NH Couple bunkered down in their compound

ayabe

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Aug 10, 2005
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PLAINFIELD, New Hampshire (AP) -- To avoid serving prison sentences for tax evasion, Ed Brown and his wife, Elaine, have locked themselves off from the world on their own terms.

From behind the 8-inch concrete walls of their 110-acre hilltop compound, the couple taunt police and SWAT teams and play to reporters and government-haters with references to past standoffs that turned deadly.

Residents want the Browns' circus to end before their small town along the Connecticut River becomes the next Ruby Ridge or Waco.

The Browns raised the specter of the first case, the 1992 shootout at an Idaho property called Ruby Ridge, by holding a news conference Monday with Randy Weaver, whose wife and child were killed there along with a deputy U.S. marshal.

Ed Brown warned authorities they wouldn't take him alive: "We either walk out of here free or we die."

The Browns were sentenced in absentia to 63-month prison sentences in April, after being convicted of conspiring to evade taxes on nearly $1.9 million in Elaine Brown's income and of plotting to disguise large financial transactions.

Though they have refused to leave the compound, U.S. Marshal Stephen Monier insists he has no plans to raid it to make them serve their time and will instead seek a peaceful surrender.

Expert observers praise the authorities' hands-off approach, but patience is wearing thin for Plainfield's 2,400 residents. Town selectmen recently asked Monier to stop the influx of militiamen and other anti-government groups to the Browns' home and to bring the couple to justice.

"While we understand and support efforts to achieve a quiet resolution to this matter, the longer the Browns remain at large the better the chance, in our view, that our local police force will be involved in an incident with them or their group of supporters," the letter reads. "In short, we believe that it is time that definitive action be taken."

It's a sentiment echoed throughout the town.

"The people of Plainfield feel the whole thing has been mismanaged from the get-go," says Stephen Taylor, a Plainfield native who is state agriculture commissioner. "He's got this band of loonies up there right now. There's this constant traffic and helicopters overhead and everything. Goddamn crazies."

The town south of bustling Lebanon has a "live-and-let-live" reputation that no one wants linked to the Browns, Taylor said.

"Everybody feels a tiny bit of embarrassment. This is what we're going to be known for?" Taylor said. "We don't want to be known for this."

The Browns' home on an isolated dirt roads includes a turret that offers a 360-degree view of the property and a driveway that is sometimes barricaded with SUVs.

Ed Brown, a retired exterminator, and his wife, a dentist, have bragged that the compound is self-sufficient and capable of running entirely on solar, wind and geothermal energies.

While saying repeatedly that he has no interest in harming the Browns or their supporters, Monier has not said what he does plan to do.

He says the massive law enforcement turnout on June 7, complete with roadblocks and planes, was for surveillance of the compound while agents seized the Lebanon building that housed Elaine Brown's dental practice.

But Ed Brown and many town residents believe it was a botched raid that apparently had to be called off when someone walking a dog stumbled onto federal agents in camouflage near the home.

"We were much better off before the federal government tried to take him into custody and it didn't go well," fumed town administrator Steve Halleran. "The fervor had died down. That was one of the things we were hoping, that people would go on to other things. But that's all by the wayside."

Weaver's news conference with the couple only added to local frustrations.

"That must've been a first. We've never really seen convicted felons just be able to hold press conferences," Halleran said. "There has to be a restriction of access to and from their property. If people can continue to visit them, to bring them supplies, with diesel fuel and food, they can stay there for a long time."

Brown neighbor David Grobe, a former patient of Elaine Brown, just wants the dirt road to be silent again. He said satellite news trucks parked at a softball field for Monday's news conference at the same time residents wanted to play.

"This used to be a very quiet street," he said.

Sitting in lawn chairs around the Browns' long gravel driveway, the couple's supporters rail against Freemasons, the Illuminati, the Federal Reserve, the Vatican and the mainstream media.

