Newbie questions about building PC

[leosalchemist]

This is my first build, my prior experience is limited to installing drives, cards peripherals etc. Please bear with me for my ignorance.

1. I'm thinking about getting a pentium 4 system w/ prescott core. I realize that most builder's choose Athlon, I just wonder about the performance comparison. Additionally, is AMD better for future upgrades compared with intel?

2. I've got RAM sticks, sound card, video card, hard drive and other peripherals. Should I buy Anything else besides case (w/ built in power supply), mobo and processor for the infrastructure of the system? I just wonder if I should buy some additional cables, fans, heatsink etc. And for the case, mobo and processor, can I go with OEM to save money?
A few things that caught my eyes at newegg.com are the following:
antec case
intel mobo
P4 processor

3. The power supply in the case aforementioned is 350W. Is it enough if I overclock P4? If not, what would be recommended? How do I calculate how much power is really needed?

4. Should I get a mobo with Extreme Edition processor support? Does it represent the future trend of intel processor? You know, I wish I could get something upgradable.

Your advices, especially on quality, compatibility and pricing will be very much appereciated

..some typo corrected...

 

[RaNDoMMAI]

1. Dont get the prescott. If you notice on newegg, the northward 2.4C is higher price then the 2.6E. this is because the prescott is not that much better if at all and runs alot hotter.

2. Should aim for a gig of ram, if you want to OC, get a good heatsink like a thermalright sp-94, zalman 7000. OEM just means it doesnt come with extras and a fancy box. i buy mostly OEM and bulk.

3. I bet a 300W PSU would be enough for your needs. you want quality over quanity. Like try to get 15A on the 12V line.
altho a 300W PSU will prolly not be enough for the new gen vid cards.

3b. No

~RaNDoM

 

[leosalchemist]

RaNDoM, thanks so much for your help. I didn't notice that prescott was cheaper. It did sound more appealing.

If I get the OEM processor, I'll also buy a good heatsink as you suggested. Should I also buy some mounting brackets, are they sold separately? I just want to get all the nuts and bolts together so I don't have to run back and forth for little things.

If I get 3 or possibly 4 hard drives, should I get a larger power supply?

Is the case mentioned in the first post a good choice?

 

[Gurck]

350 quality watts is borderline for a modern system at stock speeds, especially one with 3-4 hard drives, and overclocking requires more power - You're probably looking at at least 400w for future upgradability at stock speeds, might want to consider 450 or higher for overclocking. Never get a low-quality PSU, regardless of its claimed wattage. Quality is generally judged by brand name. Agreed about Prescotts; get a Northwood p4-C, if you decide to go Intel that is. If you're moving into a new place without a stove though, you might want to buy a Prescott and cook your meals on your rig - overclock it for the 'broil' setting :laugh: IMO any Antec case is a good choice.

 

[newbiepcuser]

Prescott temperature comparison with other cpus.

 

[Gurck]

Heat is heat, and if the OP overclocks as he said he might, the difference would be even bigger. Your point?

 

[newbiepcuser]

Originally posted by: Gurck
Heat is heat, and if the OP overclocks as he said he might, the difference would be even bigger. Your point?

huh?

Just showing him the comparisons that Anandtech did with non-loaded, loaded Prescott etc since everybody was pointing out the temperatures problems with these guys.

 

[leosalchemist]

Is intel mobo good? What should I look in the mobo spec besides the number of slots, ports etc?

 

[RaNDoMMAI]

Originally posted by: Gurck
350 quality watts is borderline for a modern system at stock speeds, especially one with 3-4 hard drives, and overclocking requires more power - You're probably looking at at least 400w for future upgradability at stock speeds, might want to consider 450 or higher for overclocking. Never get a low-quality PSU, regardless of its claimed wattage.

300W is not borderline for modern systems, that is just a myth.

Check out this thread

HERE

There is a person running dualies on a 300W

My 2500OC to 3200 with 2 HDD and 9800 is on a 300W sparkle right now and i gonna switch to a 300W nexus as soon as it comes in the mail.
I dont even think i draw 150W from my system.

But, if you are looking to upgrade to the new gen vid cards. i would play it safe and get more then 300W.

My thermalright 947U came with everything i needed and extra. My antec 3700 came with a bunch of extra screws too.

edit: btw the case, the antec 3700BQE is a better case overall unless you mod the AMB. not sure about intel mobos, check the mid range guide here at anandtech

~RaNDoM

 

[Bovinicus]

Originally posted by: leosalchemist
This is my first build, my prior experience is limited to installing drives, cards peripherals etc. Please bear with me for my ignorance.

1. I'm thinking about getting a pentium 4 system w/ prescott core. I realize that most builder's choose Athlon, I just wonder about the performance comparison. Additionally, is AMD better for future upgrades compared with intel?

