NON_POLITICAL China Coronavirus THREAD

[Muse]

Isn't it kinda early to know if there are long term effects from Omicron? It's only been around for, what, 2-3 months?
Hopefully with the seemingly milder symptoms it won't cause any long term effects.

Dr. John Campbell said in video the other day the fact that it typically does not invade lung tissue but concentrates in mucosa membrane tissue means it has much much less access to your bloodstream and therefore your various organs than previous strains. This would seem to make long term covid much less likely, is my takeaway.

 

[nakedfrog]

On first (superficial) reading that guy makes some reasonable points. Though I'd want to check the things he says - for example, did Trudeau (someone I don't like, anyway) really say "the unvaccinated" belong in the same category as misogynists and racists? Would make more sense to put anti-vaccine activists in that category, and that's not the same thing.

Well, it was in French, but this is what I could find about what he said. Seems pretty likely he's talking about anti-vaxxers, not simply "the unvaccinated"

“We all know people who are deciding whether or not they are willing to get vaccinated, and we will do our very best to try to convince them. However, there is still a part of the population (that) is fiercely against it.
“We are going to end this pandemic by proceeding with the vaccination,” said Trudeau, speaking French.
“They don’t believe in science/progress and are very often misogynistic and racist. It’s a very small group of people, but that doesn’t shy away from the fact that they take up some space.
“This leads us, as a leader and as a country, to make a choice: Do we tolerate these people? Over 80% of the population of Quebec have done their duty by getting the shot. They are obviously not the issue in this situation.”

 

[Muse]

No. That should be a choice 100%. But we also should not stop the world for the unvaccinated. If they choose to not get it, and put themselves at risk then they took that chance. Those who are quadruple vaxxed and triple masked and still scared of the unvax are free to take precautions themselves but vax or unvax everyone should be allowed everywhere, to have a job etc... In fact we need stronger laws for medical privacy. It should be illegal for any organization to ask for vax status for anything. Get rid of the social credit/vax passport system too.

You are woefully unaware of the world of epidemiology and your views on pandemic dos, don't, requirements, mandates, etc. are completely worthless. Stop promulgating your claptrap.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Never really paid much attention to the death numbers in my area as they were not really reported much but looks like we're at 36 deaths in my health unit region so far since the start. Higher than I would have thought tbh. Not sure if these are "of" or "with" covid though. In comparison there was 37 opioid related deaths in 2020 alone. (no data for 2021 or 2022).

Now 36 COVID-19 deaths for PHU - My Timmins Now

Here’s more proof that COVID-19 can be fatal, or at least a contributing factor in a patient’s death. The Porcupine Health Unit is reporting its 36th death since the beginning […]

www.mytimminsnow.com

Porcupine Health Unit - Opioid Surveillance

www.porcupinehu.on.ca

 

[biostud]

I don't know if I'd take that as a definitive turning point - countries have repeatedly scrapped restrictions then bought them back in again (then, sometimes, scrapped them again, repeatedly). The Netherlands had to bring restrictions back, so did Boris's government a few months ago (now they are removing them again).

Certainly does seem that omicron is not as deadly as previous variants, but, at least globally, deaths-per-day have been steadily increasing recently, back to where it was a few months ago, as the greater numbers of infections seems to be making up for the reduction in deadliness.

I don't really know what to make of it now.

Sure if some new mutation show up. But we've had the most infected by far, the last few weeks and the fewest placed on intensive care throughout this pandemic. So it seems they're going for flock immunity now.

 

[Spacehead]

I guess it also has something to do with how many are on intensive care. ATM there are more than 50k new incidents/day pr day, the highest ever in Denmark ~6m pop, but those on intensive care remains very low, and many are long term delta patients. Currently only 33 on intensive care and 22 on respiratory help.

As far as the ICU & ventilator numbers, in my county alone we have about a third of what you entire country has, just for this month. Population is somewhere in the 80K-85K area.

Never really paid much attention to the death numbers in my area as they were not really reported much but looks like we're at 36 deaths in my health unit region so far since the start.

Last i heard we have 10 dead just this month for the county.

For the county, about 48% vaccinated(2 doses) & around 22% boosted.
Just goes to show different areas, regions, states & countries need to have different policies for each, depending on the current situation.

 

[pmv]

Dr. John Campbell said in video the other day the fact that it typically does not invade lung tissue but concentrates in mucosa membrane tissue means it has much much less access to your bloodstream and therefore your various organs than previous strains. This would seem to make long term covid much less likely, is my takeaway.

