New patio outlet, using kitchen disposal circuit?

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mxnerd

mxnerd

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2007
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Disposal is not used 99.9% in the the time frame of 24 hrs.

Can I do this? Is it against the code? California.

I want to add an outdoor outlet under covered patio, on the opposite side of garbage disposal outlet.
 
PowerEngineer

PowerEngineer

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2001
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Not sure about California code, but it's a common requirement that outdoor outlets have GFI (ground fault interrupt) protection. You might want to see if the circuit that your garbage disposal in on has GFI. My garbage disposal runs off a separate circuit from the breaker box; I would have to swap the breaker out for a GFI breaker to do what you're doing.
 
mxnerd

mxnerd

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Jul 6, 2007
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OK.

I know I have to install a GFCI outlet for outdoor area. But do I really have to do the GFCI thing at the breaker level? 15 amp Leviton GFCI outlet is $14, yet GE GFCI breaker costs $40. Also working at main panel make me a bit nervous.

I watched youtube and learned that the outlets connect after GFCI outlet are also protected. So I'm thinking just replacing the disposal outlet with a GFCI one so the outdoor outlet is also protected.

Opinions?
 
N

NetWareHead

THAT guy
Aug 10, 2002
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Regarding GFCI, you need that protection for an outdoor outlet. And Its prudent to put GFCI protection on a garbage disposal switch, something you might touch with wet hands. You can do either a breaker or outlet but it boils down to a matter of convenience. If/when the gfci trips, do you want to go to the panel or reach over to the gfci outlet to reset the trip?

Regarding sharing a circuit, what do manufacturer's instructions say about the disposal regarding wiring to dedicated circuit?

Disposal hard wired or uses a plug? Code says when using hard wired appliances, you cannot exceed 80% of the circuit rating. If the circuit is also wired to loads that can be plugged in/out (e.g. a receptacle) then this factor shrinks to 50%.

Ultimately, your local code and inspector are what sets the rules.
 
mxnerd

mxnerd

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Jul 6, 2007
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I was wrong about current rating, the circuit for garbage disposal is 20 amp.

The disposal is a plugin type, 7.5 amp American Standard ADS-1250 1.25 HP bought at Costco. The manual says nothing about dedicated outlet.

The other problem is the receptacles are shared with dish washer, which I never use but I think I'll do it correctly. The top outlet is for disposal switch, the bottom one is for dish washer, and I found it's on another 20 amp breaker circuit.

Since the dishwasher circuit is the one that's always on, guess it's the one I should connect to the outside.

So I think I have to replace two old breakers with two GFCI breakers?
 
Last edited:
NutBucket

NutBucket

Lifer
Aug 30, 2000
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I really wouldn't bother. Just tap off the dishwasher feed and install a GFCI outlet for the patio. No need to make this overly complicated.
 
NutBucket

NutBucket

Lifer
Aug 30, 2000
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Sometimes the turn-on surge of an electric motor may cause a GFCI to trip. No way to tell unless you try it out.

Yes, I know it's not the surge current but rather the phase imbalance but we don't need to bother with that discussion for this topic.
 
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NetWareHead

THAT guy
Aug 10, 2002
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Not the biggest fan of GFCI for the aforementioned reasons. I have my kitchen fridge on a dedicated circuit and non GFCI. Last thing I need is for it to trip, shut off my fridge and ruin all my food. I know its against code but I dont care.
 
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Aikouka

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
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NetWareHead said:
Not the biggest fan of GFCI for the aforementioned reasons. I have my kitchen fridge on a dedicated circuit and non GFCI. Last thing I need is for it to trip, shut off my fridge and ruin all my food. I know its against code but I dont care.
Click to expand...

I've been looking this up since I'm reworking my kitchen's electrical, and everything that I read said not to use GFCI on the refrigerator for that exact reason. There were also some people that seemed rather annoyed at how bad the NEC is getting with pushing AFCI and GFCI on almost everything. I think prior to 2014, NEC only mandated AFCI in things like bedrooms, but I think they said they were suggested for almost everything now. I think I recall that it wants them used on all fixed appliances, and people were debating over what a "fixed appliance" technically entails. Does it include a garbage disposal because it's attached? Does it include a dishwasher because it's screwed in?

I ended up picking up an AFCI/GFCI outlet that I'll use for the countertop in a serial fashion. The only negative that I saw about them was that they didn't come in multi-packs like standard GFCI outlets.
 
mxnerd

mxnerd

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Jul 6, 2007
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Found this on International Association of Certified Home Inspectors website about garbage disposal:

https://www.nachi.org/garbage-disposals.htm

InterNACHI's Inspection Checklist and Precautions for Testing Garbage Disposals:
  • To test a garbage disposal for leaks, turn it on and run water through it. The water load should be great enough so that any leaks will become apparent. A good way to do this is to close the drain and fill the sink with water before releasing the stopper.
  • While testing a garbage disposal, never put anything other than water through it. Before turning it on, check to make sure there are no objects already in the disposal.
  • Do not attempt to fix a broken garbage disposal (or any other appliance) while performing a home inspection.
  • If a dishwasher is connected to the disposal, make sure that the line that connects them is securely attached.
  • Check to make sure that the garbage disposal is connected to a drain that is 1.5 inches in diameter or greater.
  • Check to make sure that the disposal is provided with an adequate water supply.
  • If the home has a double sink, check to make sure the waste pipe from the disposal has a trap installed.
Wiring Inspection
  • The National Electrical Code (NEC) does not require a garbage disposal to have GFCI protection. GFCI protection for this appliance is optional.

  • The vibration caused by the operation of a garbage disposal can cause electrical connections to separate. Check for any loose connections in the wire compartment box at the base of the disposal.

  • Garbage disposals should be either hardwired or connected to an outlet through a grounded electrical outlet.

  • A dedicated circuit is generally recommended, although a circuit that is shared with a dishwasher is sometimes appropriate. The best authority on this distinction is the disposal’s user manual.
 
NutBucket

NutBucket

Lifer
Aug 30, 2000
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I can certainly appreciate that you want to do this the right way but you have to be reasonable about it too :)

Plus, there's more than one way to skin a cat ;)
 
mxnerd

mxnerd

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Jul 6, 2007
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Installed Leviton GFCI outlet yesterday and seems working, can't see the green LED light on in daytime at all, however.

In order to see the green LED, it must pitch dark in the night, duh!
 
T

TheBigEarl

Member
May 23, 2013
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Im late to the game, but I'll ask anyway .... did you install with an damp/wet location outlet cover? An inspector / code officer won't know how it's wired up, but they will notice an outside outlet without the required cover..
 
M

Micrornd

Golden Member
Mar 2, 2013
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mxnerd said:
Installed Leviton GFCI outlet yesterday and seems working, can't see the green LED light on in daytime at all, however.

In order to see the green LED, it must pitch dark in the night, duh!
Click to expand...
You sure?
I've installed both types, one's that are lit when working and one's that are lit when not working.
I don't remember which type Levitons are.
 
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