Nexus, HD2, and all other phones with weaksauce 3G bands

mrSHEiK124

Lifer
Mar 6, 2004
11,488
2
0
Fuck you. That's right, fuck you HTC, fuck you Sony Ericcson, and fuck you Nokia. I'm sick of seeing your latest and greatest released with 900/1700/2100 MHz 3G or even worse just straight 900/2100 MHz. How much extra does it cost you to include an 850/900/1700/1900/2100 MHZ radio? $2? My HTC Touch Pro has 850/900/1900/2100 MHz, but only because at&t sold it to me. I hope you asswipes enjoy declining revenue while other manufacturers (read: Apple) continue to do it right and at least offer proper worldphones when customers drop upwards of $600 on some unlocked kit. I also refuse to settle for whatever outdated crap you're pushing out via carriers (read: HTC Tilt2 and Pure on at&t) and also refuse to pay out the ass to do something ridiculous like import a Telus or Telstra phone to get that NAM 3G goodness.

Merry Christmas!
 

abaez

Diamond Member
Jan 28, 2000
7,155
1
81
I'm sorry but what? The iPhone has never had Tmobile 3g bands here in the U.S., so they are just as guilty.
 

uli2000

Golden Member
Jul 28, 2006
1,257
1
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You also have to remember that every country has it own bandplan and having a phone with all those frequencies may interfere with other services using that spectrum. Or maybe that spectrum is reserved for other uses (public saftey, ect). But I agree, just put out a 5 band phone.
 
Feb 19, 2001
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I agree that it would be nice to get 1900 and 850 for these wonderful phones.

But a bigger issue is SCREW YOU FCC and SCREW YOU US NETWORKS for having stupid bands like 850 and 1900. You're just isolating us.

Furthermore, screw you carriers and dumbass American public for needing carrier subsidies and not believing in unlocked phones. You are the reason we need dumb phones named LG enV and all these other dumbass names because names like Sony Ericsson K750 don't mean anything... sigh.

BTW, while Tilt2 and Pure (aka Touch Pro 2 and Touch Diamond 2) are slower phones, they aren't necessarily OUTDATED. It's HTC's fault for launching the same 528mhz phones again, but the rest of the world seems to love them. Just because the iPhone 3GS stamped the concept of a Cortex A8 processor in your head, doesn't mean everything now needs to be the same type. No one was complaining with the old iPhone 2G/3G 400mhz ARM11 processor. It was plenty fast for the games then.
 

coolVariable

Diamond Member
May 18, 2001
3,724
0
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Fuck you. That's right, fuck you HTC, fuck you Sony Ericcson, and fuck you Nokia. I'm sick of seeing your latest and greatest released with 900/1700/2100 MHz 3G or even worse just straight 900/2100 MHz. How much extra does it cost you to include an 850/900/1700/1900/2100 MHZ radio? $2? My HTC Touch Pro has 850/900/1900/2100 MHz, but only because at&t sold it to me. I hope you asswipes enjoy declining revenue while other manufacturers (read: Apple) continue to do it right and at least offer proper worldphones when customers drop upwards of $600 on some unlocked kit. I also refuse to settle for whatever outdated crap you're pushing out via carriers (read: HTC Tilt2 and Pure on at&t) and also refuse to pay out the ass to do something ridiculous like import a Telus or Telstra phone to get that NAM 3G goodness.

Merry Christmas!

YES!!!!!
And FUCK google as well! Selling an "unlocked" phone that only works on ONE carrier's 3G network?

I HATE it but if there is no decent phone released with at least 850/1900/2100 3G in the next 2-3 weeks, I will be forced to get an iPhone 3GS (and I hate Apple).
 

A5

Diamond Member
Jun 9, 2000
4,902
5
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YES!!!!!
And FUCK google as well! Selling an "unlocked" phone that only works on ONE carrier's 3G network?

I HATE it but if there is no decent phone released with at least 850/1900/2100 3G in the next 2-3 weeks, I will be forced to get an iPhone 3GS (and I hate Apple).

Yeah that's what I don't get - Google is saying "We'll sell you this unlocked phone, but you'll want to break it in half unless you use it on T-Mobile." If this thing could work on both, but be subsidized on T-mo, then it would be way better.
 

CptCrunch

Golden Member
Jan 31, 2005
1,877
1
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I completely agree with you. My thoughts are to include the RF module that can read either of the 5 bands, but allow the user/carrier to turn them off and on depending on their settings. How hard is that?