I've been a bit puzzled by some of the things he's said recently. Up till now he's always seeemed a largely sensible and credible source, but some of his recent commentary has seemed a bit odd to me.

For example, his half-hearted bit of 'damage control' on behalf of ivermectin. Couldn't make out what he was trying to say there, e.g. making a big deal out of the fact the lead-author of the meta-study that found weaknesses in the alleged positive studies was 'only a student'. Or his choice to highlight a negative report on flaws in Pfizer's vaccine testing process (which, to be fair, was published in the BMJ, so a reputable source...but from what I could see as a 'letter' not a peer-reviewed paper). Not sure where he was going with all that.

 

[gill77]

 

[echo4747]

was unable to watch the video ( hopefully get the chance later today) Is there any mention whether or not the vaccine being currently developed for Omicron BA.1 will likely be effective for BA.2.? If not its not likely ... I wonder if its a waste of effort. Since it appears that that covid is mutating faster than you can produce targeted vaccines.. It might be like a dog chasing its tail. Anyway, at least Science says subsequent mutations are more likely to be less virulent than more virulent

 

[Muse]

I've been a bit puzzled by some of the things he's said recently. Up till now he's always seeemed a largely sensible and credible source, but some of his recent commentary has seemed a bit odd to me.

For example, his half-hearted bit of 'damage control' on behalf of ivermectin. Couldn't make out what he was trying to say there, e.g. making a big deal out of the fact the lead-author of the meta-study that found weaknesses in the alleged positive studies was 'only a student'. Or his choice to highlight a negative report on flaws in Pfizer's vaccine testing process (which, to be fair, was published in the BMJ, so a reputable source...but from what I could see as a 'letter' not a peer-reviewed paper). Not sure where he was going with all that.

I haven't watched much of his stuff, just a few, but the one I watched in entirety about a week ago (over 20 minutes) impressed me a lot. He got into details, didn't dumb down his reasonings. Of course, he doesn't belabor his points, so you do need to read between the lines some but I don't recall having doubts about his sanity. He does these a lot, so it's a lot to ask that he be spot on daily, I figure. I'm guessing he's retired from practice and devotes himself largely to following the pandemic and producing these videos.

 

[gill77]

was unable to watch the video ( hopefully get the chance later today) Is there any mention whether or not the vaccine being currently developed for Omicron BA.1 will likely be effective for BA.2.? If not its not likely ... I wonder if its a waste of effort. Since it appears that that covid is mutating faster than you can produce targeted vaccines.. It might be like a dog chasing its tail. Anyway, at least Science says subsequent mutations are more likely to be less virulent than more virulent

No mention. BA.2 will likely further reduce what was expected to be a relatively short wave.

They would almost have to be ready to start jabbing now to realize any benefit.

We may have no choice other than to cross the bridge when we get to it. What will this next batch have to offer against whatever variant is present.

Best of luck.

 

[pmv]

I haven't watched much of his stuff, just a few, but the one I watched in entirety about a week ago (over 20 minutes) impressed me a lot. He got into details, didn't dumb down his reasonings. Of course, he doesn't belabor his points, so you do need to read between the lines some but I don't recall having doubts about his sanity. He does these a lot, so it's a lot to ask that he be spot on daily, I figure. I'm guessing he's retired from practice and devotes himself largely to following the pandemic and producing these videos.

Yeah, I do agree with regard to his earlier videos (he's been doing them for most of the pandemic, and I watched a good few of them and had no issue with them) but I feel like something has changed recently. Feels like he's started minimising the pandemic in a way he didn't before. For example, as well as the one talking about the criticism of the Pfizer vaccine trials and the one "debunking the debunking" of ivermectin, he did one emphasising the relatively small number of people who had COVID listed as the sole cause of death on the death certificate - which is something COVID skeptics have been going on about since the start, as if it matters much. That video of his led directly to this story:

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/ons-debunks-spurious-covid-deaths-132200462.html

It's as if he hasn't gone full COVID denailist or anything so outright irrational, but he seems to have started emphasising things that, while within the bounds of sustainable rational argument, subtly point a bit more towards the anti-lockdown/COVID is over-stated crowd.

He's also, I note, done a bunch on vaccine side-effects, but I actually haven't watched those because I worry they might stress me out (either because I'll find them to be anti-vaxx and so get me worked up politically, or, even, that they might trigger my own hypochondriacal tendencies and get me worrying about my own vaccinations!), so I don't know if he's started emphasising the downsides of vaccines now or if he's in fact being totally straight and impartial in those.


