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LikeLinus

Lifer
Jul 25, 2001
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It does make sense to compare if you have a space for a desktop, or cloud data services and a decent internet connection. You can then use a MBA if you like Mac, or a Surface or other ultralight on travel, log in and do your serious work and have the resulting render etc available in completed form via your Egnyte or SharePoint or your preferred cloud storage service.
So the expectation is to upload around 1TB of content pulled from CFast cards that you use during a days shoot. Then do some "cloud computing" on 4K footage while on a hotel connection in, say, France?

Interesting. Sounds efficient.
 

Arkaign

Lifer
Oct 27, 2006
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Truth be told, I was usually issued a disgusting old Panny Toughbook on assignments, and not a surplus of power to be had. Can't complain about their durability though.

Now that I get to choose, I definitely wouldn't take any fragile device designed primarily for looks, and designed to be deliberately obtuse to work on, from a company who viciously fights independent repair. Inexusable considering they don't even do a good job themselves.


Rossman has pretty much nailed shut any lingering respect I once had for Apple.
 

LikeLinus

Lifer
Jul 25, 2001
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Yeah, I've read about Louis Rossmann. He's been caught several times making things up and doing so weird things. He has his agenda, so I can't really take him serious. But people can have their own opinion, that's fine.

I will say, I've never had my MacBook Pros fail on me. I wouldn't call them "fragile", but I can get why people would think that. Mine has been all over Asia, Europe, Latin America, US and Canada. 2-3 week trips at a time a few times a year. That said, I also take my Dell and haven't had it fail me either. I can't complain.
 

Arkaign

Lifer
Oct 27, 2006
20,565
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Yeah, I've read about Louis Rossmann. He's been caught several times making things up and doing so weird things. He has his agenda, so I can't really take him serious. But people can have their own opinion, that's fine.
LOFL, ok now you've lost all credibility. 'I've Read' .. "People Say", classic BS of the first order. Prove it, or you're just someone 'making things up'.

He's gone head to head with industry lobbyists in endless right to repair litigations, all publicly viewable, and you can bet your bottom dollar if he had any skeletons of making things up, Apple et al would JUMP on the chance to discredit him.
 
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DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
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AMD Ryzen 7 3750H is the highest I find.
Yeah, about that. Welcome to 2020?


45W


35W


15W

Take your pick!
 

Arkaign

Lifer
Oct 27, 2006
20,565
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Otoh, I can actually post links of Apple lying to their customers, both in store, and on their website. Lies that actually prevent people from knowing they CAN get data back from damaged devices. Or lies that would lead people to spend $1k+ on replacement when they can fix an apple design failure for less than a tenth the cost.
 
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DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
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By the way

we're going wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy off-topic. Unless OP comes back I would say we aren't accomplishing much here.

@tushardehra

If you're willing to consider AMD chips, look at the 4000-series chips later this year. Otherwise I would not highly recommend Comet Lake-S (10-series chips from Intel) over Coffee Lake (9900k, 9900ks). The next big thing from Intel comes in 2021. If you must have Intel, there you go!
 

LikeLinus

Lifer
Jul 25, 2001
10,825
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LOFL, ok now you've lost all credibility. 'I've Read' .. "People Say", classic BS of the first order. Prove it, or you're just someone 'making things up'.

He's gone head to head with industry lobbyists in endless right to repair litigations, all publicly viewable, and you can bet your bottom dollar if he had any skeletons of making things up, Apple et al would JUMP on the chance to discredit him.
Otoh, I can actually post links of Apple lying to their customers, both in store, and on their website. Lies that actually prevent people from knowing they CAN get data back from damaged devices.
I said there are a lot of things I don't like about Apple. But that doesn't mean I haven't had great reliability with their laptops. I don't know the guy, I just saw some post about him on Reddit where he was caught lying or implying things that were untrue. It's kind of odd you say "classic BS". One person's word against others. Who knows who is right. I just know my first hand experience with said products. That's all.
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
16,654
5,672
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NM, off-topic.
If you really want to know!


And yes, off-topic. @tushardehra is not in the market for a laptop.
 
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Arkaign

Lifer
Oct 27, 2006
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I said there are a lot of things I don't like about Apple. But that doesn't mean I haven't had great reliability with their laptops. I don't know the guy, I just saw some post about him on Reddit where he was caught lying or implying things that were untrue. It's kind of odd you say "classic BS". One person's word against others. Who knows who is right. I just know my first hand experience with said products. That's all.
Fair enough, at the end of the day what works for you works for you. I hope it continues to do so. Just pays to be aware of how they do business and their priorities in engineering vs marketing, and how their design and service philosophy is dictated.