The performance of the two processors is very comparable. The P4s seem to be better suited for content creation, media encoding, and 3D rendering. The Athlon/Athlon64 fares quite well in games, general usage applications, and source code compiling. It really depends what you want to use your system for. You should look heavily at the freely available benchmarks all over the major hardware review sites to see which CPU performs better in the applications you use for similar prices.

2. I've got RAM sticks, sound card, video card, hard drive and other peripherals. Should I buy Anything else besides case (w/ built in power supply), mobo and processor for the infrastructure of the system? I just wonder if I should buy some additional cables, fans, heatsink etc. And for the case, mobo and processor, can I go with OEM to save money?
A few things that caught my eyes at newegg.com are the following:
antec case
intel mobo
P4 processor

Don't forget about optical drives. I'm sure you'll want at least a CD-RW, if not a DVD-ROM or DVD-RW drive. As well, a good heatsink/fan combination is essential, especially if you plan on overclocking. Adequate case cooling is also very important. A good case fan or two is essential for overall system cooling. It will also allow you to tailor you system to your needs, be it overclocking or quiet system.

3. The power supply in the case aforementioned is 350W. Is it enough if I overclock P4? If not, what would be recommended? How do I calculate how much power is really needed?

Wattage means very little. If it is a quality 350W PSU, then that should be sufficient as long as you don't have a power hungry video card and 4 hard drives in addition. Crappy 350W PSUs can vary a large degree in terms of actual wattage output.

4. Should I get a mobo with Extreme Edition processor support? Does it represent the future trend of intel processor? You know, I wish I could get something upgradable.

No. Extreme edition CPUs are just overpriced processors that don't yield that great of a performance difference over the standard edition, in most cases.

 

[MichaelZ]

the prescott itself while isn't as hot as it's made out to be, the mofset does heat up significantly when using a prescott CPU.

 

[Gurck]

One person doing something they shouldn't with a low-wattage psu means nothing, it's no myth.

 

[leosalchemist]

Originally posted by: Bovinicus

Originally posted by: leosalchemist
This is my first build, my prior experience is limited to installing drives, cards peripherals etc. Please bear with me for my ignorance.

1. I'm thinking about getting a pentium 4 system w/ prescott core. I realize that most builder's choose Athlon, I just wonder about the performance comparison. Additionally, is AMD better for future upgrades compared with intel?

The performance of the two processors is very comparable. The P4s seem to be better suited for content creation, media encoding, and 3D rendering. The Athlon/Athlon64 fares quite well in games, general usage applications, and source code compiling. It really depends what you want to use your system for. You should look heavily at the freely available benchmarks all over the major hardware review sites to see which CPU performs better in the applications you use for similar prices.

2. I've got RAM sticks, sound card, video card, hard drive and other peripherals. Should I buy Anything else besides case (w/ built in power supply), mobo and processor for the infrastructure of the system? I just wonder if I should buy some additional cables, fans, heatsink etc. And for the case, mobo and processor, can I go with OEM to save money?
A few things that caught my eyes at newegg.com are the following:
antec case
intel mobo
P4 processor

Don't forget about optical drives. I'm sure you'll want at least a CD-RW, if not a DVD-ROM or DVD-RW drive. As well, a good heatsink/fan combination is essential, especially if you plan on overclocking. Adequate case cooling is also very important. A good case fan or two is essential for overall system cooling. It will also allow you to tailor you system to your needs, be it overclocking or quiet system.

3. The power supply in the case aforementioned is 350W. Is it enough if I overclock P4? If not, what would be recommended? How do I calculate how much power is really needed?

Wattage means very little. If it is a quality 350W PSU, then that should be sufficient as long as you don't have a power hungry video card and 4 hard drives in addition. Crappy 350W PSUs can vary a large degree in terms of actual wattage output.

4. Should I get a mobo with Extreme Edition processor support? Does it represent the future trend of intel processor? You know, I wish I could get something upgradable.

No. Extreme edition CPUs are just overpriced processors that don't yield that great of a performance difference over the standard edition, in most cases.

Thanks for the reminder of optical drives and the kindly advices.

 

[Bovinicus]

Originally posted by: leosalchemist
Thanks for the reminder of optical drives and the kindly advices.

Not a problem. There's always some anxiety and questioning involved when building a PC for the first few times. I'm glad to alleviate that in any way I can.

 

[leosalchemist]

Originally posted by: RaNDoMMAI

Originally posted by: Gurck
350 quality watts is borderline for a modern system at stock speeds, especially one with 3-4 hard drives, and overclocking requires more power - You're probably looking at at least 400w for future upgradability at stock speeds, might want to consider 450 or higher for overclocking. Never get a low-quality PSU, regardless of its claimed wattage.

300W is not borderline for modern systems, that is just a myth.

Check out this thread

HERE

There is a person running dualies on a 300W

My 2500OC to 3200 with 2 HDD and 9800 is on a 300W sparkle right now and i gonna switch to a 300W nexus as soon as it comes in the mail.
I dont even think i draw 150W from my system.