Edit - I mean, I really don't know, just those last few videos of his I saw seemed to be coming from a slightly-different stance to all his earlier ones. Maybe he's genuinely just shifted his views as the situation has changed, and is now more of a 'we have to get back to normal and live with COVID' point-of-view.

 

[gill77]

Yeah, I do agree with regard to his earlier videos (he's been doing them for most of the pandemic, and I watched a good few of them and had no issue with them) but I feel like something has changed recently. Feels like he's started minimising the pandemic in a way he didn't before. For example, as well as the one talking about the criticism of the Pfizer vaccine trials and the one "debunking the debunking" of ivermectin, he did one emphasising the relatively small number of people who had COVID listed as the sole cause of death on the death certificate - which is something COVID skeptics have been going on about since the start, as if it matters much. That video of his led directly to this story:

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/ons-debunks-spurious-covid-deaths-132200462.html

It's as if he hasn't gone full COVID denailist or anything so outright irrational, but he seems to have started emphasising things that, while within the bounds of sustainable rational argument, subtly point a bit more towards the anti-lockdown/COVID is over-stated crowd.

He's also, I note, done a bunch on vaccine side-effects, but I actually haven't watched those because I worry they might stress me out (either because I'll find them to be anti-vaxx and so get me worked up politically, or, even, that they might trigger my own hypochondriacal tendencies and get me worrying about my own vaccinations!), so I don't know if he's started emphasising the downsides of vaccines now or if he's in fact being totally straight and impartial in those.


Edit - I mean, I really don't know, just those last few videos of his I saw seemed to be coming from a slightly-different stance to all his earlier ones. Maybe he's genuinely just shifted his views as the situation has changed, and is now more of a 'we have to get back to normal and live with COVID' point-of-view.

Thanks for posting this. I learned a good bit. You and I acquire information very differently.

I think it may result from triggering or lack thereof.

Probably only one significant trigger for me, usually non-consequential to the information quest.

 

[pmv]

Like, I'm not sure where is he coming from with this

or this

Neither seems to say anything false or crazy, but I do wonder why is he now focussing on these stories?

 

[gill77]

Like, I'm not sure where is he coming from with this

Neither seems to say anything false or crazy, but I do wonder why is he now focussing on these stories?

If you self censor the information you see, then you see this, you wonder why he is pulling it out of nowhere and focussing on it.

If you have been consistantly casting a wide net, you see it and wonder why old Doc Campbell took so long to address this.

Usually a welcomed voice of sanity brought to a highly controversial topic.

 

[K1052]

How about a little good news for a change courtesy Boston wastewater sampling:

 

[pmv]

Thanks for posting this. I learned a good bit. You and I acquire information very differently.

I think it may result from triggering or lack thereof.

Probably only one significant trigger for me, usually non-consequential to the information quest.

Don't really know what that means, but generally I associated the use of the term "triggering" with conspiratorial right-wing types (ditto anyone who talks about "mainstream media"). Until recently the only time I'd encountered the term was with people I knew with PTSD. Then it suddenly became another of those favoured buzzwords of the right.

Actually one of the things that bugged me about that doc's recent videos was that in one of them he actually used the term "mainstream media". That's a very suspect term to me. It's usually a marker of Trumpery, or those influenced by it. It seemed rather out-of-place, given what I've seen of his previous stuff seemed entirely sensible.

 

[pmv]

If you self censor the information you see, then you see this, you wonder why he is pulling it out of nowhere and focussing on it.

If you have been consistantly casting a wide net, you see it and wonder why old Doc Campbell took so long to address this.

Usually a welcomed voice of sanity brought to a highly controversial topic.

Don't really need to "self-censor", in fact it's not really possible, when the media is overwhelmingly right-wing and consistently pushes a right-wing agenda. On the contrary you have to work at finding any other perspective.

 

[echo4747]

Only speaking for myself: My view on covid ( Omicron variant only) has recently changed.. It is primarily because I and the rest of my household recently had it. It was like having a short and mild common cold. I have heard the same story from many close friends, co-workers, and customers. I will admit I was somewhat fearful of contracting covid . Once I got my positive result I was waiting and worrying about experiencing shortness of breath. It never happened . If I never tested positive I am sure I would still be very worried and somewhat fearful of contracting it.

