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NON_POLITICAL China Coronavirus THREAD

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gill77

Senior member
Aug 3, 2006
643
182
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Look like we (the world community) won't be able to figure out the original source of the virus.

China Rejects WHO Proposal for Second Phase of Covid-19 Origins Probe (msn.com)
Joe Rogan hosted a guy on his podcast who was a member of a WHO advisory board, not at all heterodox, someone who is part of the system. His take was that regardless of the origin of the virus, China's handling of the initial outbreak likely was responsible for about 90% of the total worldwide cases.

The striking part is that it draws so little attention, instead, for some reason, all our outrage seems to be directed towards one another. I imagine on some level folks feel better believing they can denigrate fellow citizens until some magical unattainable level of vaccination is realized.

All this while ignoring the fact that vaccination in the middle of a pandemic contributes to the number of breakthrough cases enabling variants to find a work around. Winning this battle is going to be far more difficult and nuanced than simply blaming one another.
 

pmv

Diamond Member
May 30, 2008
8,886
3,793
136
This isn't what one wants to hear



Does anyone know more about the subject, though? I thought I remembered reading that antibodies are not the whole story, that you can still have relevant t-cells even when antibodies decline? It's all too complicated for me, though.
 

Ajay

Diamond Member
Jan 8, 2001
9,402
3,899
136
This isn't what one wants to hear



Does anyone know more about the subject, though? I thought I remembered reading that antibodies are not the whole story, that you can still have relevant t-cells even when antibodies decline? It's all too complicated for me, though.
Hmm, I thought that there was more to or immune system's ability to attack a Covid infection than our serum antibody levels.
 

K1052

Lifer
Aug 21, 2003
37,485
12,001
136
This isn't what one wants to hear



Does anyone know more about the subject, though? I thought I remembered reading that antibodies are not the whole story, that you can still have relevant t-cells even when antibodies decline? It's all too complicated for me, though.
Antibody levels are expected to drop over time but the immune system remembers what the virus spike looks like and will, among other responses, pump them out again if it sees the virus. Unless a bunch of vaccinated people start showing up in the hospitals the vaccine is still working eve if it doesn't prevent quite as much symptomatic disease with this new variant. Some countries are considering boosters soonish for those who are especially vulnerable like the immunocompromised as a precaution, I think Israel has started.

Absent some major dangerous mutation that really puts a big dent in mRNA vaccine efficacy I'm not personally worried about boosting just yet. Though I know some people who got single dose J&J are boosting with an mRNA vaccine which probably isn't a bad idea. Similarly if you got Covid before now you should go get a single dose since the original infection works effectively as the prime shot.
 

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
31,383
4,041
126
I'm in New Jersey, and that place had plastic up on their booths, but nothing for the open tables. The staff had no masks, and neither did the customers.
A friend of mine tells me that his 43 year old cousin in New Jersey died of covid recently. Also that a lot of his family in New Jersey was sick with it. I bugged him until he got Moderna 2x vaccinated. He lives in a dumb ass rural county.
 
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Ajay

Diamond Member
Jan 8, 2001
9,402
3,899
136
Hmm, I was just checking for new cases per population at the JHU Covid tracker. Apparently, Florida isn't even providing data. <deep sigh>.
 

Captante

Lifer
Oct 20, 2003
19,539
2,933
126
This story doesn't surprise me:


Going to a restaurant to eat still isn't always a fun experience. The wait staff is still wearing face masks, and many of the restaurants are short staffed. Factor in a small chance and getting the Delta variant and a 15% price increase over last year, and I'd imagine that a lot of folks would just rather stay home and order a pizza.

Going to be quite awhile before I dine indoors @ a restaurant again unfortunately .... I have a bad feeling that things are going to get ugly again for awhile this fall/winter and I want no part of it.
 
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Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
31,383
4,041
126
This isn't what one wants to hear



Does anyone know more about the subject, though? I thought I remembered reading that antibodies are not the whole story, that you can still have relevant t-cells even when antibodies decline? It's all too complicated for me, though.
I think they're not sure but some experts think the mRNA vaccines (in particular) will not need boosters any time soon if ever. The immune system is more complex than just the antibodies in the blood stream. I think the answers will be in the data. They will be able to see how much the vaccinated public is protected going forward and recommendations for boosters will depend on that, is my take. I saw a story last night that the mRNA vaccines are showing greater efficacy than the J&J, which isn't bad, it's just not as good after ~6+ months. There's also the matter of world wide dissemination of vaccines. The whole world is a petri dish for variants right now.
 

Captante

Lifer
Oct 20, 2003
19,539
2,933
126
Hmm, I was just checking for new cases per population at the JHU Covid tracker. Apparently, Florida isn't even providing data. <deep sigh>.

DeSantis can't have that information getting out.... could put a damper on his aspirations for 2024. (god help us)
 

dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
23,028
1,289
126
Hmm, I was just checking for new cases per population at the JHU Covid tracker. Apparently, Florida isn't even providing data. <deep sigh>.
When I look, Florida is reporting cases weekly. That is confusing when trying to use that tracker because the JHU tracker doesn't compensate for this change in reporting.