Some defend the Browns' claim -- repeatedly rejected by courts -- that no law authorizes the federal income tax and that the 1913 constitutional amendment permitting it was never properly ratified.

"The income tax can take more than the Mafia can with a machine gun. Believe me," said Alfred Liseo of Meriden, Connecticut.

"The Mafia doesn't have popular support," interrupted Bill Walker. "The government has support of millions of ignorant people who have the wool pulled over their eyes. They think they need to pay. They don't."

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This is the first I've heard of this so I thought other might be interested. It's good to see the Feds aren't going all Rambo on these people but this kind of stuff really can't be tolerated indefinitely.

Their group of supporters sound a lot like my crazy Commie uncle, who while interesting to talk to, gets real tiresome after about 20 minutes. If they really have a beef with the income tax they need to take it to the courts, the rest of us schlubs have to pay our taxes.

I hope for everyone's sake that it ends peacefully.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,102
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"Some defend the Browns' claim -- repeatedly rejected by courts -- that no law authorizes the federal income tax and that the 1913 constitutional amendment permitting it was never properly ratified. "

hehe, we(P&N) were just discussing this recently.
 

SilthDraeth

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2003
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Good for them. I support what they are doing. There will be more and more of this. Funny just recently there was a post stating Americans refuse to revolt. I believe there will be more and more of this silent revolution. Waco and Ruby Ridge where wrong. Hopefully this becomes so prominent in America that a true revolution takes place, and the government is destroyed and rebuilt adhering closely to Constitutional Law.
 

SilthDraeth

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2003
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Meaning within U.S. accountancy

INCOME - Corporate Profit; also defined as money derived as interest on public or corporate stocks and bonds, investments and securities.

INCOME cannot be derived from or as WAGES as WAGES are not PROFIT but are an expense item to any sort of business.

INCOME TAX - money derived from corporate profit, stocks, bonds, securities, and investments that has a tax lien placed against it by the Internal Revenue Service (IRS - a privately held corporate entity not created by law by the United States Congress).
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
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Funny just recently there was a post stating Americans refuse to revolt. I believe there will be more and more of this silent revolution.
I wouldn't call this a silent revolution...just two nutjobs from N.H. that don't want to pay their taxes.
 

Kirby

Lifer
Apr 10, 2006
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Some defend the Browns' claim -- repeatedly rejected by courts -- that no law authorizes the federal income tax and that the 1913 constitutional amendment permitting it was never properly ratified.

This is the same reasoning that my uncle uses. I think he hasn't paid income tax for 25+ years and owes like a quarter million.
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,834
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They have to breath. I'd guess some kind of knockout gas or maybe some germ warfare might be in the wings?
 

StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
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People who go on about the illegality of taxes are idiots. Even if they were right, which they are not, they're merely forcing us to pay more. If everybody decides to stop paying, no more police, fire, military, etc.

Anyway, how I'd handle this would be to simply call off all my cops and every once in a while have a cop go by their house or put up some wanted signs in the local town asking people to call the cops if they see this couple. Then when they go out for their food or whatever, have a cruiser come pick them up, easy breezy. It's a waste of time having cops stand outside. It's not like they are torturing people in there. Go get them later and of course charge them additionally with evading arrest and whatever else.
 

ahurtt

Diamond Member
Feb 1, 2001
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I see an easy solution to this problem. Barricade them IN their compound for 63 months and leave. Post a guard or 2 to keep people from coming and going to and from the property. Basically just lay siege to the compound. Either they will come out or eventually starve to death. Even if they don't starve to death and they live in there until they die of old age, the effect is still the same. They are basically incarcerated. Come back in 63 months and inter their remains. Drama ends.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
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This is a repost, this has been going on for quite some time. But happy to see an update, I had begun wondering what was going on.

Income tax, the 16th Amendment passed in 1913 (as correctly noted above) has been upheld continually by SCOTUS since the first case in (about) 1915. So, the Supreme Court justices have never felt the 14th's ratification was defective in any way. Who has the final say in such "legal" matters"?