But, if you are looking to upgrade to the new gen vid cards. i would play it safe and get more then 300W.

My thermalright 947U came with everything i needed and extra. My antec 3700 came with a bunch of extra screws too.

edit: btw the case, the antec 3700BQE is a better case overall unless you mod the AMB. not sure about intel mobos, check the mid range guide here at anandtech

~RaNDoM

Is Antec the only brand name I should keep in mind for a good PSU?

Also, could you tell me what's the advantage of 3700BQE over 3700AMB? What does AMB stand for?

Thanks again.

 

[mechBgon]

"AMB" stands for Antec Metallic Bronze, the BQE is a quietness-enhanced version of that chassis family, and Fortron, Enermax, Sparkle Power and PC Power & Cooling are some more good brands of PSUs, with "good" being defined as "Forum users find that they are not cheap overrated pieces of junk."

 

[leosalchemist]

Originally posted by: RaNDoMMAI
2. Should aim for a gig of ram, if you want to OC, get a good heatsink like a thermalright sp-94, zalman 7000. OEM just means it doesnt come with extras and a fancy box. i buy mostly OEM and bulk.

~RaNDoM

I didn't look to invest $50+ to heatsink. These two heatsinks you mentioned are real high end. Is it ok to get by with a lesser model? Or I will run a high risk of burning up CPU when I have it OCed.

I also found the Abit IC7-G mobo and it looked appealing. Is Abit reputable? Also, one major complaint for this mobo was the memory compatibility, is this memory compatibility a common problem for all mobos or a sign of low quality for Abit?

 

[ed21x]

Originally posted by: leosalchemist
Is intel mobo good? What should I look in the mobo spec besides the number of slots, ports etc?

Intel motherboards are usually lacking in the flexibility department for overclocking and adjusting voltages. However, they are extremely stable and a great value. In general, all motherboards with the same chipset performs about the same... so I would just look for one with an i875 chipset, as those would give you dual chan. ddr support, and remember to look for intergrated LAN, lots of USB connections on back, as well as lots of USB pins in on the board.

overall, anything by Intel, Asus, and ABit are awesome motherboards.

 

[leosalchemist]

Looks like I'm not the only staying up late.

mechBgon and ed21x,
both of your posts are very helpful.

 

[myocardia]

Originally posted by: ed21x

Originally posted by: leosalchemist
Is intel mobo good? What should I look in the mobo spec besides the number of slots, ports etc?

Intel motherboards are usually lacking in the flexibility department for overclocking and adjusting voltages. However, they are extremely stable and a great value. In general, all motherboards with the same chipset performs about the same... so I would just look for one with an i875 chipset, as those would give you dual chan. ddr support, and remember to look for intergrated LAN, lots of USB connections on back, as well as lots of USB pins in on the board.

overall, anything by Intel, Asus, and ABit are awesome motherboards.

Uh, he said he was probably going to overclock. In case you hadn't heard, nobody has ever overclocked on an Intel motherboard.:roll: I would personally recommend that you get the Abit IC7-G. Of course, the Asus i875-chipset boards aren't bad either.

 

[imported_NoGodForMe]

The way I pick parts is by seeing what systems are used for benchmarks by review sites.
6 months ago, the motherboard of choice on the Intel side was the
Abit IC7 Max3
The other board you can look at is the Asus P4C800
Review sites get stuff months ahead of the end user, so by the time you decide to buy, no one is talking about it anymore. But that doesn't mean you can't buy it. The IC7 is a great board, I have it.

On the processor, a 2.8c or 3.0c is fine. I went with 3.4c, the little c means Northwood, and I would stay away from Prescott because of the heat issue. Northwood also runs just as fast as Prescott. The MBs I told you about are Prescott ready so you have an upgrade path if you want to try those chips.

The case? I went with the Antec P160WF which has a clear side.
Power Supply? You can probably get by, but the Antec True Blue 480 is nice.

If you are going to OC, then you need a nice heatsink. I went with the Thermalright SP-94.
Again, you'll find reviews for it 3 months ago because it was the best thing going. Now all the heatsink reviews are for the new Coolmaster Hyper6 which is huge and doesn't fit on the IC7 unless you drill holes. Stay with the SP-94, it's great.

 

[leosalchemist]

How is this case. Good Price / Value, is thermaltake reputable for power supply?

Thermaltake Silver XASER III LanFire ATX MID Tower Chassis with 420W power Supply for $120 shipped

 

[Markfw]

BTW, you never said what applications you are going to be using ?????

 

[leosalchemist]

The most demanding tasks are mathematical calculations, double precision. I heard pentium is good for float number calculations. How does AMD stand for this type of apps?

 

[Mik3y]

amd actually does it very well, though intel is a tad bit faster on their calculations from the benefit of its hyperthreading, but all in all, i think the athlon cores do it fine because of its increased bus speeds, which increase its data rate of transfer. it just depends on whatever floats you boat.