non-linear gas gauge

chorb

Golden Member
Oct 7, 2005
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My gas gauge seems to drop much faster the last 1/3 of the meter.

I get roughly ~250 miles per tank, with about 200 of those miles in the first 2/3rds then 50 in the last 1/3rd.

If my gas tank just oddly shaped that would cause this? It's not really a problem, just more of an annoyance.
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
Arc lengths of the float, position of the sensor, shape of the tank, all taken into account. Intentional higher resolution near empty maybe?
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
16,829
3
0
They design them that way so you think you're getting great gas mileage after you first fill up and the needle hardly moves. Notice how long it stays at the very top
 

vshah

Lifer
Sep 20, 2003
19,003
24
81
same for mine, although mine is a digital gauge. there are 13 "bars" that make up the scale, and I can go 150 miles on the first 3 or 4 bars. the rest of the tank only lasts an additional 250 miles or so. its a 13 gallon tank...i wish they'd just made it 1 bar per gallon
 

woodie1

Diamond Member
Mar 7, 2000
5,947
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As stated above, I think you'll find that many cars are like yours.
Mine does the same thing.
 

KentState

Diamond Member
Oct 19, 2001
8,397
393
126
I haven't figured out the one in my car since it has a split fuel tank and a float in each side. Supposedly, it drains the passenger's side first and then moves to the driver's side.
 

chorb

Golden Member
Oct 7, 2005
1,272
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Yep almost every car is like this.

This is my 3rd car, I don't remember the previous 2 doing it. Maybe I just notice it more now that my car drains gas faster than top fuel dragster (or at least it feels that way).
 

Gibson486

Lifer
Aug 9, 2000
18,378
2
0
gas gauges are stupid, snot smart. All they are designed to do is give you an idea of how much gas you have left.
 

Demon-Xanth

Lifer
Feb 15, 2000
20,551
2
81
Some gauges are more accurate than others, but there is always unreportable range on both ends due to areas that the float cannot measure at the top and bottom of the tanks.
 

Pulsar

Diamond Member
Mar 3, 2003
5,224
306
126
They design them that way so you think you're getting great gas mileage after you first fill up and the needle hardly moves. Notice how long it stays at the very top

For god's sake, half your posts are this uninformed.

Your gage remains at the top because generally speaking your filler neck is a couple inches in diameter and can hold an extra gallon or two. On larger vehicles, like trucks, it can hold up to 4 gallons extra depending on how it is routed. The float in the tank can only measure the tank itself. Therefore you may get an extra 10 - 20% at the top because of the filler neck. Thus the gas gage stays at the top for what can seem to be a decent amount of time.

In addition, most of the float systems don't reach the top of the tank. This is simply design constraints and has NOTHING to do with trying to 'fool' people.

I worked in the gas tank industry for quite a while, and throckmorton is full of crap.
 

angry hampster

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2007
4,232
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www.lexaphoto.com
My Jeep did that as well. I'd stick on full for about 75 miles, then be steady until the last 1/4 tank when it'd drop like mad.

My girlfriend's Grand Am stays steady until about 1/4 tank, when it shoots back up to 3/4 tank and is completely inaccurate until you're stuckon the side of the road. I hate that POS.
 

Zenmervolt

Elite member
Oct 22, 2000
24,514
44
91
Your gage remains at the top because generally speaking your filler neck is a couple inches in diameter and can hold an extra gallon or two. On larger vehicles, like trucks, it can hold up to 4 gallons extra depending on how it is routed. The float in the tank can only measure the tank itself. Therefore you may get an extra 10 - 20% at the top because of the filler neck. Thus the gas gage stays at the top for what can seem to be a decent amount of time.

In addition, most of the float systems don't reach the top of the tank. This is simply design constraints and has NOTHING to do with trying to 'fool' people.

While a lot of what you say makes sense, I sincerely doubt that the filler neck on the average sedan can hold, "a gallon or two". One gallon is 231 cubic inches. If the filler neck has a 2 inch inner diameter, it would have to be over 18 inches long to hold just one extra gallon. I'm struggling to imagine what sort of convoluted routing would result in a filler neck that was over 6 foot long and thus capable of storing those "extra 4 gallons" that you claim some trucks can manage.

In fact, measuring both my sedan and coupe gives a length of about 10 inches for the filler tube on each, with the rear tank of the F-150 having a filler length of about twice that. That means the cars have maybe an extra half-gallon and the truck an extra gallon if you fill until fuel is coming out the filler, which pretty much nobody ever does. Also, the F-150 filler tube pretty clearly isn't more than a 2" inner diameter and that's probably being generous. There just isn't any way that a system would hold 4 gallons of gasoline in the filler neck.

The fact is that most gauges are non-linear today. Gauges for things like temperature or oil pressure are often programmed to stay in the middle of the display range unless there is a large change. This maintains the usefulness of the gauge as a warning indicator but reduces the number of morons who come in and complain that their car runs 5 degrees hotter than their neighbor's and demand that it be fixed despite it being a non-issue. Sometimes, even the markings on a gauge make this nonlinearity clear.

For example on the current model of Toyota Camry (a car that I have driven extensively as a rental over about 9 months and probably 5,000 miles last year), there are 15 evenly-spaced markings between the Full and Empty marks. Seven markings between Full and half, and 7 between half and empty. However, there are only two marks between the full and 3/4 marking, and there are similarly only two markings between the 1/4 and empty marking. (See Photo.)

