New Gaming PC

Stublore

Junior Member
Mar 25, 2008
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Basically I am building a new gaming rig, this is the primary consideration for the PC.
Budget between 3300 Euro to @3800 Euro.
As I live in Ireland, I will be buying parts primarily in Europe.
Initially not really interested in OC'ing, but would be nice to have it as an option once the PC is a bit older.
(Although some boards make it very easy these days, so you never know)



1) Power supply:
Thermaltake ToughPower 1000W Modular Power Supply

2)Case:
Thermaltake VD4000SWA LCS Aluminium Kandalf Full Tower - Silver

3Motherboard:
XFX nForce 790i Ultra SLI (Socket 775) PCI-Express DDR3 Motherboard

4)CPU:
Intel Core 2 Quad Extreme Edition QX9770 "LGA775 Yorkfield" 3.20GHz (1600FSB) - Retail

5)Heatsink/fan for CPU: (Watercooled, see case)

6)Memory:
OCZ 2GB DDR3 PC3-14400C8 1800MHz Platinum (2x1GB) Dual Channel DDR3
(OCZ3P18002GK)

7)Primary Hard drive:
2*Western Digital Raptor X 150GB 10000RPM SATA 16MB Cache - OEM Collection (WD1500AHFD)

8)Primary optical drive:

9)Video Card:
BFG GeForce 9800 GX2 1024MB GDDR3 TV-Out/Dual DVI/HDMI (PCI-Express) - Retail

10)Monitor:Keeping present 21" CRT

11)Mouse/Keyboard:

12)O/S: Vista(Not decided between 32 and 64 bit versions yet


Any suggestions welcome/comments welcome.

Unsure about whether to get 1600 DDR3 ram or go for the 1800.
As regards GPU's, kinda prefer nvidia.
May not go with the one above, but definitely want nvidia.
Probably going to get a gaming mouse and keyboard, not sure which ones yet though, but these are somewhat "optional" atm, I want to get the PC specs sorted first.
CPU:Intel seem to have the edge atm for gaming performance, so this is my preference(upgrading from AMD)
Also considering getting a KillerCard, opinions welcome on this :)
 

MarcVenice

Moderator Emeritus <br>
Apr 2, 2007
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What resolution will you be playing at ? I'd probably rather get a Intel Core 2 Extreme QX6850 which I still think is ridiculously expensive, so I'd buy a q9450 instead. Then I'd buy a motherboard that can handle ddr2 ram, with some ddr2 1066mhz ram, like this: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/...701&catid=8&subcat=817

Then the money saved could be spend on a SECOND 9800gx2, or you could actually do TRIPLE sli with the 9800gtx. That will give more performance then a few more mhz on a quadcore, that costs 3-4 times as much as a q9450. I'd rather get a few of these: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/...01&catid=14&subcat=940 instead of raptors, because of higher density platters they will offer similar loading times in games.

Depending on with what videocard setup you go, you could buy a different PSU as well. For tripple SLI you might actually need a beefier one. You could save like 1000 euro though, and only lose 5% of the performance. 1000 euro buys you ONE hell of a nice 30" LCD, probably two :p I know what I would rather have ...

In the end, even for a HIGH-end gaming rig, I don't think you should spend more then 2000 euro.
 

Stublore

Junior Member
Mar 25, 2008
6
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The thing is, I'll probably have this PC for 3 or 4 years, so I want a CPU that will last(performance wise), and DDR2 ram will probalbly not be available/viable in a year or 2, it will all be DDR3.(I got burned last time I got a PC, just a few weeks later DDR2 ram became available and I was/am stuck with DDR ram, I really want to avoid this with the new PC)
MY preferred resolution would probably be about 1600, and I am not really interested in having a huge 30" monitor, I might upgrade to a 24" in a year or so, but 21" seems fine atm.
Interesting not on the HDD, will certainly look into it :)
 

MarcVenice

Moderator Emeritus <br>
Apr 2, 2007
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Let's do some math, allright ? A q9450 will cost 260 euro's, for 2.66ghz. A qx6850 costs 780 euro's, for 3.0ghz, and a qx9770 costs 1100 euro's for 3.2ghz. Sp we're looking at 300% the price for only 10% more speed, or 400% the price, for 20% more speed. That's a WHOLE lot of money, and that speed difference isn't going to make the difference in a year or 2, all 3 of those cpu's will be 'equally' slow. In fact, in 2 years you can buy a CPU for 260 euro's again, and it will totaly blow away that 1100 euro q9770. Those expensive cpu's are only for hardcore overclockers, you won't notice the speed difference.