A big ol FU to the FCC as well. They have to be able to consolidate these bands to make more phones work on the other networks and give the carriers more channels to operate on. This "all other frequencies are in use" crap is ridiculous. They need to loosen up some control on the wireless frequencies that will be all the more important in the future.
 

Deeko

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
30,213
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The Tilt2 and Pure are actually pretty good phones....and you're basically knotting your panties because they don't include AT&T 3G bands? Switch carriers if you don't like it, genius. And what did Apple "get right?" Its not like they included T-Mobile 3G bands.

And by the way, the Verizon Touch Pro2 does quad-band GSM + EV-DO rev A. Don't blame HTC.
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
80,287
17,080
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I hate to tell you this sir, but these are mostly issues in America with the American versions of phones. The European and Japanese versions are much better. Mostly because the networks they are operating on are assumed to be better, which they often are.
 
Feb 19, 2001
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Look, you're going to have to ask yourself as we move in the 4G world.

4G will unite the Americas with 1700 and 700. 700 will be US only though. So now what? The rest of the world is sticking to 900/2100. I guess it's good to see the Americas united for once, but with the rest of the world sticking to other bands, we're still gonna get shafted.

You're crying because Google's releasing a phone that works with 95% of the GSM world. AT&T represents a hurdle and a rock in a stream. Because we have 850/1900, people have to build special phones.

So maybe we should pressure companies to make quad band UMTS chips widely available for low prices, or we should tell the FCC to start getting the US on board with the rest of the world.

You may think this whole US vs rest of the world is ok when you talk about imperial units but when it starts affecting what kind of products are made for the US and what's not and we lose out as consumers, then it sucks to be on the other side of the fence.
 

mrSHEiK124

Lifer
Mar 6, 2004
11,488
2
0
Ugh, maybe I'll just switch and get the HD2 when T-Mo USA releases it, I'll pay the ETF - I'm sick of at&t.
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
12
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The Nexus One may support all US 3G bands.

The Sony Ericsson X10 DOES support all US 3G bands. And you can buy one right now for ~$800.

HD2 is AT&T only.

Frankly I don't really care about AWS bands on my phones. I switched to AT&T because T-mobile's 3G is spotty and even when it works, it's not as fast as what AT&T offers. Pretty much any interstate I can drive on in Texas will have me on AT&T HSDPA the entire trip.

So I'm happy as long as they have 850mhz :p
 
Feb 19, 2001
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The Nexus One may support all US 3G bands.

The Sony Ericsson X10 DOES support all US 3G bands. And you can buy one right now for ~$800.

HD2 is AT&T only.

Frankly I don't really care about AWS bands on my phones. I switched to AT&T because T-mobile's 3G is spotty and even when it works, it's not as fast as what AT&T offers. Pretty much any interstate I can drive on in Texas will have me on AT&T HSDPA the entire trip.

So I'm happy as long as they have 850mhz :p

HD2 is T-Mobile.
Nexus One has AWS bands and the 2100 that the rest of the world uses. AT&T uses 850/1900.

So no. Those two phones will not work with ATT 3G.

I think another thing people should make sure to notice is Band I WCDMA is 2100 but this is different from the 2100 in AWS. So just because it says 2100 doesn't mean it's T-Mobile compatible. 2100 usually refers to the IMT 1900/2100 the rest of the world uses.
 
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coolVariable

Diamond Member
May 18, 2001
3,724
0
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Look, you're going to have to ask yourself as we move in the 4G world.

4G will unite the Americas with 1700 and 700. 700 will be US only though. So now what? The rest of the world is sticking to 900/2100. I guess it's good to see the Americas united for once, but with the rest of the world sticking to other bands, we're still gonna get shafted.

Well, hopefully phone makers will build 4G chips with 4 frequencies: 700/1700/900/2100.


You're crying because Google's releasing a phone that works with 95% of the GSM world. AT&T represents a hurdle and a rock in a stream. Because we have 850/1900, people have to build special phones.

No. It works on AWS and potentially 2100 (the last being unconfirmed, although it would be strange to block that).

Let's compare: 34 million subscribers in the Americas use AWS. Probably, 250+ million subs use 850/1900.
(There are only 2 carriers with AWS: T-Mobile USA and Wind [which has no coverage and no customers since they just started in Dec. 09]. The list of 850/1900 carriers is endless: at&t, telus, rogers, movistar, telcel, ...)

So by not selling an 850/1900 version they are locking out 250+ million potential customers in the Americas.

RETARDED if you ask me.