 

[K1052]

Only speaking for myself: My view on covid ( Omicron variant only) has recently changed.. It is primarily because I and the rest of my household recently had it. It was like having a short and mild common cold. I have heard the same story from many close friends, co-workers, and customers. I will admit I was somewhat fearful of contracting covid . Once I got my positive result I was waiting and worrying about experiencing shortness of breath. It never happened . If I never tested positive I am sure I would still be very worried and somewhat fearful of contracting it.

The people I've known who got it range from asymptomatic to a nasty bout with the flu, though they are all three times vaccinated. I'm sort of surprised that I haven't gotten it yet but maybe I did and was asymptomatic because I've still been traveling, going out to eat, going to the gym, going to stores, etc so surely I've been encountering it.

 

[echo4747]

The people I've known who got it range from asymptomatic to a nasty bout with the flu, though they are all three times vaccinated. I'm sort of surprised that I haven't gotten it yet but maybe I did and was asymptomatic because I've still been traveling, going out to eat, going to the gym, going to stores, etc so surely I've been encountering it.

Technically I was vaccinated JNJ on 3/31/21 tested positive on Jan 2 or 3rd 2022. I didnt go anywhere in that time period except work,home,gas station. Not sure how I even got it .. Wife went grocery shopping about 5-6 days before i got symptoms and my eight grade son had 5/17 kids in his class out when we called the school nurse to notify her he would be absent; however, my son was the last to any symptoms in our household

 

[biostud]

Only speaking for myself: My view on covid ( Omicron variant only) has recently changed.. It is primarily because I and the rest of my household recently had it. It was like having a short and mild common cold. I have heard the same story from many close friends, co-workers, and customers. I will admit I was somewhat fearful of contracting covid . Once I got my positive result I was waiting and worrying about experiencing shortness of breath. It never happened . If I never tested positive I am sure I would still be very worried and somewhat fearful of contracting it.

Same here, except I was never really worried about getting covid. I've never been so fresh and had to stay home in isolation. My wife had some days with muscle pains and tiredness, and our three children had virtually no symptoms, except for the middle one having a mild fever for a day.

 

[dullard]

Only speaking for myself: My view on covid ( Omicron variant only) has recently changed.. It is primarily because I and the rest of my household recently had it. It was like having a short and mild common cold. I have heard the same story from many close friends, co-workers, and customers. I will admit I was somewhat fearful of contracting covid . Once I got my positive result I was waiting and worrying about experiencing shortness of breath. It never happened . If I never tested positive I am sure I would still be very worried and somewhat fearful of contracting it.

Your experience is pretty normal and thankfully mild. Omicron does have symptoms like a cold. Omicron is an upper respiratory tract infection, as is a common cold. Omicron does not have shortness of breath as a symptom. Shortness of breath only happens with the original variants of Covid which are lower respiratory tract infections.

 

[dullard]

Same here, except I was never really worried about getting covid. I've never been so fresh and had to stay home in isolation. My wife had some days with muscle pains and tiredness, and our three children had virtually no symptoms, except for the middle one having a mild fever for a day.

I don't personally think that I'll have problems directly from Covid. My personal worries are:

1) Transmitting it to people that I am close with that would likely have problems directly from Covid. It started with my father-in-law that had stage IV lung cancer. Giving him a lower respiratory tract infection on top of his already limited lung capacity was very likely going to outright kill him.

2) What are the long-term consequences of Covid? No one really knows. Hopefully it is nothing. But we just don't know and will not know for decades. HPV can lead to cancer years later. HIV can lead to AIDS about 1 decade later. Chickenpox can lead to Shingles many decades later. But many other diseases are basically over once you are done with them.

 

[nakedfrog]

I don't personally think that I'll have problems directly from Covid. My personal worries are:

1) Transmitting it to people that I am close with that would likely have problems directly from Covid. It started with my father-in-law that had stage IV lung cancer. Giving him a lower respiratory tract infection on top of his already limited lung capacity was very likely going to outright kill him.

2) What are the long-term consequences of Covid? No one really knows. Hopefully it is nothing. But we just don't know and will not know for decades. HPV can lead to cancer years later. HIV can lead to AIDS about 1 decade later. Chickenpox can lead to Shingles many decades later. But many other diseases are basically over once you are done with them.

Yep, this. I'm very healthy and active and generally tolerate illness well, so I don't think it would be too bad for me... but I don't want to be a vector. Between that and the question of long-term unknowns, prudence seems best.