I much prefer trackers that do weekly rolling averages. This is because some places have fewer tests on weekends (which falsely look like a decline in cases around Sunday/Monday), and then more tests early in the week (which falsely look like an increase in cases around Thursday/Friday). A tracker that does weekly smoothing evens all that artificial noise out. Here is a simple one as an example: https://graphics.reuters.com/HEALTH-CORONAVIRUS/USA-TRENDS/dgkvlgkrkpb/index.html Scroll down to "Weekly reported cases per 100,000 population" That figure is updated every Tuesday.
 
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K1052

Lifer
Aug 21, 2003
37,485
12,001
136
The drama is going to be epic this season.

"If a club cannot play due to a Covid spike in vaccinated individuals, we will attempt to minimize the competitive and economic burden on both participating teams."

How?
Some sort of proportionate cost sharing? They're all billionaires so I'm not really worried about them squabbling over the tab.
 
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Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
31,383
4,041
126
Going to be quite awhile before I dine indoors @ a restaurant again unfortunately .... I have a bad feeling that things are going to get ugly again for awhile this fall/winter and I want no part of it.
Yes, things are getting worse and might continue to. I was going to start going to the gym again but now think I should maybe wait at least until things start improving again. I was also going to go to a family celebration in a couple months 500 miles away, flying, but now think I may demur (RSVP invitation sits right next to me unanswered). Changes in my life since max vaccinated are that I skate without N95 on and shop every other week at Costco. Am not afraid to drop into an indoor environment for a few minutes but do wear an N95. Really, that's about it. I'm not kidding myself that things are OK now.
 
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Captante

Lifer
Oct 20, 2003
19,539
2,933
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Yes, things are getting worse and might continue to. I was going to start going to the gym again but now think I should maybe wait at least until things start improving again. I was also going to go to a family celebration in a couple months 500 miles away, flying, but now think I may demur (RSVP invitation sits right next to me unanswered). Changes in my life since max vaccinated are that I skate without N95 on and shop every other week at Costco. Am not afraid to drop into an indoor environment for a few minutes but do wear an N95. Really, that's about it.

500 miles = I would rather drive myself anyway ... and at this point I'd call it a no-brainer if you really want to go.

And while I'm good with passing through a supermarket while masked or say picking up take-out, even going to an outdoor sporting event ... I'm NOT okay with parking it in a restaurant for an hour or two.

Not sure what the people who have to hang out/work inside stores all day getting breathed on are thinking not masking up vaccine or not. Pretty freaking dumb.
 
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dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
23,028
1,289
126
I think they're not sure but some experts think the mRNA vaccines (in particular) will not need boosters any time soon if ever.
No expert will say that you will never need a booster. The longer this disease is circulating widely, the greater the chance of a mutation that the vaccines will not cover. If and when that happens, we will need boosters for these new strains.

You are correct that we have multiple layers of defense. Having one defensive layer be diminished in effectiveness over time (antibodies waning) does not mean that entire defense is gone. It just means that we have to rethink--again--all thoughts that we would have about the vaccine and it's effectiveness. One possible future scenario: we might reach a state where our antibodies wane enough that the vaccine doesn't prevent infection or spread, but still prevents most hospitalizations.
 

Roger Wilco

Golden Member
Mar 20, 2017
1,213
770
136
Some sort of proportionate cost sharing? They're all billionaires so I'm not really worried about them squabbling over the tab.
I'm speaking more about the drama from players not receiving expected pay because the other team had a breakthrough infection.

"If a game is cancelled and cannot be rescheduled within the current 18-week scheduled due to a Covid outbreak, neither team’s players will receive their weekly paragraph 5 salary."
 

Captante

Lifer
Oct 20, 2003
19,539
2,933
126
I'm speaking more about the drama from players not receiving expected pay because the other team had a breakthrough infection.

"If a game is cancelled and cannot be rescheduled within the current 18-week scheduled due to a Covid outbreak, neither team’s players will receive their weekly paragraph 5 salary."

Unlike MLB for example don't forget that the majority of "everyday" NFL players don't get much (if any) "guaranteed" money, so that "game-pay" in many cases is significant to them.
 

Muadib

Lifer
May 30, 2000
16,895
454
126
A friend of mine tells me that his 43 year old cousin in New Jersey died of covid recently. Also that a lot of his family in New Jersey was sick with it. I bugged him until he got Moderna 2x vaccinated. He lives in a dumb ass rural county.
Things were good until Delta showed up. Now too many think we are back to normal.
 
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njdevilsfan87

Platinum Member
Apr 19, 2007
2,168
157
106
I almost wish the country would just split into two. Because why do I want to keep it together? So I can keep paying taxes for these low IQ (insert my race here) trash bums to keep sucking up welfare, not got their free vaccines and then end up with huge medical bills that everyone else will end paying for? Meanwhile my small family is now back on lockdown until my son can get his vaccine. I'm just so... fed up with these people. I do not want to be together with them on anything anymore.
 
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