So maybe we should pressure companies to make quad band UMTS chips widely available for low prices, or we should tell the FCC to start getting the US on board with the rest of the world.

THAT would be nice.
But FUCKING HTC has actually been enabling less and less frequencies on recent phones. My Tilt still has 3 3G frequencies (like the iPhone) ... most recent HTC phones only have 2!

You may think this whole US vs rest of the world is ok when you talk about imperial units but when it starts affecting what kind of products are made for the US and what's not and we lose out as consumers, then it sucks to be on the other side of the fence.

imperial units are bullshit. Anybody that says otherwise is a retard!
 
Feb 19, 2001
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coolVariable: I understand what your'e saying. 850/1900 isn't as big of a profit to them as 2100 is. Do you get it? You listed a bunch of 850/1900 carriers. Now let's look at the list of 2100 3G carriers. Let's see, you listed 2 AWS carriers. There's probably like 10 850/1900 carriers, and there's probably 100 2100mhz carriers.

Virtually all of Europe uses 2100 IMT and so does Asia and probably other areas too. Let's look at it this way. How many N95-1s and N95-2s did Nokia sell compared to N95-3 and N95-4? The money is in 2100 IMT.

You can't blame them for putting the US bands on 2nd tier. The Nexus One was approved for Bands I, IV and VIII which makes it 900/1700/2100

The whole ATT thing is an unconfirmed thing. Sure it would be nice to have, but I wouldn't put my money on it yet arite?

Like I said, it works with the rest of the world. I said it works on AWS too because it's for T-Mobile. Big deal?

Just get it in your head. It's OUR FAULT for being on a retarded frequency. Don't blame the phone manufacturer. You can call them stupid all you want but until someone designs a quad band 3G chip that's very affordable and can sell it to HTC, Moto, Nokia, and every manufacturer, then we're gonna get shitty phones for a while ok? If you had to build a special phone for each retarded region of the world, you'd probably start with the most profitable. Given the US doesn't even care for crap about unlocked phones, this isn't the most profitable for the phone makers. The US is the absolute worst given that there's CDMA phones too, AND the fact that 98% of people DEPEND on subsidized phones. There are VERY FEW people who will even venture to unlocked phones.
 

abaez

Diamond Member
Jan 28, 2000
7,155
1
81
No. It works on AWS and potentially 2100 (the last being unconfirmed, although it would be strange to block that).

Let's compare: 34 million subscribers in the Americas use AWS. Probably, 250+ million subs use 850/1900.
(There are only 2 carriers with AWS: T-Mobile USA and Wind [which has no coverage and no customers since they just started in Dec. 09]. The list of 850/1900 carriers is endless: at&t, telus, rogers, movistar, telcel, ...)

So by not selling an 850/1900 version they are locking out 250+ million potential customers in the Americas.

RETARDED if you ask me.

http://www.worldtimezone.com/gsm.html

If it's a choice between the countries in the Americas versus the rest of the world, it's pretty easy which to pick first. India probably has 250+ million potential customers alone.
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,133
38
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Why do some people here have a hard-on for hating America? Unlike Europe and Asia, our communication infrastructure was much better when cellphones became popular. That is why communication is cheaper here compared to those two regions. Hence, Americans are adversed to spending so much money on communication devices that serve niche purposes considering the high usage of other communication tools, namely personal computers on the internet. Hence, unlike Europe and Asia where the phone is everything, in America the phone complements the computer, it doesn't replace it. Therefore, we are loathe to spend $600 on a device whose services can be easily duplicated on a cheap personal computer connected to the internet.

So, subsidized phones are here to stay in America, like it or not. Give me a $10 phone and a $40 service anytime. Anything more will have to be subsidized by my employer.
 
Feb 19, 2001
20,155
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Why do some people here have a hard-on for hating America? Unlike Europe and Asia, our communication infrastructure was much better when cellphones became popular. That is why communication is cheaper here compared to those two regions. Hence, Americans are adversed to spending so much money on communication devices that serve niche purposes considering the high usage of other communication tools, namely personal computers on the internet. Hence, unlike Europe and Asia where the phone is everything, in America the phone complements the computer, it doesn't replace it. Therefore, we are loathe to spend $600 on a device whose services can be easily duplicated on a cheap personal computer connected to the internet.

So, subsidized phones are here to stay in America, like it or not. Give me a $10 phone and a $40 service anytime. Anything more will have to be subsidized by my employer.

