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Not all Religious people are nuts

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Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,007
571
126
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Atreus21
Originally posted by: DangerAardvark
lul, the volume on that video goes to eleven.

One of the problems with the concept of sin is that it decouples morality from real, tangible human suffering.
Is suffering the only immorality? You can commit immoral actions without inflicting suffering.
Can you?
Sure. Spying on someone is immoral. But as they don't know you're doing it, they're not suffering. You could also steal something intangible from someone without their knowing, like depriving them of some kind of opportunity.

 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,007
571
126
Originally posted by: db
Abortion and homosexuality are tools to rivet peoples' attention. If "religious" leaders REALLY cared about their flock rather than about obtaining political power and control, they would be talking about things far more prevalent, such as the near 50% divorce rate and how it ruins families and hurts children and society, and about the 40-60% of married people who cheat on their spouse. A sin is a sin is a sin. Talking about cheating doesn't get you votes. Talking about abortion and gays does.
Cheating on your spouse and high divorce rates are serious problems, but they don't take priority over murder.
 

evident

Lifer
Apr 5, 2005
11,625
182
106
the same goes for the abortion issue in most mainstream american churches. it's shocking how many churchgoers view abortion in a black and white manner, it's absolutely sickening. this is a good read. now if only the catholic church can make the same official statement.
 

Alkaline5

Senior member
Jun 21, 2001
801
0
0
Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

I think that the true believers are nuts. That isn't the same as saying that anyone who calls themselves Christian or Jewish is nuts. There are lots of people who are essentially atheists and agnostics who say that they are Christian or Jewish but who never attend church or synagogue and whose "professed" religion has almost zero impact on their lives. (If you're not following your religion then you don't really believe in it, now do you?)
I've read your statement several times, and it still sounds to me like you're saying that the people who don't put into practice what they claim to believe are the sane ones... but I know that can't be what you meant.
 

nakedfrog

No Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
51,832
4,298
126
Originally posted by: BMW540I6speed
The Republican party has lost their way. IMO they need to loose and rethink their future. The religous right should be purged from the party. Let them start their own party. Let the Republican party get back to their true value's & freedoms.
Huzzah!
 

brandonb

Diamond Member
Oct 17, 2006
3,731
2
0
People are vilified because according to the bible, to not be, would be supporting of gays. It specifically says in the bible that if you support gays, you defile the ground you walk on.

Right or wrong, thats how certain people view gays. Bigot or not. When it comes to "God's will", some will not change their mind no matter what us humans say or think. Even if its politically correct to accept gays and to not discriminate, some of those with faith believe this is the wrong move and they can't fall in line.

Since America is the "melting pot" of the world, obviously the two groups will never compromise and meet in the middle. I suppose thats why we have countries, to separate different type of people.

I find the OP thread topic to be insulting btw. :)
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,007
571
126
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: Atreus21
It's pretty sad that religion is so villified.
They have nobody but themselves to blame.
They should blame themselves for what? Every misstep of humanity laid at their feet?
 

BMW540I6speed

Golden Member
Aug 26, 2005
1,055
0
0
Originally posted by: Corbett
Originally posted by: BMW540I6speed
Since we learned this year that a candidate's pastor's statements about America are crucial to our decision whether to elect them.

On July 20, 2008, the pastor of Vice Presidential candidate Sarah Palin?s home church, Larry Kroon, delivered a sermon called ?Sin Is Personal To God.? Kroon, the senior pastor of the non-denominational Wasilla Bible Church in Wasilla, Alaska, used the book of Zephanaiah as his reference point for discussing ?that great day of the Lord when God will finally bring closure to human history? a day of wrath.? According to Kroon, ?all things and all people? are going to bear the brunt of God?s ?intense anger.? ?There?s anger with God,? he proclaimed. ?He takes sin personal.?
Kroon placed Zephaniah in a modern context, warning that the sinful habits of Americans would invite the wrath of God. ?And if Zephaniah were here today,? Kroon bellowed, ?he?d be saying, ?Listen, [God] is gonna deal with all the inhabitants of the earth. He is gonna strike out His hand against, yes, Wasilla; and Alaska; and the United States of America. There?s no exceptions here ? there?s none. It?s all.??
I read this but I guess I missed the part about him saying "God Damn America" or that the USA infected black people with the aids virus.
Of course you did silly. The other American society hating preacher said that. Have you been paying attention. Maybe you are preoccupied mentaly with God rising up to create that communist Soviet alliance with the middle east, which Kroon said could concievably happen in a matter of weeks or could happen by this fall.?
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
67,476
4,153
126
Originally posted by: Atreus21
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: Atreus21
It's pretty sad that religion is so villified.
They have nobody but themselves to blame.
They should blame themselves for what? Every misstep of humanity laid at their feet?
For voting for one moron after another just because each claims to be religious?
 

