New GPU or YOLO

[Isthissitegood]

First I will get the list of details you guys needs, Second I will list my current build, Third I will post my question and desired answer(s)

1. Gaming PC - wide range of games

2. I am cheap and like bargains. At the same time I am not opposed to buying something expensive if your argument is good enough.

3. USA, amazon/newegg/local retailers for parts (California)

4. No specific brand preference but I only buy NEW and prefer more well-known brands. GPU I want Nvidia only but not concerned with ASUS or EVGA, etc

5. I'll list my build at the end.

6. Defaults speeds - no intention of OC yet

7. 1080p

8. Plan to get parts and use ASAP but I have patience if there is a deal (for example, I can easily wait a month for a new thing to come out that is cheaper and better)

Alright, so I built my PC YEARS ago for around 800$ (got some really good deals and such). I've been able to run every modern game since then on highest settings for the most part with good frame rates. Anyway, here's the list of everything I bought way back then:

ATX Mid Tower Case
8GB DDR3-1600 (PC3-12800) CL9 Dual Channel Memory Sticks (2x 4GB RAM)
500GB Hard Drive (don't worry about this part I will upgrade later)
Thermaltake 600 Watt ATX Power Supply (TR2 Series)
Windows 7 Home Premium SP1 64-bit OEM
EVGA GeForce GTX 560 1024MB GDDR5 PCIe 2.0 x16 Video Card
Gigabyte GA-Z77MX-D3H LGA 1155 Z77 mATX Intel MOBO (I know shh, mATX)
i5 2500k 3.3 GHz (3.7 GHz)
ASUS 23" LCD 1080p (just one)
Let me know if I missed something.

Here's my dilemma: As you can see my GTX 560 is becoming outdated, and I am looking for a replacement. I've heard suggestions for a 970 which is a nice price plus good for future and is imo cheaper and good enough to not get a 980. I've also heard rumors of the 960 that is cheaper but seems not well received. Then there is always a step down and getting cheaper which makes sense to me as well. SO,

In summary, I want recommendations (can be ANYTHING) based on opinion and reasoning.

These are the four options I can see right now:

1. Keep everything because it is good enough. Wait to upgrade in 6 mths when the games really need the technology.

2. upgrade everything because now is the time to do so. It is cheap and you know how to build the crap yourself. Woot! TITANZ Here are my suggestions and pricing:xxx

3. upgrade just the GPU. The i5 2500k will last you but the gtx560 is generations old. Here are two examples of cards and here are the price ranges: xxx

4. Other

Alright there ya go, have at it. I heard you guys like more information than less so enjoy the long post.

 

[nsafreak]

Option #3, your GPU is a good bit behind the times and now would be a good time to upgrade. I would recommend a Gigabyte GTX 970 . Your CPU should be just fine at stock clocks but if you really need more horsepower it's dead simple to overclock a SandyBridge CPU. You may want to consider adding a SSD to your system as a decent 250 GB SSD such as the Crucial MX 100 really isn't too expensive nowadays.

 

[lehtv]

Your 2500K is good enough that with a bit of overclocking, it can take a GPU upgrade and last another year or more. Running a 2500K without any OC is somewhat of a waste of all that potential. The best bang for buck solution here, by far, is to grab a decent cooler like Thermalright Macho (make sure it fits in your case) and OC to around 4.5GHz. That's a good 25-30% boost for just $50 and a bit of reading and BIOS fiddling.

I'm not overjoyed to see a Thermalright TR2 in there, though it's not the worst you could've bought. Since it's years old and about to see some increased power draw, I'd get a new one. EVGA 650G is a pretty nice deal at $60 AR, and has a whopping 10 year warranty. It's not the quietest Gold rated unit in the world but as long as you're sticking to a single GPU setup (meaning, you don't push it too hard), it should be fine.

I definitely like the idea of a GTX 970, it's really a superb GPU. I'd grab an Asus Strix 970, the cooler is great as it turns off when idling and stays quiet and cool when gaming, but doesn't take a crap load of space like the Gigabyte Windforce cooler (which may or may not fit in your case at all).

Since you don't need a motherboard upgrade, you can continue using your current OS installation. However, Windows 10 and DX12 will be out late this year, and Win 7 isn't compatible with DX12, so if you want to enjoy titles that use DX12, you'll have to upgrade to Windows 10. That'd be a perfect time to grab an SSD and start with a fresh OS installation. (And if it makes sense at the time, upgrade your CPU and motherboard as well.) On the other hand, if you feel like you want some more disk performance and need your games to load fast, feel free to grab an MX100 256GB for $110. If your games library is particularly huge, get the 512GB version instead.

