Norwegian Progress Party Calls Attacks Cowardly and Horrible

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Aug 14, 2001
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I just feel the need to point out that (99.9999% of) conservatives in Scandinavia == liberals in America. I have said it before and I'll say it again, we're extremely moderate in Scandinavia

LOL - thanks for the joke. Conservative Europeans would basically be far right racist lunatics in the US, on the order of the KKK.

and as for the Ad, as Infohawk already pointed out it was meant to start a debate about the dispropotionate percantage of crimes being committed by immigrants and how integration have failed, it also doesn't single out muslims, do it? Eastern europeans are just as big a problem.

It's tough to integrate when large elements of the society is racist. That's the problem with European societies, they need to fundamentally change or else we will continue to see more violence from Europe. It's inevitable.

Hell, look at the case of Norway. People are going insane over such a small minority presence, it's so pathetic.
 
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senseamp

Lifer
Feb 5, 2006
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Sounds like they are trying to wash their hands of a terrorist action inspired by their political platform. No dice.
 

Carfax83

Diamond Member
Nov 1, 2010
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It's tough to integrate when large elements of the society is racist. That's the problem with European societies, they need to fundamentally change or else we will continue to see more violence from Europe. It's inevitable.

If large segments of European societies were as inherently racist as you believe, then there wouldn't be massive amounts of non native Europeans living in Europe.

No, the problem is far more complex than that I think. The problem in my estimation is two pronged; the monolithic cultural foundation of European countries (which makes it inherently difficult for immigrants to integrate), combined with the actual reluctance of the immigrants to integrate in to their new Society.

Having lived in Europe myself (and traveled through many European countries), it's not hard to see the stark differences when compared to America.

America is far more culturally dynamic, because our culture isn't bound to our ethnicity like it is in Europe. This makes assimilation for immigrants FAR easier to accomplish in America, as adversed to Europe.

American culture is so powerful, that it consumes/transforms any other culture that contends with it quite readily. In America, the children of immigrants are "turned" completely after one generation or two, and don't even speak the language of their parents and grand parents.

In Europe it's different. You have generations of immigrants that manage to avoid integration by living in closed neighborhoods which exist in parallel with the host Society. In these residential areas, the language and culture of the migrants endures and is not diminished or weakened over time with each passing generation, unlike in the U.S.
 
Aug 14, 2001
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If large segments of European societies were as inherently racist as you believe, then there wouldn't be massive amounts of non native Europeans living in Europe.

There really aren't massive amounts of non-native Europeans. Look at Norway - they're going insane over 3-4%! Just imagine how they would react if they were like the US or Canada, it would be deadly.

No, the problem is far more complex than that I think. The problem in my estimation is two pronged; the monolithic cultural foundation of European countries (which makes it inherently difficult for immigrants to integrate), combined with the actual reluctance of the immigrants to integrate in to their new Society.

Immigrants will integrate if the society isn't hostile to them. Unfortunately, Europe is going into the direction of further hostility.
 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
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If large segments of European societies were as inherently racist as you believe, then there wouldn't be massive amounts of non native Europeans living in Europe.

In case you want to save some time, you're being trolled by a rabid Euro-hater. You're talking to someone who will start calling you a bigot if you don't agree with him that Winston Churchill was a genocidal maniac. (True story.)
 

LumbergTech

Diamond Member
Sep 15, 2005
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damage control....when those we don't identify with at all are spewing hate speech or in this case murdering people...then its irresponsible or terrorism but when its just a normal white dude then its just a random lunatic..we get it
 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
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damage control....when those we don't identify with at all are spewing hate speech or in this case murdering people...then its irresponsible or terrorism but when its just a normal white dude then its just a random lunatic..we get it

OK so you've poked a hole in projo's worldview (*golf clap*) but are you yourself consistent? When opinion polls show much of the Muslim world supports violence against civilians (aka terrorism) do you make excuses for them? Or is it only the right-wing that is to blame when their members go nuts?

(And I'm fairly sure you didn't read any of this thread.)
 
Aug 14, 2001
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damage control....when those we don't identify with at all are spewing hate speech or in this case murdering people...then its irresponsible or terrorism but when its just a normal white dude then its just a random lunatic..we get it

Yup, pretty much. The white supremacists here like InfoHawk/Baasha will do anything to excuse violence based off their far right racist ideology.

InfoHawk/Baasha types will never be satisfied until Europe performs a total genocide of all minorities so that they can have a 'white homeland' to worship.
 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
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This thread is dumb and the 'statement' is self serving.


What about you? You made that pathetic thread patting the backs of the norwegian rigthwing anti-immigration/anti-muslim political party for condemning the attacks. Are you fucking crazy? It's almost like they were being self serving and wanted to protect themselves from criticism/preserve their political power. Do they really deserve a cookie for that?
 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
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This thread is dumb and the 'statement' is self serving.

Honestly, you're not really worthy of a discussion. You're hysterical. I'll just point out one of many flaws in your post. This party is not in power so there's nothing to preserve.