$200 iPhone w/ 2 year contract
$600 smartphone with no contract.

iPhone requires $30 data plan. Of course ATT just forces "smart phones" to buy $30 plans. Throw in an unlocked HTC HD2 or fine... an unlocked HTC Hero which gets ATT3G courtesy of Canada's Telus. $15 / month plan * 24 months = $360. You pretty much made up the difference.

The problem with subsidies is that phone companies focus so much on paying for phones to attract customers. This was certainly a good thing in the early days of cell phones when people were hesitant to jump on the bandwagon. The cost of entry is a huge barrier. Not everyone wants a $200 phone. People want FREE phones. The money companies spend on phones can go to improving the network. I'd rather have ATT spend money on improving its network rather than buying more phones.

Subsidies are there around the world, but it's not a huge selling point. How many commercials do you see a day going Buy one droid get one free? Or other Get this phone FREE for the holidays... blah blah blah. Honestly, having gone to China, Korea, Hong Kong, Taiwan, I've seen more phone deal commercials on TV in the US than in Asia. It's the American mentality of subsidies. We all expect free phones left and right. There are free phones in Taiwan where I'm at right now too. But if you want something more powerful like a Nokia N97, it's not going to be buy one get one free for $99. It's gonna cost a little more, but not the full $500 or whatever it is at NokiaUSA.com.

The phone is not everything in the US because it's not VIEWED as one... not until the iPhone really popularized smartphones. IT was BlackBerry or bust. WinMo phones in the US were terrible. The HTC phones didn't really hit yet and they were mainly built for overseas use with their frequencies. The iPhone did wonders for the American market. It introduced the concept of 3G that 99.9% of the people never cared about. For the first time, people CARE about a 600mhz Cortex A8 processor and Anand himself laughs at the Nokia N97's ARM11 processor in the iPhone review (I bet he didn't even use one before he made that comment). I'm glad people now appreciate smartphones more and 3G. I'm glad the iPhone revealed that ATT's 3G network is a piece of crap. This is a wakeup call that's helped.

I don't know what you mean about infrastructure for communication being better. Our 3G networks were deployed later and while you can make the argument about population density and stuff, it's amazing that 3G is everywhere. I took the HSR in TAiwan today that goes through mountains and stuff and it's amazing 3G was there all the way with me. The problem is that even in our URBAN areas, our 3G networks are lagging behind.

http://www.worldtimezone.com/gsm.html

If it's a choice between the countries in the Americas versus the rest of the world, it's pretty easy which to pick first. India probably has 250+ million potential customers alone.

I like how you scroll down and it says 3G 2100 almost all the way across the board... LOL. Remember in 2005 when a lot of phones were not GSM850 compatible yet? But there were a good chunk of quad band phones out. I think by 2007, almost every phone was quad band capable.... at least the feature fancy phones they sold around the world. I remember by 2007 I had no problem just picking out almost any phone since they all had GSM850 for my use on AT&T. The trick was getting something that wasn't just UMTS2100. Unfortunately it's 2010, and the same problem exists. UMTS2100 is still everywhere. I think some phones now add in Band VIII which is UMTS 900 but this is again not for the US.

I think if there was enough demand like GSM 850, then manufacturers would add it in.

Hey, I'm on the same boat too. I want AT&T 3G. But it's easy to see why it's not being done, and it's certainly NOT HTC's fault or Nokia's fault or Sony Ericsson's fault.
 
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pm

Elite Member Mobile Devices
Jan 25, 2000
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That is why communication is cheaper here compared to those two regions. [snipped] So, subsidized phones are here to stay in America, like it or not. Give me a $10 phone and a $40 service anytime. Anything more will have to be subsidized by my employer.

I don't quite follow this. In my travels over summer 2009 in England, Germany, Poland, Austria, the Czech Republic and a few other countries, I experienced the opposite. First, I never saw a wireless carrier store in Europe that didn't sell subsidized phones. It's actually interesting because generally they tiered the subsidy - the more expensive the plan, the cheaper the phone. So this idea that Europeans don't have subsidized phones isn't correct in my experience. There were a lot more stores in the EU that carried phones that weren't tied to providers than I tend to see in the US.

Examples:
http://shop.vodafone.co.uk/shop/mobile-phones/all-phones
http://www.orange.at/Content.Node/mehr_als_telefonieren/iphone_smartphones/iphone/

You can pick up an iPhone 3GS in most of Europe for free with the right monthly plan.