That's about it, I'd say

 

[Isthissitegood]

Option #3, your GPU is a good bit behind the times and now would be a good time to upgrade. I would recommend a Gigabyte GTX 970 . Your CPU should be just fine at stock clocks but if you really need more horsepower it's dead simple to overclock a SandyBridge CPU. You may want to consider adding a SSD to your system as a decent 250 GB SSD such as the Crucial MX 100 really isn't too expensive nowadays.

Yeah, this was my first thought as well. 970+SSD+1.5TB Hard Drive.
I would like to hear any other suggestions as well, especially if anyone thinks it is worth getting a cheaper GPU.

(Also, thanks for the OC tip. I'll post a diff thread in the OC forum although I generally just run stock =p)

 

[lehtv]

I don't think a cheaper GPU makes sense unless it's an AMD one. With just 2GB VRAM, GTX 960 would be a bad choice. I have no idea how NVIDIA can get away with that. I had 3GB VRAM for 1080p over two years ago, and I wasn't even close to being an "early adopter".

If you're willing to rethink your brand loyalty, there's a HIS IceQ X2 R9 290 4GB for just $260 ($240 AR). The difference between it and the $100 more expensive 970 is pretty minimal, especially considering what you're upgrading from. Whichever way you go, you nearly triple your framerates. The 290 is a bit of a power hog compared to the 970 though, and definitely warrants that PSU upgrade.

 

[Isthissitegood]

I'm not overjoyed to see a Thermalright TR2 in there, though it's not the worst you could've bought. Since it's years old and about to see some increased power draw, I'd get a new one. EVGA 650G is a pretty nice deal at $60 AR, and has a whopping 10 year warranty. It's not the quietest Gold rated unit in the world but as long as you're sticking to a single GPU setup (meaning, you don't push it too hard), it should be fine.

Yeah, at the time it was a pretty good option. What is the benefit of upgrading that? On the other hand, would it be okay with my current build + new GPU to run my old PSU? I like to look at both sides regardless if one is the obvious better choice or not

Thanks for the quick responses, too. Oh my!

(btw, not saying that I'm going to get it or not, but would appreciate a few amazon links to 970's if anyone has time. For example: http://www.amazon.com/EVGA-GeForce-S...ywords=gtx+970 I have no idea if this is a good price or not because it seems pricey to me)

 

[lehtv]

Yeah, at the time it was a pretty good option. What is the benefit of upgrading that? On the other hand, would it be okay with my current build + new GPU to run my old PSU? I like to look at both sides regardless if one is the obvious better choice or not

Can you clarify whether your unit is the TR-600, TR-600P or the TR2-600P? None of them is anywhere near the standards of the EVGA unit, but at least the TR-600P and TR2-600P have a respectable amount of watts on the +12V and an 80+ Bronze rating, so they might work.

 

[Isthissitegood]

If you're willing to rethink your brand loyalty, there's a HIS IceQ X2 R9 290 4GB for just $260 ($240 AR). The difference between it and the $100 more expensive 970 is pretty minimal, especially considering what you're upgrading from. Whichever way you go, you nearly triple your framerates. The 290 is a bit of a power hog compared to the 970 though, and definitely warrants that PSU upgrade.

Intel MOBO + Nvidia GPU is always nice combo or is that just an old rumor I've kept on to? I've always gone nvidia as well, know very little about AMD tbh.

Also, if I do end up doing the 970 (or equivalent) what should be my expectations as to graphical games (max everything dance around or max then in 1 year medium or etc....)

(Power supply is model: TR2-600NL2NC

 

[lehtv]

What is the benefit of upgrading that?

The benefit to upgrading has nothing to do with performance, but with reliability. The PSU is the backbone of the PC and whether you're a budget builder or an enthusiast, you want to have the absolute best reliability you can reasonably afford. 2500K can draw a lot of power when overclocked, and a GTX 970 will also draw a bit more power than a GTX 560... to me, it makes sense to upgrade the unit to something I know for a fact can handle the setup in the long term. I would never have picked a TR2 in the first place, and would probably be looking to switch it even if I didn't upgrade anything else. You can still sell it and recover some of the cost of a new unit.

 

[Isthissitegood]

Thanks, I hadn't even considered the PSU. I will look into that.
Also, for GPU....if the gtx960 somehow doesn't suck (revealing details this thurs?), someone let me know.

 

[lehtv]

Intel MOBO + Nvidia GPU is always nice combo or is that just an old rumor I've kept on to? I've always gone nvidia as well, know very little about AMD tbh.

Both GPU brands work perfectly with both CPU brands, it's just not an issue. The key thing to keep in mind when it comes to pairing CPUs and GPUs is that your CPU is fast enough to not bottleneck the GPU. Since Intel CPUs are currently a lot faster than AMD CPUs, high performance gaming graphics cards are best paired with a quad core Intel. AMD CPUs definitely can hold their own with weaker cards though, and can have decent value for budget overclockers and very low budget gamers who don't need a discrete graphics card.

