New Generator Sparking/Arcing

[skimple]

Picked up this inexpensive Buffalo Tools Generator when it was on sale:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Sportsma...ric-Start-Portable-Generator-800517/205613110

It just arrived yesterday. Once I got it assembled, I connected to LP, and it started right up. A bit noisy, but everything seemed fine. After being on for a couple of minutes, I heard a loud snapping/cracking noise. Once.

I started peeking around and it happened again - caught a flash of light from under the engine area. Then it happened a third time. I didn't narrow in on exactly where it was coming from. Figured I better push the kill switch.

So I shut it down, cut the gas, and rolled it into the corner. I've called Buffalo Tools, but they said "they'll get back to me".

Lurking around some websites, it may possibly be the brushes wearing in. Maybe no big deal. But I'm not too keen on taking a chance with a 9KW generator arcing to the frame.

Anyone ever had this happen on an out of the box generator?

 

[Stopsignhank]

I am an Environmental Health and Safety Engineer.

My professional opinion is that is bad.

HTH

 

[momeNt]

I'd run that sucker non-stop but make sure to evacuate the blast radius. You got a "they'll get back to me" from the Manufacturer, so any damage caused from them failing to tell you to stop immediately is on them. It's basically a blank check.

 

[GRIFFIN1]

Did you add oil?

 

[skimple]

yes i added oil

 

[Elixer]

I would run it (after moving it away from the house), and see what the on board meter shows.
Do the readings fluctuate at all?

 

[Raizinman]

Buffalo is known for cheap tools and equipment. Most likely a wire or connection is lose. Do some searching and you will likely find it or wait for Buffalo customer support to get back with you they will walk you through some troubleshooting.

 

[BUTCH1]

Buffalo is known for cheap tools and equipment. Most likely a wire or connection is lose. Do some searching and you will likely find it or wait for Buffalo customer support to get back with you they will walk you through some troubleshooting.

Screw that, bring it back to HD and ask for another one, done deal. It's not a car or a house, just return it. I have a small (5K) genny and it's never done any sparking/crackling noises and I loaded it with 4.5K worth of space-heaters to test it's performance, no issues.

 

[BoomerD]

Definitely return it to Home Depot.

(How is this even being discussed?)

 

[natto fire]

Classic you get what you pay for. Even if it wasn't sparking, I'll bet the sine wave produced by that hunk of junk would disturb sensitive equipment.

If the sparking was in the rotor/stator area, then the brushes theory seems likely. All brushed motors will make this arcing, especially when load changes on the shaft. I would personally keep running it and monitor when you see more arcing, depending on the electrical load.

I definitely would not plug anything into it that is looking for a pure 60Hz sine wave, though. My guess is that it has a modified sine wave, and while that works for many electrical loads, it doesn't work for all of them.

 

[BUTCH1]

Definitely return it to Home Depot.

(How is this even being discussed?)

Exactly.

 

[natto fire]

Definitely return it to Home Depot.

(How is this even being discussed?)

For me, if the OP is not used to AC induction motors, and is seeing normal arcing. No reason to go through hooking it up and then return it and then hook it up again and see the same scary sparking in the area where it just might happen.

I'm not going to debate that low cost generators are crappy, but this sounds like said generator doing what it is supposed to do.

I have used thousands of AC motors before, and sparking is just what they do sometimes.

That is all I have to say in my 6 years of electrical experience.

 

[Red Squirrel]

I don't know much about internal combustion engines, but my snow blower does a similar sound when I put the choke on. Maybe it's not getting enough oxygen? Is there a choke on it, try to adjust it to see if it alters this. Also where are the sparks coming from, the muffler area or the coil area? Ex: is it sparks from the combustion or sparks from the power being produced? If it's a brushed motor it could be the brushes just need some time to get "broken in".

I'm just guessing though, so I could be wrong.

I too would be curious about what kind of sine wave these cheaper generators produce, I kinda like the idea of having a cheap propane generator for emergency use, but it would need to be producing a good enough sine wave that the UPSes around the house can safely let it through and not keep tripping back and forth to battery. I'd probably be better off spending more to be safe.

 

[skimple]

Finally got a call back from Buffalo Tools, which was no help. They said to check and make sure the spark plug boot isn't cracked or loose, and other than that - exchange it for a new one.

The reason that I didn't just take it back to HD is because it weighs 200 lbs. I would prefer not to have to muscle this thing into my truck only to find out that I have to go through the manufacturer first to get an RMA number.

Hooked it up again last night, and put a camera underneath it recording video. Turned it on and let it run for 20-30 minutes. Never made the noise again. This makes me think that it may have been the brushes breaking in.

I'm more familiar with DC motors, but I have worked with AC motors. I understand that there can be some arcing, but I've never observed it in a portable generator. So far, no other generator owners that I've talked to have seen this either.

HD called me back late last night, so I am going to talk to them today and see if they will bring out a new one and pick this one up.