As far as the ram goes, nehalem won't support DDR2, but as far as I know, you also need a new mobo for nehalem, because of it's integrated memory controller. So if you upgrade in 2 years, to nehalem or westmere ( 32nm nehalem ) you will need a new mobo anyways, and buy than 4gb of ddr3 will be realisticaly affordable, just like ddr2 800-1066mhz is right now. Getting 4gb of ddr3 1600mhz is just a waste of money and the extra 5% speed you get out of it, is once again not worth 5 times the price tag.
 

Stublore

Junior Member
Mar 25, 2008
6
0
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Good points, how about this:
Ram:
Corsair 4GB DDR3 DHX 1600C7DHX Twin3X (2x2GB)

CPU:
Intel Core 2 Quad Extreme Edition QX9650 "LGA775 Yorkfield" 3.00GHz (1333FSB) - Retail

KillerNIC M1 Gigabit Desktop PCI Network Adapter

GPU:
2 * BFG GeForce 9800 GX2 1024MB GDDR3 TV-Out/Dual DVI/HDMI (PCI-Express) - Retail

HDD:
Samsung SpinPoint F1 750GB SATA-II 32MB Cache - OEM (HD753LJ)

O/S:
Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate 64-Bit Edition DVD - OEM - 1Pk (66R-02034)

With the case/mb etc comes to a@3755.





 

imported_wired247

Golden Member
Jan 18, 2008
1,184
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DDR3 is kind of a joke right now. Your CPU speed would have to be much much faster for you to realize any benefit.

The 9800 GX2 is fine, but there's no reason to get a SLI motherboard unless you want to get SLI. You could run the 9800 GX2 easily on a P35 motherboard for well under 100 euros

Save some money on your CPU, get the e8400, DDR2-800 (light or no overclock) or DDR2-1066 RAM (if you are going to overclock heavily), get the SLI mobo with 2x 9800GTX.


There is no reason to get "Extreme edition" processors unless you are getting them for the "unlocked multiplier" in other words, taking overclocks to high levels.
 

MarcVenice

Moderator Emeritus <br>
Apr 2, 2007
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@wired, I tried, but to no avail. If he wants ddr3 etc, then just give him the best suggestions you can.

I'm a poor college student, your CPU is going to be worth as much as my whole rig, so I'm a little adverse to spending that much money on a CPU alone. You toned it down a bit though and if you've got the money and it doesn't mean you can't buy a aston martin and go to the caribeans, then it should be fine, hehe.

The killernic is JUNK btw, several reviews showed it didn't do JACK for online gaming, in fact, in some reviews it was actually slower or used some of the CPU cycles making the overall system slower too. How much does the corsair ram cost btw ? In the end, it's all going to work just fine, so that won't be the problem either. Not overclocking it would be a crime though.

How about doing some watercooling hehe, if I had money to burn that's something I would do.
 

imported_wired247

Golden Member
Jan 18, 2008
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well I'll put it this way...

for the price of DDR3 ram ONLY (no mobo) today, you could buy a DDR2 mobo and 4GB DDR2-800 RAM, then in 2 years you will have enough money left over to buy a brand new DDR3-mobo and DDR3-ram.

DDR3 is not going to be the standard until nehalem (as far as I know) but like MarcVenice said, you will need a new motherboard for that ANYWAY.