Then I had to say I didn't see a lot of people walking around with incredibly cool phones - and I'm one who tends to pay attention to cell phones. I saw about the same mix as in the US, so this idea that Europeans are walking around with handheld computers in their hands doesn't match up with what I saw either. I did tend to see a lot of models that I hadn't seen in the US - they seem to get some phones ahead of the US - and they seemed to have a lot more phones to choose from than what you'd normally see walking into AT&T. Android was pretty big in Eastern Europe. iPhones were big in the UK. Nokia smartphones were huge in Germany and Austria.

Lastly, in general cell phone service in Europe for data plans was cheaper than in the US in my experience. Voice service for cell phones was a bit cheaper than the US - particularly in Poland and Czech - but it was on par with what we have. I paid US$6 for 60MB of data in Poland. I paid about US$11 for about the same thing in Germany. The only major difference that I saw was that they only pay for calls and texts that they originate - like our standard phone service in the US, you normally only pay to make a call not to receive it. In fact the few that I talked to about it were baffled by the idea that you would have to pay to receive a text message or call.

The thing that baffled me in the EU was the ridiculous fees for roaming. You could use a phone in Germany using T-Mobile's prepaid service, and then be in Austria and be charged a ridiculous amount for originating a call. But Austria has T-Mobile too. I pretty much had to buy a prepaid SIM in each country that I visited. In a continent that links currencies, trading and lots of other things, it seemed bizarre how incompatible their phone providers all were in terms of roaming and billing.


Just because someone thinks that things that US aren't as good as they are in other countries doesn't mean they have a "hard-on for hating America". We chose a bunch of bands in the US that turned out not to be compatible with the rest of the world - the reason for this is not that the US is "retarded" but that we were the first in the world with a lot of wireless services (TV, color TV, cell phones, dedicated wireless emergency services, HAM radio, etc) and thus we tended to lock down onto frequencies that other countries following after us didn't us for geopolitical or technical reasons. Countries favoring their own technology for political reasons seems to me to be the biggest issue with why the world isn't compatible - and pretty much all of the larger nations seem to be guilty of some form of electronic protectionism at some point. GSM could have been made compatible with US CDMA if there had been political will to do so.
 
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coolVariable

Diamond Member
May 18, 2001
3,724
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coolVariable: I understand what your'e saying. 850/1900 isn't as big of a profit to them as 2100 is. Do you get it? You listed a bunch of 850/1900 carriers. Now let's look at the list of 2100 3G carriers. Let's see, you listed 2 AWS carriers. There's probably like 10 850/1900 carriers, and there's probably 100 2100mhz carriers.

Virtually all of Europe uses 2100 IMT and so does Asia and probably other areas too. Let's look at it this way. How many N95-1s and N95-2s did Nokia sell compared to N95-3 and N95-4? The money is in 2100 IMT.

You can't blame them for putting the US bands on 2nd tier. The Nexus One was approved for Bands I, IV and VIII which makes it 900/1700/2100

The whole ATT thing is an unconfirmed thing. Sure it would be nice to have, but I wouldn't put my money on it yet arite?

Like I said, it works with the rest of the world. I said it works on AWS too because it's for T-Mobile. Big deal?

Just get it in your head. It's OUR FAULT for being on a retarded frequency. Don't blame the phone manufacturer. You can call them stupid all you want but until someone designs a quad band 3G chip that's very affordable and can sell it to HTC, Moto, Nokia, and every manufacturer, then we're gonna get shitty phones for a while ok? If you had to build a special phone for each retarded region of the world, you'd probably start with the most profitable. Given the US doesn't even care for crap about unlocked phones, this isn't the most profitable for the phone makers. The US is the absolute worst given that there's CDMA phones too, AND the fact that 98% of people DEPEND on subsidized phones. There are VERY FEW people who will even venture to unlocked phones.

You apparently don't get it.
All 3G phones with 850/1900 SHOULD also have 2100.
So the choice is either: 250+ mm subs in the Americas and Australia PLUS the rest of the world OR 34mm subs in the Americas, NO Australia plus rest of world.
AND FUCKING WAKE UP: people in Europe buy subsidized phones too!!!!!!
 

pm

Elite Member Mobile Devices
Jan 25, 2000
7,419
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Coolvariable, please chill out a bit and relax. This is an interesting discussion, IMO, on a confusing topic and there's no need for all-caps obscenities.


There are quite a few 3G bands, and there are likely to be a similar number of LTE bands. You need both an uplink frequency and a downlink frequency and they need to be separated by enough of a gap that the two don't interfere with each other.

