no true gun owner...

DrDoug

Diamond Member
Jan 16, 2014
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I just read one the other day, father thought daughter was intruder and shot through door, killing her. It's fucking nuts.
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
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I just read one the other day, father thought daughter was intruder and shot through door, killing her. It's fucking nuts.

Something is making a sound in my house ... shoots in general direction of sound.
I mean if that is the story.... Then that is what you get for having the 2nd. That shit is going to happen one way or the other all the friggin time.

edit : Thinking about the numbers and variables I figured that auto deaths should be roughly equal to bullet deaths if you consider homo stupidious to be the driving factor ... so I went looking

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle_fatality_rate_in_U.S._by_year
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/18/us/gun-deaths.html

:rolleyes:
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
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Something is making a sound in my house ... shoots in general direction of sound.
I mean if that is the story.... Then that is what you get for having the 2nd. That shit is going to happen one way or the other all the friggin time.

edit : Thinking about the numbers and variables I figured that auto deaths should be roughly equal to bullet deaths if you consider homo stupidious to be the driving factor ... so I went looking

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle_fatality_rate_in_U.S._by_year
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/18/us/gun-deaths.html

:rolleyes:

While it's too many prelim data from a year later shows an actual decrease but suicide has increased. CDC data includes all deaths and suicide is half or a bit more of the figure.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
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I mean, shoot first ask questions later....where's the problem.

That's the problem. I'm a pro-second guy along with the other rights of people but no right is without responsibilities. Having training in tactics as well as marksmanship with periodic recertification ought to be part of ownership. I learned to shoot at 6, taught by my grandfather who made sure I could cite and understand "the rules" before he let me touch a gun and was instantly corrected (properly) if I erred. That kind of responsibility needs to be drilled in to anyone with a firearm.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
38,156
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That's the problem. I'm a pro-second guy along with the other rights of people but no right is without responsibilities. Having training in tactics as well as marksmanship with periodic recertification ought to be part of ownership. I learned to shoot at 6, taught by my grandfather who made sure I could cite and understand "the rules" before he let me touch a gun and was instantly corrected (properly) if I erred. That kind of responsibility needs to be drilled in to anyone with a firearm.

blah blah, libtards want to take our guns! That's how 62 million people will read this.
 

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
28,678
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For anyone concerned with security I always say there is a specific purchase that should always precede that of a firearm: a dog with working breed characteristics from your local animal shelter.* It will adopt your home as it's home and seek to make you happy by keeping it safe, providing a mobile alarm system at the very least. Trained purebreds would obviously be at the top of the scale in terms of effectiveness, but the point is regardless of what you go with having a dogs ears and nose on duty at home is a time tested way of protecting your family, and not shooting them definitely counts.

Bullets are for inbound threats, not recon by fire.That dad is a paranoid ass, and his target identification failure almost ended two lives that day. I hope they and everyone in their orbit all become the world's safest shooters now.


*Hate/allergic to dogs? Install inexpensive alarms and cams commensurate to your worry level.
 
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Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
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blah blah, libtards want to take our guns! That's how 62 million people will read this.

That is true but there is a "both sides" in that we have some like the OP who do have confiscation as an ultimate goal. Unlike abortion which has little middle ground possible for a great number of people, I think there could be with firearms. The problem I have is that I don't see that among politicians I could back. Consequently, trust is something I lack when ignorance abounds.

BTW and FWIW, I am "European" when it comes to home self defense in that if I were to rely on a firearm it wouldn't be a handgun I'd pick but a shotgun and shoot as a last resort. The Euros can generally get a shotgun far easier than anything else, and part of the "rules" are when and when not to shoot. Being spooked isn't sufficient on its own. I do have multiple EDC options that do not include a firearm and growing up in less than ideal conditions along with other life events suggests that it's a prudent precaution, but then I'm trained in those options as well. People who are concerned about personal safety would best be served in getting training in some martial art which emphasizes situational awareness and tactics for real-world possibilities.
 

Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
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That's the problem. I'm a pro-second guy along with the other rights of people but no right is without responsibilities. Having training in tactics as well as marksmanship with periodic recertification ought to be part of ownership. I learned to shoot at 6, taught by my grandfather who made sure I could cite and understand "the rules" before he let me touch a gun and was instantly corrected (properly) if I erred. That kind of responsibility needs to be drilled in to anyone with a firearm.
Meanwhile in the real NRA controlled world, states are falling over themselves to pass "constitutional” carry. Getting rid of all training requirements.
 
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Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
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For anyone concerned with security I always say there is a specific purchase that should always precede that of a firearm: a dog with working breed characteristics from your local animal shelter. It will adopt your home as it's home and seek to make you happy by keeping it safe, providing a mobile alarm system at the very least. Trained purebreds would obviously be at the top of the scale in terms of effectiveness, but the point is regardless of what you go with having a dogs ears and nose on duty at home is a time tested way of protecting your family, and not shooting them definitely counts.

