New Haswell Gaming Build

[BlueBomber]

First I'll get the questions out of the way:

1. What YOUR PC will be used for. That means what types of tasks you'll be performing.
Gaming, a small amount of software development, web browsing.

2. What YOUR budget is. A price range is acceptable as long as it's not more than a 20% spread
$1500

3. What country YOU will be buying YOUR parts from.
USA

4. IF you're buying parts OUTSIDE the US, please post a link to the vendor you'll be buying from.
We can't be expected to scour the internet on your behalf, chasing down deals in your specific country... Again, help us, help YOU.
N/A

5. IF YOU have a brand preference. That means, are you an Intel-Fanboy, AMD-Fanboy, ATI-Fanboy, nVidia-Fanboy, Seagate-Fanboy, WD-Fanboy, etc.
No preference. Not a fan of fanboys.

6. If YOU intend on using any of YOUR current parts, and if so, what those parts are.
Two monitors. Possibly an internal hard drive (spinner).

7. IF YOU plan on overclocking or run the system at default speeds.
Will attempt to overclock. although nothing too extreme.

8. What resolution, not monitor size, will you be using?
Main monitor is 1920x1080.

9. WHEN do you plan to build it?
Note that it is usually not cost or time effective to choose your build more than a month before you actually plan to be using it.
End of July.

X. Do you need to purchase any software to go with the system, such as Windows or Blu Ray playback software?
No.

Here are the parts I have picked out so far:
CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K Haswell 3.4GHz $239.99
Motherboard: ASUS Z87-Pro $199.99
Heatsink/Fan: NZXT Kraken X40 $82.99
RAM: Mushkin 16GB (2x8GB) DDR3 1866 (PC3 14900) $144.99
SSD : Samsung 840 Pro Series 256GB $239.99
Hard drive: WD Black 2TB 7200RPM $159.99
Video card: MSI GeForce GTX 760 2GB $259.99
PSU: SeaSonic 550W 80 Plus Gold Modular $79.99
Case: Fractal Design Define R4 $109.99
Total: $1517.91

I'm open so any suggested changes on most of these components, although I would prefer to keep the Define R4 case since I'd like a quieter PC than what my Antec case currently provides.

The only major changes I can think of would be upgrading the video card to a GTX 770, but for 1080p gaming wouldn't a 760 be "enough"? If I did push for a 770, I could possibly cut the WD 2TB drive for now and/or halve the memory to 8GB. The only reason I was thinking of 16GB to begin with is because it's REALLY easy for me to push the 4GB I have in my current system with a game, several Firefox tabs, Office open, etc. Also, I know the RAM is clocked at 1866 vs. 1600 but I saw little to no difference in price so I figured why not? The motherboard is also a bit pricy, but it comes with 802.11n wireless (which I need).

Anyway, $1500 is about as much as I want to spend, but I also don't want to spend money for the sake of spending money, so if I'm being wasteful with any of my component selections please let me know.

 

[Termie]

Welcome to the forums, BlueBomber!

This is actually a very good build - you've done your homework! The only three changes I would make, which could save you some money, are:

1) to drop the Kraken water cooler for a basic air cooler like the Hyper 212 Evo. This is based on your desire to only do mild overclocking. You should be able to hit at least 4GHz without a bigger cooler.

2) skip the 2TB Caviar Black and go with a Seagate. I know Western Digital wants to push you to Black by not selling a 2TB Blue, but honestly, there's absolutely no reason to spend that much money on a 2TB drive at this point in time. It isn't significantly faster than its $100 competitors.

(3) skip the DDR3-1866. I'm a fan of 1866 memory generally, as it does provide some benefit, but not at the current price. RAM prices have gone through the roof, and DDR3-1866 is finally starting to pull away from DDR3-1600 in price, making it a really bad deal. Stick with DDR3-1600 at around $120.

By the way, the Z87-Pro is an excellent board, but it really isn't necessary - you could save $100 going with the Z87-A in this combo deal: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboD...=Combo.1387103

A nice 802.11 dual-band USB adapter will only cost about $30, so I wouldn't buy that motherboard just for the wireless.

And yes, the GTX 760 is awesome at 1080p. Save the money for your next GPU upgrade a few years from now!

 

[lehtv]

Pretty much what Termie said.

SSD $240 for 256GB is quite bad... as you don't need the Pro for your uses. Just get the regular 840 for $165-175
GPU Yes the 760 is good but with the above changes you can get a better GPU, like MSI 770 for $400

 

[Essence_of_War]

Will attempt to overclock. although nothing too extreme.

But you want a watercooler?

I would get this sick bundle:
Asus z87-A and i5-4670K for $340
The z87-Pro is a sweet MoBo, but it's def overkill for a single-gpu set-up.

Combine with this:
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($29.99 @ Newegg)
Memory: Corsair XMS 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($49.99 @ Newegg)
Memory: Corsair XMS 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($49.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Sandisk Ultra Plus 256GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($169.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($92.80 @ Amazon)
Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 770 2GB Video Card ($409.99 @ Amazon)
Case: Corsair 500R White ATX Mid Tower Case ($74.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: XFX 750W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($54.99 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($16.99 @ Newegg)
Total: $949.72
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-07-11 16:36 EDT-0400)

And you're at $1290, under budget, with some room for extras!