"3G 2100" is 1.9Ghz up/2.1GHz down.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UMTS_frequency_bands


Band I (W-CDMA 2100) in Europe, Africa, Asia, Australia, New Zealand (ITU Region 1) and Brazil (part of ITU Region 2)
Band II (W-CDMA 1900) in North America and South America (ITU Region 2)
Band IV (W-CDMA 1700 or Advanced Wireless Services) in the United States (T-Mobile USA) and Canada (Wind Mobile)
Band V (W-CDMA 850) in Australia, New Zealand (XT Mobile Network), Brazil, Canada, the USA, Venezuela, Costa Rica, other parts of South America, Israel[1], parts of Asia (ITU Region 2 and ITU Region 3), Poland
Band VIII (W-CDMA 900) in Europe, Asia, Australia, New Zealand (ITU Region 1 and ITU Region 3), and Venezuela (Corporación Digitel, C.A.)
 
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coolVariable

Diamond Member
May 18, 2001
3,724
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Coolvariable, please chill out a bit and relax. This is an interesting discussion, IMO, on a confusing topic and there's no need for all-caps obscenities.


There are quite a few 3G bands, and there are likely to be a similar number of LTE bands. You need both an uplink frequency and a downlink frequency and they need to be separated by enough of a gap that the two don't interfere with each other.

"3G 2100" is 1.9Ghz up/2.1GHz down.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UMTS_frequency_bands

Just don't take lightly to people that don't get the point of the discussion.

Check out this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_UMTS_networks

250+ millions subs with 850 and 1900 3G frequencies vs. 34 million with 1700/2100.
OP (and I) are saying the manufacturers (e.g. HTC and Google) are RETARDED for making phones with 1900/2100 or 1700/2100 ONLY.
Based on worldwide subscribers, you get the best coverage/most subscribers with 850/1900/2100. Ideally, phones should have all 3G bands or maybe 850/1700/1900/2100.
And the latest example of idiocy would be google if they sell their unlocked N1 with 1700/2100 which locks it to TMUS in the Americas ... making the phone pretty unusable outside of TMUS in the Americas and Australia.
 
Feb 19, 2001
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You apparently don't get it.
All 3G phones with 850/1900 SHOULD also have 2100.
So the choice is either: 250+ mm subs in the Americas and Australia PLUS the rest of the world OR 34mm subs in the Americas, NO Australia plus rest of world.
AND FUCKING WAKE UP: people in Europe buy subsidized phones too!!!!!!

Well this is the problem with US carriers. They usually want a special version of the phone. The Verizon and T-Mobile Touch Pro 2s are different. AT&T gets a whole new Touch Diamond 2. HTC's nice enough to go out and make these specialized devices. But realize it slows down how things are done. Touch Pro 2 and Touch Diamond 2 were out MONTHS before they made it to US carriers.

Put yourself in the shoes of a phone manufacturer. Somehow and for some reason there's no affordable quadband UMTS chip out there. The iPhone gets it but somehow no one else chooses to go for it. Might be for cost or licensing or whatever issues there are.

So if you had to divert your manufacturing resources out there, would you choose to focus on:

- Europe + Asia and its ~2 billion users on UMTS 2100 OR
- Canada + US (now you gotta pick CDMA which is half the US, or GSM, the other half which splits into a T-Mobile and AT&T faction) + New Zealand + Australia + Latin America

Obviously the first. Is this unfortunate? Yes. I'm waiting for an AT&T Android phone. Sony Ericsson tries to use tri or quad band UMTS frequencies but it also has a terrible history of delays. Yet phone companies like HTC that have hit after hit only make US phones sparingly.

My biggest gripe is really that even if they MAKE US phones, a lot of these are only on the market through your carrier. I'm all for getting people to jump onto the mobile market through subsidies by lowering the cost of entry, but at the same time I would like an unlocked phone market out there like in Europe and Asia. Unfortunately our market is fed by leftover unlocked European/Asian models. I wish we could buy an unlocked Touch Diamond 2 for the US and not have to go to AT&T for the HTC Pure.

I wonder how much AT&T and Verizon spends to customize their phones with their bloatware just so they can charge you for navigation. But at the same time you lose out on precious lead time on such devices and you end up with phones way behind the rest of the world. I wonder if the benefit to them is worthwhile in the end...

Edit: Does anyone know why the US went a separate route in terms of frequencies. It bit us once with GSM850. It hurts more with different UMTS frequencies. Any reason why we're going a separate route AGAIN with 4G?
 
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