You won't get "stuck" with DDR2 ram. It's perfectly fine to purchase today. It's not like my last rig, where I bought an AGP motherboard because everyone said pcie16x wouldn't be popular for a long time... next thing I knew, I couldn't get anymore AGP video cards that were worth a damn

once Nehalem comes out, you might have a reason to spend a bit more on a rig. But today, it's just not worth it. Cap your build at 2000 euros and put a very impressive graphics set up in there, such as 9800GTX SLI


If you ask me, the 2 * 9800 GX2 = "quad SLI" is a joke right now. not enough memory for the higher resolutions, so you're stuck with insane framerates at lower resolutions. the point of getting 4 GPUs should be to game at ultra high res, but this still isn't really possible even for quad SLI


The fact of the matter is, it's your money and you can do with it as you please. But you won't get a single savvy user on this website to endorse buying DDR3 right now.


One last note.... a lot of people spent an arm and a leg not very long ago, just to get DDR2-800. It used to be hundreds and hundreds of $$$. now look at it. It's dirt cheap, and as high performing as ever. DDR3 will follow the same trend eventually. Once it's the standard, it will be cheap. That's all there is to it.
 

Stublore

Junior Member
Mar 25, 2008
6
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How about this for ram?:
2Gb Team DDR2 PC2-10400 (1300MHz) memory kit
http://www.memoryc.com/compute...00mhzthermalright.html

and this CPU:
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9450 LGA775 'Yorkfield' 2.66GHz 12MB-cache (1333FSB) Processor - OEM

Thanks for the replies guys, I do appreciate your comments, even if I do appear a bit pig-headed.
Tbh I am kind of stuck in a "buy the best available components atm" rut, but I am aware that the sensible option is probably to cut back a bit, and get some more reasonable parts, and possibly get the performance I am looking for with for example 2 GPU's and slightly slower ram instead of a more powerful processor and ram.
By any chance do you have a link for those killer card reviews? I was under the impression that it would speed up online play, which is the reason I considered getting it.
 

MarcVenice

Moderator Emeritus <br>
Apr 2, 2007
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No I don't have any links, you could google them though, or ask on the networking or perhaps the peripherals forum. It has been discussed to death allready.

As for the ram, that ram does NOT give any extra speed over the ram I mentioned: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/...701&catid=8&subcat=817

In fact 2x2gb is better then 2x1gb, for simple reasons of course. The q9450 looks good to me :)
 

imported_wired247

Golden Member
Jan 18, 2008
1,184
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That ram is a huge waste, and it's some weird no-name brand.

To use DDR2-1300 to its fullest you would need your motherboard running at 2600MHz FSB. (which is absurd)

Good quality DDR2-800 will still run at FSB 1600MHz and overclock even higher than that, which is faster than even the extreme edition processor, but still clearly faster than the Q9450 which says 1333FSB right on it.

The Q9450 is a good quad for the money.

The absolute maximum you should be spending on RAM is to get some DDR2-1066, and that is way way way more than you need already.

Remember that DDR2-1066 can run at over FSB 2132. there is no guarantee that, even if you want to, you'll be ABLE to overclock your Q9450 to that level.

 

imported_wired247

Golden Member
Jan 18, 2008
1,184
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Here's my final thoughts, before I have to leave

780i motherboard
Q9450 is fine, but it might disappoint in games unless you overclock it to around 3.6GHz
2x2GB (not 4x1GB) DDR2-800 or DDR2-1066 RAM. I would really only get DDR2-1066 if you are going to overclock heavily.
2x 9800 GTX in SLI (you can always get a 3rd one later)
Thermaltake 1000W toughpower is fine. For your purposes, I would definitely stick with 1000W so you have more flexibility with graphics cards.
The samsung 750gb spinpoint drive is fine



Then about 6 months or 1 year in the future, just grab 2 or 3 new video cards and you're good to go for another year.
 

Stublore

Junior Member
Mar 25, 2008
6
0
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Originally posted by: wired247
Here's my final thoughts, before I have to leave

780i motherboard
Q9450 is fine, but it might disappoint in games unless you overclock it to around 3.6GHz
That's a bit worrying tbh. the primary purpose is for gaming, so I might get a better CPU. I have no experience in OC'ing, so it's not something I am confident enough to try atm.