Notes:
1) I went with the Carbide 500R over the R4 because the Carbide is on a sick deal right now, but so is the R4!

2) You can get 770s for a few dollars cheaper, but I typically like the dual-fan over the reference cooler. Although I've heard the ref cooler on the 770/780 is quite good.

3) PSU is a little overkill, but it's a sick deal, and it's a SeaSonic design that normally retails for quite a bit more.

4) WD makes fine HDDs, but the mark-up on the blacks seemed kind of obscene.

Edit:

You actually have ~$210 left in your budget. If you're feeling saucy, you could probably get to a 780 if you'd like. The reference cooler 780 is ~650, so if we find $40 in additional savings, you could get there. It's probably overkill for 1080 gaming, but it's worth mentioning

You could take a modest SSD downgrade, checking out the Seagate 600 Series 120 GB SSD, saves you $60 over the 256GB sandisk ultra, and that gets you to the 780 if you'd like.

 

[Termie]

Actually, get the 4670K with the ASRock Extreme6, for $350 ($80 off): http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboD...=Combo.1386757

This is a brand-new discount just released this afternoon. And the Extreme6 includes 802.11ac, so it really is a great deal for you.

 

[BlueBomber]

Thanks to everyone who replied.

1) to drop the Kraken water cooler for a basic air cooler like the Hyper 212 Evo. This is based on your desire to only do mild overclocking. You should be able to hit at least 4GHz without a bigger cooler.

But you want a watercooler?

OK, that's my fault probably since "extreme" is pretty subjective. To me an extreme overclock is something like 4.4GHz+. The reasons I picked the X40 was because I had heard that the Hyper 212s weren't having much luck pushing the new Haswell K-series chips over 4.1GHz without a big voltage increase, and also since the computer will reside in a room in SoCal that doesn't have air-conditioning, a closed-loop cooler might be a safer bet. So if you feel I could (for example) hit a 4.1 or 4.2GHz overclock in a room where the ambient temperature might be 90 degrees F (32 C) with a more conventional air-cooled HSF, then yeah that would be worth looking into.

By the way, the Z87-Pro is an excellent board, but it really isn't necessary - you could save $100 going with the Z87-A in this combo deal: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboD...=Combo.1387103

Actually, get the 4670K with the ASRock Extreme6, for $350 ($80 off): http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboD...=Combo.1386757

Yeah, I agree that the Z87-Pro is probably more than I need, and I didn't realize that wireless adapters (even PCI-e ones) had gotten down to around $30. How reliable is the ASRock brand? I honestly haven't ever owned any of their stuff before.

Essence_of_War - Looking at the RAM you linked, I noticed the CAS timings were slower (11-11-11 vs. 9-9-9). Would there be any real-world perceivable difference from a user standpoint?

Thanks for the tips about the deals on those cases!

 

[mfenn]

Actually, get the 4670K with the ASRock Extreme6, for $350 ($80 off): http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboD...=Combo.1386757

This is a brand-new discount just released this afternoon. And the Extreme6 includes 802.11ac, so it really is a great deal for you.

Only the Extreme6/ac comes with 802.11ac, that combo is the normal Extreme6. Still a good deal though.

 

[mfenn]

OK, that's my fault probably since "extreme" is pretty subjective. To me an extreme overclock is something like 4.4GHz+. The reasons I picked the X40 was because I had heard that the Hyper 212s weren't having much luck pushing the new Haswell K-series chips over 4.1GHz without a big voltage increase, and also since the computer will reside in a room in SoCal that doesn't have air-conditioning, a closed-loop cooler might be a safer bet. So if you feel I could (for example) hit a 4.1 or 4.2GHz overclock in a room where the ambient temperature might be 90 degrees F (32 C) with a more conventional air-cooled HSF, then yeah that would be worth looking into.

I think you have the overclocking theory a little backwards. You don't increase voltage because of high temperatures. Rather, you increase voltage in order to hit higher clock speeds which results in higher temperatures.

You're right that 4.4 is a little optimistic for a 212+, but that doesn't mean that you need to jump all the way to the X40 (actually, based on the reviews, you might not want an X40 at all). Check out the Thermalright TS-120 (or possibly TS-140, lehtv can probably confirm if it will fit in the R4).

Yeah, I agree that the Z87-Pro is probably more than I need, and I didn't realize that wireless adapters (even PCI-e ones) had gotten down to around $30. How reliable is the ASRock brand? I honestly haven't ever owned any of their stuff before.

Asrock is just as reliable as the big three.

Essence_of_War - Looking at the RAM you linked, I noticed the CAS timings were slower (11-11-11 vs. 9-9-9). Would there be any real-world perceivable difference from a user standpoint?

Nope.

 

[Termie]

Only the Extreme6/ac comes with 802.11ac, that combo is the normal Extreme6. Still a good deal though.

Sorry, good catch.

