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NTFS.SYS has caused me a major headache...

destrekor

destrekor

Lifer
So I have a Windows XP installation on my PVR box I am configuring, and well.. I have it all configured for the most part and it was working nicely.
But I figured I should have a dedicated partition for the Recordings and software specific for the PVR features of the system, as suggested by many of the guides from PVR software I had tried. (btw, I have sort of settled on SageTV, just using up the trial but likely to buy it)
so I use Partition Magic 8 to split the somewhat fresh C drive (a week old? at most) to 15gb and the rest of the 160gb to the PVR partition (with 64k cluster size, NTFS, and btw, the C drive is NTFS as well)..

After reboot, everything is in proper order. I go to change the recording directory in SageTV, and um... crash. Confused, I try again. Crash. During reboot it reboots again, and after another try I see the ugly blue screen.

Here's what essentially the error is:

...caused by file: ntfs.sys
PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA

hmmmmm
now another problem:
aside from regular boot mode, safe mode does not work. Thinking, hmm, a repair install may help. (now thinking it wouldn't since its on the drive itself and not so much a windows issue)
I use the windows install disc, and first accidently go to the Recovery Console. Well it crashes anyway. I go back and go the normal option for installing windows (so I could try Repair Install, an option provided later). No go, because it crashes.
Now I am screwed...
is my only option to use a drive utility to format and start over?
or is there some other option I can try as a last resort? It almost seems as if the partition table may just be FUBAR, at least any repair that can save my configurations. Sucks because there is so much I have already done to make what is there now, and I may just have lost all progress. 🙁
 
Originally posted by: techmanc
I havent used partition magic in awhile but have you tried to use it to see if the partition has errors it can fix. I prefer Acronis Disk Director actually all their products. you can goto http://www.acronis.com/homecomputing/download/. It might find errors as well to fix
Click to expand...

can that program be ran without windows running? because if not, its worthless for me since Windows might as well not exist.
 
also due to problems I have had in the past I never have more than 1 primary partition on my systems so windows dont try to claim it as a boot or system drive. Just make all your drives extended. there a util on the acronis for converting primary drive to extended and it works pretty fast.........
 
this partition that was created was an extended/logical partition. i know not to create multiple primary partitions.
i have searched my issue in google "partition magic non paged area" and seems it has happened quite a bit and that the drives are perfectly fine without any errors on them, but that windows hates it and any non-windows OS can use the drive (same content on it) perfectly fine.
 
just wondering why you used 64k cluster size 4k is what all my drives are? maybe chaning it to 4k might help
 
Originally posted by: techmanc
just wondering why you used 64k cluster size 4k is what all my drives are? maybe chaning it to 4k might help
Click to expand...

because a larger cluster size helps performance when all the drive will host on it is large video files. small cluster sizes are good for thousands and thousands of files, versus large cluster sizes for a very low number of files. not sure why this is, but is has been documented for PVR systems.
 
also due to problems I have had in the past I never have more than 1 primary partition on my systems so windows dont try to claim it as a boot or system drive. Just make all your drives extended. there a util on the acronis for converting primary drive to extended and it works pretty fast.........
Click to expand...

That's complete BS, Win9X used to get confused by multiple primary partitions but nothing in the NT family ever has. There is absolutely no reason not to have multiple primary partitions these days. And the primary->extended converter works fast because all it has to do is change the partition entry in the MBR and create a partition entry at the beginning of the extended partition for the one you've converted, it doesn't actually move any data around.

i have searched my issue in google "partition magic non paged area" and seems it has happened quite a bit and that the drives are perfectly fine without any errors on them, but that windows hates it and any non-windows OS can use the drive (same content on it) perfectly fine.
Click to expand...

I would bet money that it's not a primar partition problem, most likely PQMagic did something wrong with the filesystem when you changed it's size and the NTFS driver doesn't know how to handle that so it crashes.
 
One of the first things XP does when it sees a new or resized partions is to run 'chkdsk' on it. PM8 mangled the resize job and the 64K cluster didn't help.
Try running PQ8 again and deleting the new partition. Then try to boot up. If it boots, make sure chkdsk ran on the boot partition. Then use XPs Disk Manager to create the new partition.
I've found that the safest way to use PM of any vintage is to do one operation at a time. Reboot after each change. Takes longer but it sure is a lot safer.


Bozo
 
Different cluster sizes aren't a problem, but whether PQMagic can change them reliably or not I can't say as I haven't used it in years.
 
hmmm, well good news
the PVR system is operational again as I took the advice of Bozo in that I deleted the extended partition (using FreeFDISK on my copy of Ultimate BootCD). Windows booted, so that was the first good thing. I ran CHKDSK on the drive and then formatted the empty space to be what I originally wanted, a 64k cluster NTFS partition (and this time made it a Primary partition as well). Its perfectly operation and runs like it should.
Glad I didn't have to re-do everything. That woulda been a PITA.
 
Why change partitions at all? I'd just put the TV .mpg recordings on the normal C: partition; what problem are you avoiding by splitting things, aside from sharing drive space less efficiently since extra space on C: would then be wasted?
 
Why change partitions at all? I'd just put the TV .mpg recordings on the normal C: partition; what problem are you avoiding by splitting things, aside from sharing drive space less efficiently since extra space on C: would then be wasted?
Click to expand...

Generally you're right, the benefits are dubious at best. But large video and audio files can sometimes benefit from being contiguous and the best way to keep them that way is to give them their own filesystem. If you put them on the system drive they'll be intermingled with all of the system files, profiles, etc but if they're saved to an empty filesystem the only thing they have to contend with is the MFT (assuming NTFS) and that can result in smoother viewing/recording. Personally I'd just buy a completely seperate drive because the second the OS decides to do something that requires paging to/from the other partition you've just increased your latency a hundred fold by making the drive do a full seek.

Of course if NTFS's allocation algorithms and Windows memory manager didn't suck this wouldn't be an issue, but you gotta work with what you got and in the Windows world NTFS is the only decent choice.
 
Of course if NTFS's allocation algorithms and Windows memory manager didn't suck this wouldn't be an issue, but you gotta work with what you got and in the Windows world NTFS is the only decent choice.
Click to expand...

You can always go FAT32, and isn't there a higher perf file system available in Vista? No, not WinFS (didn't that get delayed), but another one.

And regardless, isn't NTFS better than whatever is likely to running the show inside your average $75 PVR appliance?

Shoot, when it comes right down to it I'm betting I'll see better perf by buying larger cache sized disks or RAIDing some disks with a decent controller than worrying about my filesystem - a cheaper option nowadays.
 
Originally posted by: techmanc
also due to problems I have had in the past I never have more than 1 primary partition on my systems so windows dont try to claim it as a boot or system drive. Just make all your drives extended. there a util on the acronis for converting primary drive to extended and it works pretty fast.........
Click to expand...


You cannot have a logical drive without having " Multiple Primary " partitions. The Extended partition is a primary partition. Inside the extended partition is where the logical drives go.

pcgeek11
 
Originally posted by: pcgeek11
Originally posted by: techmanc
also due to problems I have had in the past I never have more than 1 primary partition on my systems so windows dont try to claim it as a boot or system drive. Just make all your drives extended. there a util on the acronis for converting primary drive to extended and it works pretty fast.........
Click to expand...


You cannot have a logical drive without having " Multiple Primary " partitions. The Extended partition is a primary partition. Inside the extended partition is where the logical drives go.

pcgeek11
Click to expand...


semantics
 
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