If you've never gone AMD before, maybe now's a first? I dunno, I had a Gigabyte GTX 560 Ti, which was great, upgraded to a Sapphire Radeon 7950, which was also awesome, and now I'm running a GTX 970 which is awesome. No major complaints on either side for me.

Also, if I do end up doing the 970 (or equivalent) what should be my expectations as to graphical games (max everything dance around or max then in 1 year medium or etc....)

Well, it depends on what framerates you're shooting for. If you're one of those who's fine with 30 fps lows and 40 fps averages, then you should expect to be running almost exclusively high/ultra for a long time to come. If you need 60 fps vertical synced averages with minimal FPS drops in every game, then you should already come across games you just can't max out, and should expect to be creeping towards medium settings sooner rather than later.

 

[lehtv]

(Power supply is model: TR2-600NL2NC

OK, so the model number is TR-600, which is basically the worst of the bunch. Doesn't have an 80Plus certification so I have no idea how efficient it's supposed to be, probably hovering around 80%. According to realhardtechx, it's got two +12V rails of 20A and 23A, but the specs don't say what the combined +12V output is supposed to be. Best case scenario, it's 20A plus 23A = 43A = 516W, but that's unlikely because any well constructed dual rail PSU will have much lower +12V output than the sum of the rails' ratings. In this case, I think the unit should be labelled 500W rather than 600W :\

 

[Isthissitegood]

OK, so the model number is TR-600, which is basically the worst of the bunch. Doesn't have an 80Plus certification so I have no idea how efficient it's supposed to be, probably hovering around 80%. According to realhardtechx, it's got two +12V rails of 20A and 23A, but the specs don't say what the combined +12V output is supposed to be. Best case scenario, it's 20A plus 23A = 43A = 516W, but that's unlikely because any well constructed dual rail PSU will have much lower +12V output than the sum of the rails' ratings. In this case, I think the unit should be labelled 500W rather than 600W :\

I've had no problems for years

 

[VirtualLarry]

I don't get the hate for ThermalTake PSUs either. The few that I've had, have been reliable.

 

[lehtv]

I've had no problems for years

Sure, but just because you haven't had any problems doesn't mean it's a good idea to continue using it. With a new GPU and an overclocked CPU, you're going to be pulling more watts than before. It's a unit with no 80Plus certification, poor +12V output and unknown construction quality (though almost certainly much lower than the Super Flower-manufactured EVGA), it's not the sort of unit you should use to power a near-$1K PC in 2015. If you were on a tight budget, it'd be understandable to take the risk and keep it, but you can spend $60 on a new top-of-the-class unit.

I don't get the hate for ThermalTake PSUs either. The few that I've had, have been reliable.

How do you know they've been reliable? They've worked, but the units themselves may or may not have been reliable. Reliability is not something you can necessarily measure at load levels that are much lower than the advertised wattage.

There's no "hate" for Thermaltake here, I'm purely focusing on the TR-600 unit, not Thermaltake as a whole; and I don't "hate" the TR-600. All I'm saying is that a few years old TR-600 may not be good enough for powering an overclocked 2500K and a near-200W graphics card.

 

[sm625]

and a GTX 970 will also draw a bit more power than a GTX 560...

Do you have dating showing this? The numbers I have show the 560 pulling 20 watts more than the 970.

 

[lehtv]

Do you have dating showing this? The numbers I have show the 560 pulling 20 watts more than the 970.

Dating? Not sure what you mean. Data?

On Anandtech Bench, the system with GTX 560 Ti is drawing 24W less (from the wall) than the system with GTX 970 in Crysis 3. GTX 560 Ti is a 170W TDP part, GTX 560 is a 150W TDP part, and since they're based on the same technology, these TDP figures should indicate a real world difference in power draw. Based on this, GTX 970 should draw about 40W more than a stock GTX 560 in intense gaming.

I couldn't find a direct real world power draw comparison between the GPU's, however. Did you find one?

 

[Isthissitegood]

Now that I think about it, I should probably replace my PSU regardless since it has been a few years. Shouldn't a PSU like that be replaced around 4-5 years?

Quick question though, say I get that http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814125685 and a 600-650W new PSU

how is the sound going to be? My current build is pretty quiet, not many fans...

 

[lehtv]

Now that I think about it, I should probably replace my PSU regardless since it has been a few years. Shouldn't a PSU like that be replaced around 4-5 years?

That sounds about right, but it's just a rule of thumb. Some units like the EVGA one, or any other unit with high quality caps and high efficiency, will be fine well past five years in normal use.

Quick question though, say I get that http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814125685 and a 600-650W new PSU

how is the sound going to be? My current build is pretty quiet, not many fans...

The Gigabyte card is very quiet (as are MSI and Asus), and a new Gold-rated PSU is almost certainly going to be as quiet or quieter than what you have now.

 

[Isthissitegood]

Awesome, thanks lehtv