 

[Torn Mind]

I don't know about Asrock's internal quality control. But my H77M seems to be chugging along fine without it dying or having something that results in "board morbidity"; that is, something that not enough to return it but still makes it less functional that advertised. The real fun feature on my board is that I can set in BIOS to start the computer up by pressing the keyboard button.

Every purchase of computer parts is not 100% certain to be successful; the most a company can do is set a target failure rate and use "good enough" components. Then, it a matter of getting one of the boards that work over one that doesn't.

 

[Essence_of_War]

Essence_of_War - Looking at the RAM you linked, I noticed the CAS timings were slower (11-11-11 vs. 9-9-9). Would there be any real-world perceivable difference from a user standpoint?

Yes, but they're unlikely to be noticeable outside of specific benchmarks. The biggest difference in performance comes from RAM speeds, and specifically, from going to any speed RAM to 1600, and there are some performance increases you can get from higher RAM speeds beyond that.

Here's a thread where I was asking about this, and folks sent me some good resources:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2327230

 

[Cerb]

Asrock is just as reliable as the big three.

TBF, those are return rates, not field failures. That said, the low-end MSIs and ASRocks, (IE, with D-Paks, which IMO, they should have left on even cheaper stuff*), when trying to overclock a good ways w/o a really good chip, and/or trying to run them quiet via slow fans (low CFM, low turbulence, risk of laminar flow), are all I know of that have had any problems at all, and I've yet to have or see one fail, myself.

Also, if you intend to move to 802.11ac fairly soon (there's a big push, so I wouldn't be surprised of routers were pretty affordable within 6 months or so), included adapters could be a nice feature, since good adapters are still $50+, and the included ones seem to be dual-antenna. Not really cheap, but consider that you'd otherwise buy a N for $25-40, then later an AC for the same, whereas with included ac, you'd just need to re-authenticate, after installing the new router. At -$80 for the combo, though, you really wouldn't save anything. Velociraptor combo? Seriously, Newegg? I want to feel sorry for anyone that actually uses such a combo ...

* note for OP: the Extreme6 series has top-notch voltage regulation, so no worries.

 

[BlueBomber]

OK, here's an updated component list:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($229.99 @ Newegg)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($33.99 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: Asus Z87-A ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($149.99 @ Newegg)
Memory: Crucial Ballistix Sport 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($62.13 @ TigerDirect)
Storage: Sandisk Extreme II 240GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($229.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($99.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 760 2GB Video Card ($255.66 @ Newegg)
Wireless Network Adapter: Intel 62205ANHMWDTX1 802.11a/b/g/n PCI-Express x1 Wi-Fi Adapter ($33.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Fractal Design Define R4 (Black Pearl) ATX Mid Tower Case ($79.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: XFX 750W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($54.99 @ Newegg)
Total: $1190.71
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-07-12 13:36 EDT-0400)

If I go with the ASRock it's $10 more, so I'll have to do a comparison of the two boards to see whether what features the ASRock has that I care about (if any). Anand's review of the Sandisk Extreme II seemed to rave about this SSD, and it's slightly cheaper than the 840 Pro.

I'm not too sure about the power supply just because I don't really know what semi-modular is vs. modular, the 750W is overkill for a single 760, and lastly I don't know whether there's a quality difference (in terms of reliability) between 80 Gold and 80 Bronze.

Anyway, that part list is quite a bit cheaper and I could either go for another 8GB of RAM, a 3TB Seagate, or possibly upgrade to the GTX 770, but I really just don't know whether the 770 is worth the extra $150 and if it's overkill for 1080p gaming. I don't necessarily wanna buy something just 'cause "bigger numbers".

I still need to research the CPU cooler a bit more yet.

 

[Cerb]

I'm not too sure about the power supply just because I don't really know what semi-modular is vs. modular

A fully modular supply allows all cables to be disconnected. A semi-modular supply has a few cables, typically the 24-pin power and 4/8-pin +12V, and sometimes PCI-e, permanently connected, like a regular supply.

 

[Essence_of_War]

I'd go with the 770, not close and I'd also drop the extra $10 and get the extreme6.

As far as SSDs go, yeah, Anand raves about the Extreme, but unless you're an actual heavy user, and by that I mean someone who's writing hundreds of GB of each day, or using the SSD as a fast scratch drive for photo/video editing, you're probably not going to see a real-life performance difference from ExtremeII/840-pro vs. UltraPluss/840 non-pro. They'll both boot your computer super fast. They'll both have near-instantaneous application launches. They'll both have functionally 0 seek times. Under gamer use, they'll both be outdated LONG before you reach their write limits. They don't cost the same amount of $.

That being said, you've def got the budget for either, it's not like you're talking about trading down a GPU tier just for a pro-quality SSD.

 

[lehtv]

That being said, you've def got the budget for either, it's not like you're talking about trading down a GPU tier just for a pro-quality SSD.

And that being said, it doesn't mean it makes any more sense to dish out cash needlessly when the gains are zero

 

[Essence_of_War]

I totally agree, I was just trying to end on a more light-hearted note

 

[mfenn]

TBF, those are return rates, not field failures.

Well yes, but there is a correlation. Some noise is to be expected from buyer's remorse and/or stupidity, but I would expect the actual failure rate to be in the same ballpark.