OrByte

Diamond Member
Jul 21, 2000
9,299
137
106
Originally posted by: db
Abortion and homosexuality are tools to rivet peoples' attention. If "religious" leaders REALLY cared about their flock rather than about obtaining political power and control, they would be talking about things far more prevalent, such as the near 50% divorce rate and how it ruins families and hurts children and society, and about the 40-60% of married people who cheat on their spouse. A sin is a sin is a sin. Talking about cheating doesn't get you votes. Talking about abortion and gays does.
excellent point.

This weekend, at church, a newspaper was circulated at the front door as people walk in.

This "newspaper" was a positions paper, it outlined the position of the church on California's Propositions, as well as congressional seats (local and national) that are up for election.

For 95% of those seats, it was the churches position to vote Republican. Basically straight down the list they wanted its church people to vote R.

and then of course, a big ol fold out pamphlet on how we need to vote for Prop 8 (Anti Gay marriage prop)

such hypocrites. The church is weak. I only hope and pray that people's faith is strong.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
68,480
3,593
126
Originally posted by: Atreus21
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Atreus21
Originally posted by: DangerAardvark
lul, the volume on that video goes to eleven.

One of the problems with the concept of sin is that it decouples morality from real, tangible human suffering.
Is suffering the only immorality? You can commit immoral actions without inflicting suffering.
Can you?
Sure. Spying on someone is immoral. But as they don't know you're doing it, they're not suffering. You could also steal something intangible from someone without their knowing, like depriving them of some kind of opportunity.
Both your examples have proven to cause Suffering. Perhaps the acts themselves don't initially cause Suffering, but the potential for Suffering as a result is very real.
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
2
0
Originally posted by: Atreus21
Originally posted by: DangerAardvark
lul, the volume on that video goes to eleven.

One of the problems with the concept of sin is that it decouples morality from real, tangible human suffering.
Is suffering the only immorality? You can commit immoral actions without inflicting suffering.
According to the Christian faith, wrongdoings towards God DOES make God suffer, do they not?

Explain yourself, are you extra special Christian or something?
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
2
0
Originally posted by: Atreus21
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Atreus21
Originally posted by: DangerAardvark
lul, the volume on that video goes to eleven.

One of the problems with the concept of sin is that it decouples morality from real, tangible human suffering.
Is suffering the only immorality? You can commit immoral actions without inflicting suffering.
Can you?
Sure. Spying on someone is immoral. But as they don't know you're doing it, they're not suffering. You could also steal something intangible from someone without their knowing, like depriving them of some kind of opportunity.
They are still the sufferers of your spying.
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
2
0
Originally posted by: Atreus21
It's pretty sad that religion is so villified.
Do you think that there is a reason for this?

If not, i can give you hundreds of reasons without even having to provide one link because you'll know it's all true.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
18
81
Eh, I guess that depends on which definition of "nuts" you are looking at.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
345
126
Originally posted by: nakedfrog
Originally posted by: BMW540I6speed
The Republican party has lost their way. IMO they need to loose and rethink their future. The religous right should be purged from the party. Let them start their own party. Let the Republican party get back to their true value's & freedoms.
Huzzah!
The point being missed is that ending that alliance is the last thing they want to do, because they know that the radical right economic supporters and the voters they can fool are not close to a majority, and the religious right is not close to a majority, and they will both sit and watch democrats in power if they don't join up, so they join up and compromise with one another for each to have a share of power, and the democrats get shut out.

Groups will make great compromises to not get left out of power. What you're asking for is just impractical IMO - but the desired result is that the rest of Americans beat both groups.

However, that's often not working, as we see with GWB getting power. So democrats then need to make their own compromises, perhaps with disaffected Republicans.
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
2
0
Originally posted by: Atreus21
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: Atreus21
It's pretty sad that religion is so villified.
They have nobody but themselves to blame.
They should blame themselves for what? Every misstep of humanity laid at their feet?
I just know you're going to go with the "no true Irishman" defense if i tell you about all the wrongdoings of Christians, Muslims, Hindus and Buddhists so i will refrain.

There was a good protestant living in Holland who kept his daughter and his kids he had with his daughter locked up for 24 years, now your immediate response to this will of course be "he was no good protestant".

Now we could develop this through a series of posts where you would claim that they were not really good Christians but let's leave it with the fact that the "no true Irishman" approach is all you got in defense and that is a logical fallacy.

I have to leave now, feel free to have at it while i'm gone.
 

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