 

[ultimatebob]

Doesn't Home Depot have a rule saying that they will not take back generators once they have been run, in order to protect themselves from the morons who start them up without putting oil in them?

 

[boomerang]

Doesn't Home Depot have a rule saying that they will not take back generators once they have been run, in order to protect themselves from the morons who start them up without putting oil in them?

Maybe that or because of the people that "buy" them when there is a power failure of a long duration and then return them afterwards.

 

[BoomerD]

Doesn't Home Depot have a rule saying that they will not take back generators once they have been run, in order to protect themselves from the morons who start them up without putting oil in them?

There's nothing in their "official returns policy" about it...

Gasoline powered equipment may only be returned within 30 days of purchase. After 30 days, item may be sent out for repair at the customer's expense, unless covered under warranty

And from the page provided by the OP:

Returnable 30-Day

 

[steppinthrax]

HD's policy on generators and power equipment (engine type) is non-returnable. They will repair it, but not actually return it.

At least that is every HD i've been too.

Too many people buying a gen in time for a storm to return it after the storm.

 

[steppinthrax]

There's nothing in their "official returns policy" about it...



And from the page provided by the OP:

Usually in most store's return policy they have a line that goes something like this.

"We can refuse any return at our discretion".

Pretty much this is a catch all statement that could be used for the serial habitual returners, the general asshole and weird situations where the store simply dosen't want to return a item.....

 

[Mandres]

I would bet that exchanging a defective item for a new one doesn't fall under that umbrella though.

 

[BUTCH1]

There's nothing in their "official returns policy" about it...



And from the page provided by the OP:

Yea, some stores do limit returns on certain items but it's spelled out clearly when you buy that item. An example is Dollar General's policy on space-heaters, they are non-returnable, period. If it's not working you deal with the manufacturer for warranty service. Here in central FL we can get cold snaps that last 2-4 days and a lot of people were buying the heaters then returning them 6 days later. It's fairly easy to take a panel off and disconnect a wire then bring it back with the "it just stopped working" BS. I don't blame them one bit. Fuck the cheap-wad's wanting a free heater rental.

 

[deadlyapp]

In the broadest terms, utilizing a generator includes running a little edge-mounted petroleum motor that creates power; the electrical yield would then be able to be utilized to run apparatuses, digging tools and other hardware through reasonable expansion leads. Utilizing convenient generator yield isn't equivalent to utilizing homegrown mains supply. What's more, obviously, safe activity should consistently be your main concern; if in any uncertainty about how to work securely, consistently ask your retailer or counsel the maker.

Thank god for your wisdom.

 

[Scarpozzi]

All the generators I've ever run were too loud to hear snapping or popping. If you're hearing arcing, I'm gonna suggest that's a bad thing. Simply put....you've got a fuel source (gasoline or LP or NG...whatever it runs on) and all three of those are combustible with just a spark.

Generators are known to catch fire. I've also seen damaged ones at Lowe's for sale where people overloaded them and essentially overheated the wires in the circuit and melted the plastic receptacles on the front..... (I assumed it was user error and not manufacturer's error in those case) I suggest if you test, you're better off testing with LP vs gasoline because the fuel is going to be protected in the cylinder and it's less likely to explode.

But...if you do have the option to take it back to store, do this if support doesn't help. You may have to argue with a store manager over the return, however. In recent years, I tried to return a reciprocating saw that died. HD claimed that the tool was used and has a repair center in-house. If you're wanting to exchange it, you may be better off going the refund route off the bat rather than giving them an opportunity to ship it out and back...unless you're willing to wait. YMMV...I don't know what they do for generators.

 

[Meghan54]

All the generators I've ever run were too loud to hear snapping or popping. If you're hearing arcing, I'm gonna suggest that's a bad thing. Simply put....you've got a fuel source (gasoline or LP or NG...whatever it runs on) and all three of those are combustible with just a spark.

Generators are known to catch fire. I've also seen damaged ones at Lowe's for sale where people overloaded them and essentially overheated the wires in the circuit and melted the plastic receptacles on the front..... (I assumed it was user error and not manufacturer's error in those case) I suggest if you test, you're better off testing with LP vs gasoline because the fuel is going to be protected in the cylinder and it's less likely to explode.

But...if you do have the option to take it back to store, do this if support doesn't help. You may have to argue with a store manager over the return, however. In recent years, I tried to return a reciprocating saw that died. HD claimed that the tool was used and has a repair center in-house. If you're wanting to exchange it, you may be better off going the refund route off the bat rather than giving them an opportunity to ship it out and back...unless you're willing to wait. YMMV...I don't know what they do for generators.

Since this thread is a 5 year old necro, I'm willing to bet the OP's problems with his new generator have long been solved, one way or another.

 

[Captante]

safe activity should consistently be your main concern

Try connecting the generators outputs to your ears then crank it on up!

What's the worst that could happen?