For example, if you're in a situation like you describe, in a remote place with bad internet upload, you may find yourself with a wealth of data and work hours on your device. If the laptop, iPhone, or iPad gets damaged (aggressive baggage handler, room service knocks it off a table, girlfriend spills wine on it, whatever) : Apple store and support site/phone techs will INSIST that there is zero way to recover data. They will INSIST that there is no way to repair it in most cases, and even in cases where they do offer a service, it is nearly invariably tied to a replacement and complete loss of data.

It's extremely dishonest, as even shown on news investigation pieces, you can indeed get repairs done, and your data recovered, with the correct procedures. Apple's response is to continue lying to their customers faces about it, and censoring any factual posts on their forums about it. It's kind of mind blowing in the audacity of it all.

It's exactly like if BMW, to speak of the car analogy you brought up, told someone with a 2019 M5 that their car was trash after their starter motor failed. Sorry, you need a new one, not covered by warranty, you drove through a puddle! Meanwhile repair expert over here around the corner is like WTF mate, here's a replacement starter, $189 instead of $100k.
 

LikeLinus

Lifer
Jul 25, 2001
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Don't really want to continue going off-topic. But if you're in a remote place, chances are it's going to be hard to find a place to get it fixed and communication isn't always the easiest.

Rule #1 of travel work. Backup, Backup, Backup. I carry 4 large SSD drives and a few Samsung T5. I have duplicate backup of all work on two sets of drives.I never keep work on the C drive of a computer.

If my laptop failed and I have no way to fix it, I walk into a store and buy a new one. The single most important thing in this scenario, the data.

You have to plan all of this out. If you're out on a trip that is several weeks long and cost the company 30k, spending 2k for a new laptop is a no-brainer. Work smart.
 
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maddie

Diamond Member
Jul 18, 2010
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Don't really want to continue going off-topic. But if you're in a remote place, chances are it's going to be hard to find a place to get it fixed and communication isn't always the easiest.

Rule #1 of travel work. Backup, Backup, Backup. I carry 4 large SSD drives and a few Samsung T5. I have duplicate backup of all work on two sets of drives.I never keep work on the C drive of a computer.

If my laptop failed and I have no way to fix it, I walk into a store and buy a new one. The single most important thing in this scenario, the data.

You have to plan all of this out. If you're out on a trip that is several weeks long and cost the company 30k, spending 2k for a new laptop is a no-brainer. Work smart.
We really do deserve what we get.
 

mopardude87

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2018
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I want the most powerful processor for gaming period at the end of this year, not even going to care if i need to run water with it for the first time i will. Got insane cpu bottlenecks with most of my games with my 1080ti at 1080P on this freesycn monitor. :) Will be worst if i get Ampere next year if i decide to run RT for the first time then still have insane bottlenecks with non RT titles.
 
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Arkaign

Lifer
Oct 27, 2006
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I want the most powerful processor for gaming period at the end of this year, not even going to care if i need to run water with it for the first time i will. Got insane cpu bottlenecks with most of my games with my 1080ti at 1080P on this freesycn monitor. :) Will be worst if i get Ampere next year if i decide to run RT for the first time then still have insane bottlenecks with non RT titles.
Then you find yourself one of the rare few where an OC 9900KS (for now) is the best option, particularly if you pair with extremely fast low latency Ram. I got an extra 2-3% in some CPU limited situations by just going from 3733@3800 CL15 to DDR4-4000 CL15 @ 4200.

Even at stock, the 9700/9900K/KS are the fastest high refresh gaming GPUs. When power and thermals are not an obstacle, once overclocked to 5-5.2Ghz with no AVX offset, it becomes brutally fast. However, still not fast enough. I'm *still* CPU bottlenecked before I can run just anything at 144hz 1440p, even if I turn my 2080ti OC down to 1080p minimum settings. We simply need faster CPUs.

It's extra aggravating, because my 3700X across the room is superior in basically EVERYTHING else, especially in terms of efficiency. If Zen 4000 series desktop releases and surpasses the CL or 10th gen i9 for high refresh gaming, I'll be relieved to drop back to a single AIO workstation instead of splitting my time.

PS : don't use water-cooling, it's simply not worth it. Regular AIOs, even 360mm Rads can't meaningfully outperform a twin fan DH15U setup with low rpm fans, let alone a DH15U Carbon with three faster fans. Just make sure your case has room for it, and the 15 will do what it does for me : 5.2Ghz and sub 70C even on burn in power virus testing, and usually sub 58C gaming, sub 40C desktop use.

Custom loops or subambient liquid nitrogen etc are what you need to beat the best air cooling setups, and that's a headache and a half to be sure. Even with the best custom loop scenario, you might get an extra 100-200Mhz, but still push dangerous 24/7 volts, and LN2 is for the 6Ghz+ suicide runs for YouTuber fame, nothing sustainable.