That gives increased resolution around the middle of the tank, which makes sense (and may even be a technological limitation as you mention), but it's clearly calibrated to be nonlinear. Recording mileage makes that quite clear.

In contrast, my 951 and my S70 both have linear fuel gauges. In fact, the Volvo's gauge, though analog is marked in terms of gallons remaining and won't reach "full" (18 gallons) unless I top off the tank to near-overflowing. Perhaps this is simply differing philosophies, but it doesn't seem to be difficult to get a float that goes all the way to the top of the tank and it's very clear that many gauges will read "Full" even when the tank is a gallon shy of published capacity.

ZV
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
Most people don't looke twice at their gas gauge when it's full or in the middle, but eyeball it all day when it's at 1/4 tank and under and they are being cheap and trying to stretch it to the last drop before stopping for gas.

Most gauges are probably designed to have lower resolution (very little movement for large amount of fuel) near the middle and full since most people don't care about those parts if that's where the needle is. Half? 3/4? Full? Who cares. Higher resolution and accuracy (larger needle swing for minimal amounts of gas) as the tank nears empty to prevent the average person from running out of gas, since that is when people try to ration and put it off.

Have half a tank? Big deal, you won't even look at your gauge again after for your whole 40 mile drive. At the 1/4 ot 1/8 mark? Probably going to be staring at it the whole drive watching it moving in noticeable increments towards the E in real time wondering if you'll make it or need to get gas on the way.

Would you rather your gauge linger around F too long then finally come down when it doesn't even matter to you? Or linger around the E without moving much all day, then suddenly you're out of gas when you least expect it? When you have 18 gallons, you don't care when it's 16 ot 17 gallons, but when you are down to 1 gallon, you sure do care when you have half a gallon and 1/4 gallon left as you start getting nervous and keeping an eye out for the next gas station. Full is full, doesn't matter how full, but you are certainly concerned about how empty. Hence higher resolution and faster needle towards empty.
 
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Meghan54

Lifer
Oct 18, 2009
11,684
5,228
136
What you say makes sense, exdeath, but only would apply if you consistently drove around below 1/4 of a tank.
 

Ronstang

Lifer
Jul 8, 2000
12,493
18
81
I think you are going to find that most cars do this by design but not necessarily by intention. I have taken apart quite a few cars in my time and one thing I have always noticed inside fuel tanks is that the gauge float never goes all the way to the top of the tank. Each car differs but you usually have to consume a gallon or more of gasoline before the gauge even budges. If you fill it all the way up into the neck you are just adding to the situation.

It is really not very important how long the gauge reads "full" but much more important when you run out of gas and where the gauge reads at this point. For this very reason I alter fuel senders in my custom cars so I can adjust when they read exactly "E" so I can know the exact amount of fuel I have left at this point. I like to set it to at least 2 gallons which results in plenty of time to find a gas station.
 

duragezic

Lifer
Oct 11, 1999
11,234
4
81
My 93 Mazda 626 was like that a fair amount. I'd fill it up until pump auto shut off (needle moved a bit past F) and get like 75 miles before it got down to F. Once it got below 1/2 or 1/3 it started to go down a lot faster.

My 2008 Mazda 3 seems more balanced. At first I thought something was wrong and I was getting shitty mileage, but it's actually great and just more balanced gauge and slightly smaller tank.
 

RU482

Lifer
Apr 9, 2000
12,689
3
81
My gas gauge seems to drop much faster the last 1/3 of the meter.

I get roughly ~250 miles per tank, with about 200 of those miles in the first 2/3rds then 50 in the last 1/3rd.

If my gas tank just oddly shaped that would cause this? It's not really a problem, just more of an annoyance.

I've been driving for approx 20 yrs. In that time, I've put a couple hundred thousand miles on the road. I've owned 22 cars of various makes and models. Every gas gauge I've encountered is non-linear (including the dozens of rental cars I've had)
 

RockinZ28

Platinum Member
Mar 5, 2008
2,171
49
101
My 2007 Chevy silverado 2500hd company truck is actually very accurate, starts going down from full almost immediately. The quarter tank it takes to get home is the same whether I leave with a full tank or only a 1/4 full.

My firebird and camaro though are notorious for the inaccuracy. Better start looking for a gas statuion when it hits 1/4.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
28,520
1,576
126
The quarter tank it takes to get home is the same whether I leave with a full tank or only a 1/4 full.

Which is also true of a non-linear gas gauge...
 

CraigRT

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
31,440
5
0
Haha, too funny
Mine lasts great at the top, and around 3/4 full and 1/3 remaining are when it drops fastest. Around half is not bad, and the last 1/4 also lasts quite a while.

2002 Maxima
 

hanoverphist

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2006
9,867
23
76
They design them that way so you think you're getting great gas mileage after you first fill up and the needle hardly moves. Notice how long it stays at the very top

my dodge truck does this, pisses me off. i can get about 350 miles on 22 or 23 gallons, but the needle doesnt move until i have about 150 miles driven. that last 50 miles the gauge is moving fast.
 

RockinZ28

Platinum Member
Mar 5, 2008
2,171
49
101
Which is also true of a non-linear gas gauge...

?

My truck shows a quarter tank used on the gauge on a trip to/from work, whether I start from a full tank or a 1/4.

My cars starting from full on the same trip would probably still show full, or just barely under, starting the trip with a 1/4 tank on the gauge, probably wouldn't make it there before running out of gas.