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North Carolina Court panel unanimously throws out GOP gerrymandered legislative district maps

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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
70,177
18,977
136
Those were totally different issues.
The legal reasoning was not. For the VRA it was ‘Congress will not act so we must replace the judgment of Congress with our own’. For DOMA it was ‘we have no power to replace the judgment of Congress’.
 

dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
13,763
1,920
126
so far the GOP has said that while they disgree with the decision, they will not appeal it as the state supreme court has a democrat majority and will not reverse this.
Republicans got greedy making their partisan shenanigans too obvious before they were able to pack the courts.
 

snoopy7548

Diamond Member
Jan 1, 2005
5,955
2,833
136
I don't think you have to. The whole reason Republicans gerrymander in the first place is because they know they'll likely lose in a fair election. Institute fair districting and you "beat the crap out of them" while also giving them less fodder for future election rigging efforts.
I agree. At first it's tempting to say, "let the Democrats gerrymander to their heart's content." But it's wiser to let them beat the Republicans fairly. It would be a double slap in the face while giving the GOP absolutely nothing (though they'll surely find something) to whine about.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,138
13,081
136
The legal reasoning was not. For the VRA it was ‘Congress will not act so we must replace the judgment of Congress with our own’. For DOMA it was ‘we have no power to replace the judgment of Congress’.
Which has nothing to do with their ruling concerning gerrymandering. They feigned helplessness & left it up to the states. So when state courts strike down gerrymandering they're helpless in that regard as well.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
70,177
18,977
136
Which has nothing to do with their ruling concerning gerrymandering. They feigned helplessness & left it up to the states. So when state courts strike down gerrymandering they're helpless in that regard as well.
I don't understand what this has to do with my post. What I was saying was that DOMA and the VRA were great examples of SCOTUS conservatives taking mutually exclusive legal positions when convenient. This relates to gerrymandering in that I wouldn't be surprised to see them suddenly decide they aren't so helpless after all if it means an ideologically favorable result.
 

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
26,067
6,050
136
I agree. At first it's tempting to say, "let the Democrats gerrymander to their heart's content." But it's wiser to let them beat the Republicans fairly. It would be a double slap in the face while giving the GOP absolutely nothing (though they'll surely find something) to whine about.
Yeah, they'll just claim the Democrats gerrymandered the districts anyway.
 
Feb 4, 2009
27,924
8,392
136
I agree. At first it's tempting to say, "let the Democrats gerrymander to their heart's content." But it's wiser to let them beat the Republicans fairly. It would be a double slap in the face while giving the GOP absolutely nothing (though they'll surely find something) to whine about.
Yeah, they'll just claim the Democrats gerrymandered the districts anyway.
EXACTLY!

I think like a deplorable that is the next step.
I’ll say it again. The deplorable’s are playing a different game with different rules. We need to accept that and adapt.
 
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SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
13,032
2,588
126
Yeah, they'll just claim the Democrats gerrymandered the districts anyway.
The difference is that if the Democrats gerrymander their way to victory they set up the same situation with whatever party that eventually replaces the GOP when they die. Someone has to be the first to stop the madness. If they can win without stacking the deck they should.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
70,177
18,977
136
Yeah, they'll just claim the Democrats gerrymandered the districts anyway.
I mean we've had people on here say many times that California's decision to have a primary where the two people who get the most votes go to the general election, regardless of party, as some sort of crypto gerrymander where Democrats are evilly suppressing Republicans. In their mind any system where a Republican doesn't go to the general election even if nobody voted for them is unfair.
 

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
26,067
6,050
136
The difference is that if the Democrats gerrymander their way to victory they set up the same situation with whatever party that eventually replaces the GOP when they die. Someone has to be the first to stop the madness. If they can win without stacking the deck they should.
EXACTLY!

I think like a deplorable that is the next step.
I’ll say it again. The deplorable’s are playing a different game with different rules. We need to accept that and adapt.
To be clear, I am not suggesting we gerrymander, simply because we don't need it if the districts are drawn fairly. I'm just not under any illusions that if we aren't cheating, that the opposition won't claim we are cheating anyway.

But if we did need it, I might consider going scorched earth.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,138
13,081
136
I don't understand what this has to do with my post. What I was saying was that DOMA and the VRA were great examples of SCOTUS conservatives taking mutually exclusive legal positions when convenient. This relates to gerrymandering in that I wouldn't be surprised to see them suddenly decide they aren't so helpless after all if it means an ideologically favorable result.
The court's conservative majority already bent over backwards to rule that gerrymandering is a states' rights issue. They won't touch a gerrymandering case with a 10 foot pole.
 

UNCjigga

Lifer
Dec 12, 2000
22,532
4,701
136
The court's conservative majority already bent over backwards to rule that gerrymandering is a states' rights issue. They won't touch a gerrymandering case with a 10 foot pole.
Pretty sure state GOP understands this, as they’ve opted not to appeal. NC gerrymandered districts are all but toast.

I’d totally expect the state GOP to bitch about any proposed new district maps and try to drag that out beyond 2020, but I don’t think that’s going to work either. They already had some Stanford professor out here to draw neutral maps...a “special master” if you will.

edit: oops, just realized that this is for the state legislative districts (i.e. state house & senate) and does not change our Congressional districts, which are still gerrymandered to elect 10 Republican reps for 13 seats. SCOTUS dropped the ball on that case back in June. Doesn't help us in DC, but does help ensure we never have a GOP super-majority in the state house ever again.
 