All that said, what actually does make sense in terms of WC is running one of the 2080ti with the AIO and 240mm rads, or custom blocking an RTX Titan. Seeing as you can't just slap on a Noctua beast onto your GPU, it's where water actually shines vs even the best AIB tri-fan air cooling setups. And without a CPU AIO using up a ton of space with a 360 mil rad, you have more options on how to set up the GPU rad.
 
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mopardude87

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Then you find yourself one of the rare few where an OC 9900KS (for now) is the best option, particularly if you pair with extremely fast low latency Ram.
I thought about it as i only browse forums and fold on the pc as well game. Not gonna matter all that much even this 7700k is beyond fine for general usage and its good enough for gaming . The extra grunt of like a 9900k/10700k will be enough MAYBE but waiting for 4000 series before i pick anything. I think 4000 series will destroy even a 10700k. Dang confident of it and i will have the funds perfectly up in line to snag one up right at release. :)
 

mopardude87

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2018
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I would be surprised if AMD didn't have the fastest gaming CPU by the end of the year.
I play nothing that stresses out my 7700k even, i just want the new cpu to help the 1080ti produce more 1080p frames so i could move to a 240hz monitor as well :)
 

mopardude87

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2018
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I would be surprised if AMD didn't have the fastest gaming CPU by the end of the year.
I play nothing that stresses out my 7700k even, i just want the new cpu to help the 1080ti produce more 1080p frames so i could move to a 240hz monitor as well :) Almost willing to wait till 5000 series even perhaps idk. No real pressure right now :) Unless a new BF title or something gets my interest.
 
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Arkaign

Lifer
Oct 27, 2006
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I would be surprised if AMD didn't have the fastest gaming CPU by the end of the year.
It's extremely possible. Especially if they have a unifed 'gamer' edition. I think the IF is probably the only thing holding even Zen2 from dominating the area already. Nothing else makes much sense, since basically 99% of everything runs better than on Intel already.

Also on that note, the extra cache from Zen+ to Zen2 made an ENORMOUS difference in Counterstrike. I don't think that's a coincidence, CS is an oooold game. The core executable is just 4.93MB, and basically the entire game engine can fit on the nice cache of Zen2. This gets neatly around the latency and split die via IF phenomenon. Intel non monolithic setups also get punished in high refresh gaming for similar reasons.

But if 7nm+ Zen3 has a model of just an 8C/16T with further evolution in core performance and clock speeds, all on one die without dealing with IF at all, it would absolutely shatter Intel in gaming.

More split chiplet + IF, idk. I think that might limit what could be accomplished no matter how good the CPU cores themselves are. It isn't really debatable that Zen2 core for core is already superior to CL, but gaming seems to hate added latency, whereas 99% of apps really don't care, a few extra dozen milliseconds doesn't matter in predictable serialized loads, just ones that are constantly being juggled live based on erratic input and output variables.
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
16,654
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But if 7nm+ Zen3 has a model of just an 8C/16T with further evolution in core performance and clock speeds, all on one die without dealing with IF at all, it would absolutely shatter Intel in gaming.
IF is going to be a feature of Ryzen CPUs for awhile. Even on Zen/Zen+ where the IMC was housed on the same die, the 8c CPUs still had IF links between CCXs and between a CCX and the memory controller. It's probably going to be the same for Zen3. The trick is increasing IF speeds/reducing IF latency. Also, Zen3 should have a single, unified L3 per CCD instead of seperate L3 per CCX.
 

Arkaign

Lifer
Oct 27, 2006
20,565
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Hmm. In order of importance to AMD from a business perspective, I guess desktop gaming isn't really worth any special attention. Mobile and server are probably bigger and more profitable targets overall, and even if they can't push past the latency issues with IF, it's irrelevant for 99% of tasks anyway. And even for gamers specifically, 99% of those it doesn't matter, virtually all of them either don't have a top end GPU *and* a high refresh VRR display.
 

mopardude87

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Oct 22, 2018
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In other news : m m m mmmm MONSTER!

Wow yeah i am waiting for sure on that 4000 series wow nice. Good things come to those who wait. Better be a heck of a game that warrants me getting a 10700k/9900ks/3700x assuming a game comes out prior to 4000 series. I will prob still wait cause i don't rush into day one games giving the new cliche in gaming is releasing half broken or entirely broken games day one. I could wait on patches and still do a oct/nov upgrade. I only see Cyberpunk2077 and the new Doom as interesting, new Doom has no issues with 4c/8t i believe.

I wait on Black Friday sales, i rarely pay full price for games. Only exceptions were pre orders on BF3 and GTA V respectfully. No regrets and the best games of the decade if you wanna count hours i put into these titles. Black Friday and 4000 series may release close to same time? Gonna be Nirvana buying both same time :) Got entire backlog i wanna pick up if it lands on the sale. Titles even include Bioshock Infinite and Skyrim Se. :)
 

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