This has been brought up in courts so many times, with a 100% losing rate, that doing so any more will get you a tax fraud conviction, fine and likely Fed prison time. You've lost as soon as you file a petition/brief with any of this mumbo jumbo mentioned in it - thrown right out immediately.

While I strongly oppose Waco, Ruby Ridge, Branch Dividian, Elias Gonzales - type government strong arm tactics against citizens, something does need to be done. IMO, additional time should be added to their sentances for refusal to surrender and report to jail.

Surely some means can be utilized other than blowing up/burning their house or killing them with snipers.

I remember a certain "pineapple face" guy we had this problem with. Cut off access to/from the house, blare crappy music 24/7 (surely Sanjay has a record out by now), destroy/sabotage their generators, windmills or solar panels etc. and water supplies. Maybe pump in a few canisters of tear gas now & then. Send in some ninjas with tranq darts - whatever.

How about that military "gay bomb", let him and Randy Weaver have a go at it.

What about that "heat ray" thingy, or the "vomit ray" thingy. Might wanna try some of that stuff.

;)

Fern

 

techs

Lifer
Sep 26, 2000
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These morons are actually fighting for a return to a non-progressive tax system.
Where individuals like them will end up being taxed in other ways FAR FAR FAR more than they are taxed now.
Idiots and morons.
Amazing how the rich have have gotten their ideology into peoples heads.
 

ayabe

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2005
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Originally posted by: Fern
This is a repost, this has been going on for quite some time. But happy to see an update, I had begun wondering what was going on.

Didn't see this posted before, so all apologies.


The real kicker about this to me is that if the Feds even suspected that he had a single pot plant growing in his compound they would have sent in SWAT on the first day.
 

spittledip

Diamond Member
Apr 23, 2005
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Give to Caesar what is Caesar's. We don't have any real stake in this country- the govt owns it. We have to abide by the govts rules. Truth is, it is only money. If we want to live here, we have to pay rent or mortgage and/or taxes. Just think of taxes as a type of rent ;)
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
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Originally posted by: ayabe
Originally posted by: Fern
This is a repost, this has been going on for quite some time. But happy to see an update, I had begun wondering what was going on.

Didn't see this posted before, so all apologies.


The real kicker about this to me is that if the Feds even suspected that he had a single pot plant growing in his compound they would have sent in SWAT on the first day. Now there's an idea!, know what I mean? ;) )

Bah, no need to apologise. Let's say it's an update about their status & with Randy Weaver showing up (as I said, I've been curious and I was thinking about this just a few days ago).

I think it demonstrates that these people are pretty media savy. Try to wrap themselves in the whole Ruby Ridge thingy to scare off the authorities etc.

Fern
 

SilthDraeth

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2003
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Well, I don't see how prison is any different than them sitting in their house for 10 years.

And wasn't there a video of R Kelley having sex with like a 14 year old, or something along those lines, and he still is out, not in prison. But these people have police and feds surrounding them for not paying income tax.

I just find the priorities grossly shifted.

Disclaimer: I may be wrong on details. And I do not agree with income tax either, and I believe the reason it is always upheld in court as being legal, is because: If even one person was able to win, and become exempt from it all together, every other American would use the same defense.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
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Without people paying their Taxes, the US would fall apart rather quickly. So yes, it is a very serious crime to not pay.
 

ayabe

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2005
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Originally posted by: SilthDraeth
Well, I don't see how prison is any different than them sitting in their house for 10 years.

What? Are you being serious? Prison is prison, house arrest is house arrest, they are not even in the same ballpark. Getting only a couple showers a week and having to worry about getting shanked or raped or worse in prison makes it just a tad worse than house arrest.

And wasn't there a video of R Kelley having sex with like a 14 year old, or something along those lines, and he still is out, not in prison. But these people have police and feds surrounding them for not paying income tax.