A lot of people are projecting American politics into this. In Europe they frequently have proportional voting systems where fringe parties with unpopular views can get seats in parliament. It's not like the US where everyone says bland things so they can get the middle of the electorate. So a European politician can say an industry should be nationalized or that minorities are bad for their country if they want to.
 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
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Honestly, you're not really worthy of a discussion. You're hysterical. I'll just point out one of many flaws in your post. This party is not in power so there's nothing to preserve.

A lot of people are projecting American politics into this. In Europe they frequently have proportional voting systems where fringe parties with unpopular views can get seats in parliament. It's not like the US where everyone says bland things so they can get the middle of the electorate. So a European politician can say an industry should be nationalized or that minorities are bad for their country if they want to.

Who gives a shit if they're not in power? They WANT to be in power and there's a lot of racist/xenophobic Europeans that give them political support. If they remained silent or publicly made excuses, they'd lose support. Giving them a cookie over something like this is dumb and congratulating a xenophobic/racist organization is equally dumb.
 

CanOWorms

Lifer
Jul 3, 2001
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In Europe they frequently have proportional voting systems where fringe parties with unpopular views can get seats in parliament. It's not like the US where everyone says bland things so they can get the middle of the electorate. So a European politician can say an industry should be nationalized or that minorities are bad for their country if they want to.

Sigh, another Infohawk excuse. These "fringe parties" are mainstream now, and their views are now popular.
 

LumbergTech

Diamond Member
Sep 15, 2005
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OK so you've poked a hole in projo's worldview (*golf clap*) but are you yourself consistent? When opinion polls show much of the Muslim world supports violence against civilians (aka terrorism) do you make excuses for them? Or is it only the right-wing that is to blame when their members go nuts?

(And I'm fairly sure you didn't read any of this thread.)

Why do you feel the need to try to damage control for a terrorist? I am not trolling you. I am being 100% serious....Whats wrong is wrong. I don't understand why you would try to water this down. This is just further evidence that ideologies in general that support bigotry and hatred should not be supported by peace loving people. I also don't get your rabid defense of the right wing. You try to come off as somewhat balanced and yet this upset you greatly. If the same thing happened in the muslim world would you have made a thread to defend all muslims and say that those who do not condone violence should not be punished for those who do?
 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
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They WANT to be in power and there's a lot of racist/xenophobic Europeans that give them political support. If they remained silent or publicly made excuses, they'd lose support.

Your post isn't even internally consistent. If there are a lot of European racists to give them support then it would benefit them to blame this on immigrants or somehow try to make excuses that the racists would appreciate. Go debate this issue with Projo although I should stop comparing you too as he is much more polite than you are.
 

senseamp

Lifer
Feb 5, 2006
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I love how the same rightwingers who say that we shold profile Muslims because some Muslims have committed acts of terror are the first to be offended when right wing extremists are profiled for same reason
 
Aug 14, 2001
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I love how the same rightwingers who say that we shold profile Muslims because some Muslims have committed acts of terror are the first to be offended when right wing extremists are profiled for same reason

Yes, it's very strange, especially in the US where far right violence is very common compared to far left violence. I'd be more scared of another OKC or a rampage from a white supremacist like InfoHawk/Baasha than a bunch of hippies tying themselves to some trees.
 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
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Why do you feel the need to try to damage control for a terrorist? I am not trolling you. I am being 100% serious....Whats wrong is wrong. I don't understand why you would try to water this down. This is just further evidence that ideologies in general that support bigotry and hatred should not be supported by peace loving people. I also don't get your rabid defense of the right wing. You try to come off as somewhat balanced and yet this upset you greatly. If the same thing happened in the muslim world would you have made a thread to defend all muslims and say that those who do not condone violence should not be punished for those who do?

I am not doing damage control for a terrorist. Are you saying this party that he was once a member of are all terrorists?

I think you'd understand my motivation if you had read my responses to woolfe in this thread. For example he basically asked the same question you did at the end of your post and I already addressed it. Look I get it, you don't want to read the whole thread you just want to get your opinions out there more than anything else.
 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
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I love how the same rightwingers who say that we shold profile Muslims because some Muslims have committed acts of terror are the first to be offended when right wing extremists are profiled for same reason

This doesn't really have anything to do with this thread... Why don't you just name the right wingers you're thinking of so they can respond to you if they want to?
 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
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Your post isn't even internally consistent. If there are a lot of European racists to give them support then it would benefit them to blame this on immigrants or somehow try to make excuses that the racists would appreciate. Go debate this issue with Projo although I should stop comparing you too as he is much more polite than you are.

You're stupid:

1) It'd be kind of hard to blame this on immigrants when the terrorist happened to be a blonde ethnic norwegian.

2) It'd be hard to grow your political base with this attack so they HAVE to nip this in the butt ASAP.
 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
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Why would you want to discuss something with someone who's stupid? (I think you're unworthy which is why I'm trying to get end this discussion. I'll let you get the last word.)

Says the guy giving a cookie to bigots.