 

MarcVenice

Moderator Emeritus <br>
Apr 2, 2007
5,664
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e8400 instead, games aren't qaudcore optimized. I find wired's statement quite bold though, I think a 2.66ghz quadcore is PLENTY fast in games, it's a blazing fast CPU, not many faster cpu's on the market, and it will dissapoint in games ? How so ? There isn't going to be a game that won't run at full speed because the CPU is to slow.
 

imported_wired247

Golden Member
Jan 18, 2008
1,184
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I meant it would disappoint the overclocking gods, I guess :) I fail at word use.

I know 2.66GHz is fast enough, but I'd still rather have a faster clocked core2 CPU (duo or quad) than a slower clocked one.

So basically Stub... I think we're figuring out what makes the most sense for you... you're the average guy who can build a computer but doesn't want to F*** with it too much, and you have plenty to spend and want plenty of performance at stock speeds.

In that case the answer is clear... e8400

If you do video encoding, sound editing, 3d graphics, etc , then the q9450 would be a good purchase


Remember... every euro you save on something you DON'T NEED and WON'T NOTICE can be applied to more graphics power, which you WILL notice :)

I mean... graphics cards are expensive, but you really notice when you get a good one. Wouldn't you like to put some of that money in the bank so you can upgrade as soon as something new like the GT200 architecture comes out?
 

Pabster

Lifer
Apr 15, 2001
16,986
1
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DDR3 prices are coming down, guys. If he wants the latest and greatest, it's DDR3. We're all going there eventually.

QX9770 is a beast. I like your style :laugh:
 

Roguestar

Diamond Member
Aug 29, 2006
6,045
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Oh wow, someone seriously considering the Killer NIC, and not joking about it. You bring shame on our country! :(

Wired247's third last post was right on the money.
 

damien c

Junior Member
Apr 9, 2008
1
0
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in my oppinion anyone who is considering a qx9770 for a gaming pc is abit well frankly stupid as it, is heavily overpriced.
here is my complete setup:

Intel q6600 @ 3.0ghz 25% increase over stock.
Articooling Freezer Pro 7 hsf.
Asus formula striker 2 780i mobo.
4gb ocz reaper ddr2 800mhz 4-4-4-15 2t ram.
2x Evga 8800gts's sli'd.
Enermax noisetaker 600wt psu.
coolermaster dominator 690 case.

now i can play all my games maxed out on a goodmans 32" hd ready tv, @1366x768,
except for crysis i run that at the same resolution on high just not ultra high, i've not tried ultra high yet but i reckon it will run it on ultra high as i get 50-60fps even when in a big fire fight. i can convert a avi file to dvd using nero vision in 30 mins and that includes burning to the dvd disc.

really you could save almost atleast 500+ euros by getting the q6600 and 4gb of ddr 2 800 or above ram, and as it has been mentioned there isnt any games yet that use all 4 cores yet and, also if you insist on spending that sort of money buy yourself 2x 9800 x2's as this will give you quad sli and then when you feel that the cpu can no longer cut it which to be honest is going to be atleast 2 years, then you can change it. the only thing i am going to change in mine is the graphics cards as these will be the only thing that let me down now. if you are watercooling your pc then make sure that you w/c the north bridge as these run really hot mines runs at about 75c. also make sure if your going to o/c then you really do need to think about this the 9770 has a 1600 fsb if you get a mobo that will max out at 1600 then your not going to be able to overclock, as far as im aware. seriously save money on your cpu and mobo then spend it on the graphics cards as you can o/c the cpu for extra performance. seriously why pay say 1000 euros for a cpu when you can get one that costs about 200 euros that can be o/c'd to the same if not higher speeds for a saving of almost 5x the price, the only people who will look at the 9770 are people who have more money than sence or people who, just want the very lastest stuff and in that case they will be changing there comps every sort of 2 months. i understand really that you want to be a little bit more futureproof, but would you rather pay 1000 euros now or wait say a year and get it then or get a better one which is deffo going to be out by then for probablly allot cheaper. thats my oppinion if you choose to listen to it or not then it's up to you as it's your money not mine, but i am happy with my pc plays anything that is on the market and will do for quite a while yet and it only cost me £1400 a friend of mine has one that he bought 6 months ago and mine perorms better than his and it cost nearly £4000