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Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,138
13,081
136
Pretty sure state GOP understands this, as they’ve opted not to appeal. NC gerrymandered districts are all but toast.

I’d totally expect the state GOP to bitch about any proposed new district maps and try to drag that out beyond 2020, but I don’t think that’s going to work either. They already had some Stanford professor out here to draw neutral maps...a “special master” if you will.

edit: oops, just realized that this is for the state legislative districts (i.e. state house & senate) and does not change our Congressional districts, which are still gerrymandered to elect 10 Republican reps for 13 seats. SCOTUS dropped the ball on that case back in June. Doesn't help us in DC, but does help ensure we never have a GOP super-majority in the state house ever again.
Win the state house in 2020 & draw honest redistricting maps for 2022.
 

UNCjigga

Lifer
Dec 12, 2000
22,532
4,701
136
LOL, could these people be any more pathetic??



BUSTED: NC GOP senator announces retirement after getting caught on video gerrymandering his district

North Carolina Republican state Sen. John Alexander has announced that he will not seek re-election after he was caught trying to gerrymander his own district.

Alexander made the announcement on Thursday after he was seen on video Wednesday making changes that would have made his district a safe Republican seat while representing many Democrats in the Raleigh area.
 
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Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
14,374
7,164
146
LOL, could these people be any more pathetic??



BUSTED: NC GOP senator announces retirement after getting caught on video gerrymandering his district

North Carolina Republican state Sen. John Alexander has announced that he will not seek re-election after he was caught trying to gerrymander his own district.

Alexander made the announcement on Thursday after he was seen on video Wednesday making changes that would have made his district a safe Republican seat while representing many Democrats in the Raleigh area.
So if Republicans have to compete fairly they quit?
 
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Feb 4, 2009
27,924
8,392
136
LOL, could these people be any more pathetic??



BUSTED: NC GOP senator announces retirement after getting caught on video gerrymandering his district

North Carolina Republican state Sen. John Alexander has announced that he will not seek re-election after he was caught trying to gerrymander his own district.

Alexander made the announcement on Thursday after he was seen on video Wednesday making changes that would have made his district a safe Republican seat while representing many Democrats in the Raleigh area.
He should have used a sharpie then it would have been cool
 
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dawp

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
10,313
1,528
126
LOL, could these people be any more pathetic??



BUSTED: NC GOP senator announces retirement after getting caught on video gerrymandering his district

North Carolina Republican state Sen. John Alexander has announced that he will not seek re-election after he was caught trying to gerrymander his own district.

Alexander made the announcement on Thursday after he was seen on video Wednesday making changes that would have made his district a safe Republican seat while representing many Democrats in the Raleigh area.
that was delicious and the icing on the cake was when he saw it wouldn't fly he decided not to run because he would likely lose in a fair race.
 
Mar 11, 2004
20,549
2,671
126
LOL, could these people be any more pathetic??



BUSTED: NC GOP senator announces retirement after getting caught on video gerrymandering his district

North Carolina Republican state Sen. John Alexander has announced that he will not seek re-election after he was caught trying to gerrymander his own district.

Alexander made the announcement on Thursday after he was seen on video Wednesday making changes that would have made his district a safe Republican seat while representing many Democrats in the Raleigh area.
Just wait til we get Turmp's districts drawn up with sharpie. "As you can see the Alabama map says Turmp is #1 best leader!"

So if Republicans have to compete fairly they quit?
Sure seems that way.
 

esquared

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 8, 2000
21,162
2,928
136
the courts strike again, dealing another blow to republicans in NC saying they can not use their map due to the partisan gerrymander.

How about this one.

"State Rep. David Lewis (R), one of the chairs of the redistricting committee, said he wanted to draw a map with that 10-3 advantage because he did not think it was possible to draw one that gave Republicans an 11-2 advantage."

Seriously. WTF?
 

dawp

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
10,313
1,528
126
How about this one.

"State Rep. David Lewis (R), one of the chairs of the redistricting committee, said he wanted to draw a map with that 10-3 advantage because he did not think it was possible to draw one that gave Republicans an 11-2 advantage."

Seriously. WTF?
that is one of the more shocking/non-shocking statements listed in the article.
 

tweaker2

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
11,515
2,726
136
How about this one.

"State Rep. David Lewis (R), one of the chairs of the redistricting committee, said he wanted to draw a map with that 10-3 advantage because he did not think it was possible to draw one that gave Republicans an 11-2 advantage."

Seriously. WTF?

It's just how things are done and have been done to the point where it's the norm. It's OK with them because that attitude has been institutionalized and it's been institutionalized throughout the south. It's a safe place to be even though it defies all sense of fair play, ethics and morals.

This is their version of "fair play" where they get to win every time no matter how things change outside of the insulative bubble they've managed to hide in for so long.

What's so ironic about all of that is the fact that the very democratic processes that's supposed to prevent what they're doing is actually allowing them to do it.
 

MtnMan

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2004
4,329
2,297
136
I don’t want dems to stack it. The districts should be drawn so people have representation.
We haven't had representation in a long time. They are bought and paid for by out of state interests, or will be very quickly for anyone elected for the first time.
 

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