Yeah that puzzles me as well, and that happened years ago. Not sure exactly what the deal in California is but their justice system is basically broken. Lindsey Lohan crashed her car drunk into a tree a few weeks ago, then fled the scene on foot, they found coke in her car, etc. But she's not in jail or even being charged.


 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
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Originally posted by: SilthDraeth
Well, I don't see how prison is any different than them sitting in their house for 10 years.

Tune in to MSNBC news channel most any night and you'll quickly see how it's differnet from sitting in your own home. MSNBC runs a lot of "specials" where they go various prisons located around the USA

And wasn't there a video of R Kelley having sex with like a 14 year old, or something along those lines, and he still is out, not in prison. But these people have police and feds surrounding them for not paying income tax.

R Kelly hasn't been convicted yet (innocent until proven guilty and all that). I don't know what the holdup is on his trial.

These people hae been convicted AND sentanced. Big difference


I just find the priorities grossly shifted.

Disclaimer: I may be wrong on details. And I do not agree with income tax either, and I believe the reason it is always upheld in court as being legal, is because: If even one person was able to win, and become exempt from it all together, every other American would use the same defense.

Look, the 16th amendment was passed/ratified in 1913. It was challenged and litgated (upheld) by the SCOTUS almost immediately. If there were some problem with the ratification one has to believe it would have been identified and corrected back then.

To fix it would not have been that big a deal either (like it would be now). At that time the income tax applied only to the very uber wealthy of that day - thus a very very small percentage of people even filed tax returns.

Since it's inception, the SCOTUS has reviewed an awful lot of tax cases (as have the lower courts). For anybody to think that the SCOTUS is now suddenly going to find income tax unconstitutional on some grounds is utter insanity.

Fern
 

senseamp

Lifer
Feb 5, 2006
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I think there is an obvious compromise here. Just give them house arrest for the tax evasion :D
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
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The government is in the business of making money. If you do not want to pay them, they will put a gun to your head to get their money.

There were nearly 40 people who came to Mr. Brown's aid at the beginning of the standoff. There are a lot of people in this country ready and willing to fight the government if given the opportunity. Many of these people believe that Ruby Ridge and Waco were a declaration or war. These same people are the ones that bombed the Oklahoma City Federal building.

The "insurgency" here at home never gets any media coverage anymore.
 

compuwiz1

Admin Emeritus Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
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I like this concept. The money we all can save from not paying taxes can build tall, thick walls. No gooberments are gonna get in there. :roll:
 

Termagant

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Mar 10, 2006
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Originally posted by: Nebor
The government is in the business of making money. If you do not want to pay them, they will put a gun to your head to get their money.

There were nearly 40 people who came to Mr. Brown's aid at the beginning of the standoff. There are a lot of people in this country ready and willing to fight the government if given the opportunity. Many of these people believe that Ruby Ridge and Waco were a declaration or war. These same people are the ones that bombed the Oklahoma City Federal building.

The "insurgency" here at home never gets any media coverage anymore.

Yeah bombing the Oklahoma City Fed building was so valiant. Why not just move to Palestine, do they pay taxes?
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
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Originally posted by: Termagant
Originally posted by: Nebor
The government is in the business of making money. If you do not want to pay them, they will put a gun to your head to get their money.

There were nearly 40 people who came to Mr. Brown's aid at the beginning of the standoff. There are a lot of people in this country ready and willing to fight the government if given the opportunity. Many of these people believe that Ruby Ridge and Waco were a declaration or war. These same people are the ones that bombed the Oklahoma City Federal building.

The "insurgency" here at home never gets any media coverage anymore.

Yeah bombing the Oklahoma City Fed building was so valiant. Why not just move to Palestine, do they pay taxes?

I never said it was valiant. They killed a lot of children in that attack.

I was simply pointing out that this is a war going on in our own country, and it's far from over.