they do things. Maybe, just maybe it could happen. Yeah, and maybe I'm a Chinese jet pilot.

Hope you are having a great holiday season.:beercheers:
 

Guru

Senior member
May 5, 2017
830
361
106
Your post contains straw man arguments; I was not blaming anyone, or giving any company a free pass. In fact everything I wrote was mischaracterized. And I will absolutely not comment on admin or mod actions, any criticism has to be taken to mod discussions, it is not permitted anywhere else. I cannot get involved as I have posted as a member, just giving you fair warning how the rules work. The same as any other member who has read them could.

I am not certain it can be made anymore clear, but I will try. It is the frog and the scorpion; can't blame someone for doing what you know they always do, even when they say they won't do it. Calling nV snake oil salesmen, guilty of the same tactics, including plants in the crowd, is definitely not a free pass, it's derisive. Seriously, I have to explain that? And yes it was comical to me that people old enough to use the forums, were naive enough to not be aware of a sales tactic that has been around for at least 100s of years, likely far longer. That is my perspective, and I have zero cares if it is popular or not. Because failure to use critical thinking, and do sufficient research, of not only tech but the purveyors, is intrinsic to being an informed consumer. I have no sympathy for those that fail to do so.

But that brings us to the other detestable parties involved: how some members reacted reminded my of Stalag 17: our protagonist points out that when they were all beating him as he lay in his bunk, the spy/plant was the one beating the hardest. My point, since it seems I have to be exhaustingly explicit to avoid having my words misinterpreted, is that a lot of the outrage was due to their having an emotional and/or financial investment involved, and were the ones "beating" nV the hardest. Never will I be handing out firm handshakes for being the worst part of an angry mob.

And why would I thank anyone? What? I am supposed to say thanks for telling me what I already know? Not gonna happen. To me, the whole thing was theater. Furthermore, nothing has changed. Shills are still shilling, and fanatics are still behaving fanatically. And Nvidia is still doing anything they want, and laughing all the way to the bank. In other news water wet. Perhaps a cold glass will help dissolve some of the saltiness.

Forums and comment sections on sites like Youtube are filled with the same tired shilling, both paid and pro bono. So what victory did that whole fiasco win? Whatever it was it was hollow. As if anything worthwhile came out of it. Here we are, discussing yet another Nvidia being the big bad. And the most amusing part for me is that they will make even more money. Because everything you guys do, just makes them a household name were they previously may not have been. The ONLY thing that changes corporate behavior beyond a South Park BP I'm sorry, is VOTING WITH YOUR WALLET. You stop buying anything they make money from, period, full stop. What is bs is thinking anything else works. There are outliers, but historically that is just the way it is, like it or lump, I care not.


Lastly, I told you it may be hard to hear. ;)
So then STOP banning and threatening users who expose the corporate shills! If you do not ban actual shills and allow them to operate and even mod them, at least don't ban users who expose the shills, otherwise AT is literally a shill website. Every mod and admin represent the website and you wouldn't want I think to make AT be exposed as a shill based website doing the bidding of corporations!




Mod callout are not allowed anywhere. You have a issue with the moderation here?
Make an MD thread.


esquared
Anandtech Forum Director
 
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BFG10K

Lifer
Aug 14, 2000
22,654
2,775
126
Its 4 GB, or 8 GB should Nvidia decide to give more VRAM to customers. But most likely, knowing Nvidia, its 4 GB on 128 bit GDDR6 bus.
Imagine a 3070 owner who dropped $half a thousand on an 8GB card now seeing a budget 3050 have the same VRAM. o_O

We know the 3060 will have a 12GB SKU, so this would be an even bigger slap in the face if it happens.

I've had multiple opportunites to get a 3060TI/3070 but there's no way I'm getting obsolete DOA VRAM capacity, especially at inflated pricing.
 
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Mar 11, 2004
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So, I had a longer post pointing out the many many many flaws in the "its capitalizm stupid, durr hurr" "speak with your money and STFU" argument, but I got to the part where once again its being compared to concentration camps and...well, f*** it, its clearly pointless as they clearly do not understand either the situation or have a vested interest in trying to downplay it. Or maybe they just like being an edgelord?