That dad is a paranoid ass, and his target identification failure almost ended two lives that day. I hope they and everyone in their orbit all become the world's safest shooters now.

Great advice. I have a love for a certain purebred, but absolutely a shelter dog is awesome.

I'm in a low crime area but last week about an hour after dark I let our dogs out and the male started barking at a point outside our property that was hidden by trees. He barks at people running or cycling on the road or at cows, but he's not an attack animal, just alerts the pack for possible trouble and that would be us. At first, I thought it nothing but it kept up and the female joined in and both pointed to a specific location. So I let them go on and I sat outside in the dark and after about 15 minutes someone ran down the road from that position with the dogs barking at him. Dark hoodie and pants, nothing reflective. Coincidence? Not likely.

Glad to have the pooches handy.

For everyone- identify your weapons in your home, especially your bedroom. A pen, a broom handle and a whole lot more are effective deterrents if you look at them properly and understand how to use them in advance.
 
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ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
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That is true but there is a "both sides" in that we have some like the OP who do have confiscation as an ultimate goal. Unlike abortion which has little middle ground possible for a great number of people, I think there could be with firearms. The problem I have is that I don't see that among politicians I could back. Consequently, trust is something I lack when ignorance abounds.

BTW and FWIW, I am "European" when it comes to home self defense in that if I were to rely on a firearm it wouldn't be a handgun I'd pick but a shotgun and shoot as a last resort. The Euros can generally get a shotgun far easier than anything else, and part of the "rules" are when and when not to shoot. Being spooked isn't sufficient on its own. I do have multiple EDC options that do not include a firearm and growing up in less than ideal conditions along with other life events suggests that it's a prudent precaution, but then I'm trained in those options as well. People who are concerned about personal safety would best be served in getting training in some martial art which emphasizes situational awareness and tactics for real-world possibilities.

That's Europe though, this is America:

i6KxIpI.jpg
 
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Hayabusa Rider

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Meanwhile in the real NRA controlled world, states are falling over themselves to pass "constitutional” carry. Getting rid of all training requirements.

The NRA is now a political organ. Once I supported them because they strongly embraced responsibility and training. Now I have no use for them and their real agenda. I suggest that people realize that we have a lot of firearms and few who would make trouble intentionally but too many who have no idea of what owning any firearm means.

I would contribute to a national organization that existed for the purposes I've suggested.
 
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Hayabusa Rider

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That's Europe though, this is America:

i6KxIpI.jpg

So what is the core problem then? It's ourselves and our ignorance and tendencies towards violence that is glorified far too often. Life is cheaper than ever and we treat it as such. What do we do about that nature? Pop a cop is funny, a social justice or we are so fearful of everything that we have no perspective or anchor at our collective core. We have no mental health system to speak of and people are afraid of labels, and perhaps with good reason. Had a trouble with a death of a loved one? Well if you had depression once you ought to have that weapon seized (yeah there is some of that) or perhaps a review of meds shows "unfitness" for a job due to moral weakness and on and on.

But "didn't you know the murdering someone is wrong" is often just that. Local culture, national indifference, mental illness and general ignorance. How are those handled? Guns are easy. Producing a society that makes us responsible in our actions towards others?

Now that a problem that people want to shove under the carpet.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
38,156
18,647
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So what is the core problem then? It's ourselves and our ignorance and tendencies towards violence that is glorified far too often. Life is cheaper than ever and we treat it as such. What do we do about that nature? Pop a cop is funny, a social justice or we are so fearful of everything that we have no perspective or anchor at our collective core. We have no mental health system to speak of and people are afraid of labels, and perhaps with good reason. Had a trouble with a death of a loved one? Well if you had depression once you ought to have that weapon seized (yeah there is some of that) or perhaps a review of meds shows "unfitness" for a job due to moral weakness and on and on.

But "didn't you know the murdering someone is wrong" is often just that. Local culture, national indifference, mental illness and general ignorance. How are those handled? Guns are easy. Producing a society that makes us responsible in our actions towards others?

Now that a problem that people want to shove under the carpet.

Yes, the core of the problem (as is in many cases) is us. Only we can change ourselves.
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,971
13,488
136
That's the problem. I'm a pro-second guy along with the other rights of people but no right is without responsibilities. Having training in tactics as well as marksmanship with periodic recertification ought to be part of ownership. I learned to shoot at 6, taught by my grandfather who made sure I could cite and understand "the rules" before he let me touch a gun and was instantly corrected (properly) if I erred. That kind of responsibility needs to be drilled in to anyone with a firearm.

So ... essentially like taking a hunters license and what goes with it.
Its like bat shit a lot of sense right there.