I don't know, perhaps someone can explain to me, why people who just happen to be mods on this site have some bizarro need where they're seemingly forced to compare viral marketing to literal war and crimes against humanity while simultaneously downplaying the viral marketing? Is this something that makes sense in their brains? Because its pretty pointedly weird behavior that is kinda WTF. I mean, I'm not the only one trying to understand how that analogy actually makes sense within their argument (or why they think its apt to use), am I?

Ok, but I do want to touch on a couple of things:

Speaking with wallets, right? The magical property of capitalism that cures all ills and rights all wrongs? Yeah, that hasn't been working. I mean, when Apple, Microsoft, Sony, basically every smartphone OEM, Tesla, and I don't even remember what others spoke with their wallets yet we're still getting the same general behavior, do you really think that works? But yep, just keep telling the dozens of posters on an obscure tech forum to speak with their wallets. That'll really fix Nvidia. Or I guess we could just "not be offended" by it and accept that all corporations are evil (which is an interesting comment when saying that you shouldn't give money to evil companies, guess we should stop buying anything at all)? Either way, the point is that we really just need to stop complaining about it. Which that's what that argument actually is: "speak with your wallets and also STFU" or else I guess we'll be subjected to further horrible analogies where viral marketing is like crimes against humanity but not actually something to be complained about. Which is certainly a bit of a mixed message.

Which, sure, you can say how this is just a simple capitalism issue so people should just STFU, kinda like how you could also claim Gamergate was only about "ethics in game journalism." I mean it doesn't actually make sense if you apply basically any logic or look at the situation with objectivity, and their own arguments constantly eat themselves due to the poor logic (while also revealing they apparently are struggling with even a basic understanding of things). But sure, you can try and keep making that same argument over and over, but just repeating it over and over doesn't actually suddenly make it work. I guess you get points for the basic awarness of how one aspect of this supposedly functions (although its interesting that instead of pointing out how that actually is a bit of the issue and why the poor/corrupt behavior has continued, you're claiming we'd be able to actually influence that personally when several of the largest and most powerful corporations on the planet couldn't), kinda like the gamergaters discovering that media focused around an industry are kinda at the whims of the industry and that there's gonna be a lot of relationships (both professional and personal) that create issues because of it. But since you then for some reason can't seem to see how that doesn't necessarily mean what you think it means (i.e. capitalism doesn't really work like you think it does, or the gamergaters not realizing that conflicsts of interest doesn't mean there's a kabal of evil wizards out to sway them into submitting to feminists so that they never have sex), isn't gonna fly with me at least.

Er, since it apparently needs to be expressly explained for probably the 50th time in this thread, the issue isn't just with Nvidia. Its also because of the tone deaf playing stupid then doubling down on doubling down on playing stupid that this site did. How speaking with our wallets against Nvidia deals with that, you'll have to let me know. But by all means, respond exactly the same way as they did before and then act surprised that people are trying to tell you you don't get it. Now, I know, that might be tough to hear for some people.


Moderation callouts are not allowed. If you have an issue with moderation,

you create a thread in moderator discussions.

Additionally, there is no need to discuss "evil wizards submitting to feminists to never have sex"
in the tech forums. I don't even know where that weirdness would go, but it doesn't belong in a Nvidia
discussion thread, and it's not allowed in the tech forums.


AT Mod Usandthem
 
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DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator CPU Forum Mod and Elite Member
Super Moderator
Aug 22, 2001
28,223
19,708
146
durr hurr
Being caustic and acerbic is your M.O. and that's fine. If you have read my post over the years, you know I don't do flame wars, or engage when being trolled. I leave the thoughts and opinions I want to share with the readers, because doing any of the above is an effort in futility. You are not going to alter my views with your sarcastic, hyperbolic, nonsense. And I know full well from your posting history, there is no way anyone will ever convince you you're wrong about anything.