New element discovered! Unobtainium?

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Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
70,646
13,822
126
www.anyf.ca
That's kind of cool. They should be careful though, if they create new elements they might throw off all balance of physical material, and make the entire universe self implode into a void.

God would be pissed. He worked hard on this! :p

Actually I want a desk size particle accelerator. Would be neat to play with in the office.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,866
31,364
146

It's been used for many, many years as a description for a hard-to-obtain, resource, perhaps non-existent, the shangri-la of discoveries, if you will.

I think it's more of an economic term than one used among physicists to describe an actual element, iirc.

It may not be an official word, but Cameron used it in Avatar as an homage to how it has been used in thinking-head type niche groups for decades.

will look up useful reference now...

well, that didn't take long. too obvious, I guess.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unobtainium
 

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
Even if they're very stable, they're still not found naturally which means that they're either not that stable or not produced as part of some sort of stellar mass ejection, right?

Still very cool. I'm not one to piss on an idea because we have no practical way to produce in quantity on the horizon - the discovery itself is fascinating to me. But the conclusion of the article is kind of reaching, or just looking waaaay down the road.

Well everything we discover, it takes a little while to actually put that discovery to practical use. But interestingly enough, when it comes to atomic discoveries, practical application rapidly follows discovery. Rapidly as in, a few decades at most.

Unless we're talking extremely ancient terracotta pot type batteries as representing the discovery of electricity/electrons... because if we recognize that as an actual atomic discovery, then some discoveries might take a few hundred or thousand years to benefit everyday life. :D

However, I'd say elements in a supposed island of stability, if it exists, would also mean these elements ARE to be found somewhere in the universe. In a significant, discoverable quantity? Who knows, not very likely. Most atomic matter consists of the far more simple ones. The more complex the atom, the less of it exists in the universe. Simple concept.

That means elements that are stable with a very high atomic number, after elements that are not stable at all... would likely mean their natural existence is unimaginably rare but also very likely to have been formed in natural conditions. If we can form it, the early universe could. We just cannot match the amount of energy that can potentially exist, or at least at one point existed.

But the rarity of any elements in the island of stability would be very rare, to the point that mere atoms of the element likely have a rare chance of being found together in a measurable quantity, if found together at all.
Are we really going to find a invisible (to the naked eye) spec in a unimaginably large haystack? ;)

This, of course, is going with the assumption that such an island of stability actually exists.

Such elements might not be found until we discover 50 more unstable elements. Wouldn't THAT just be interesting? There could even be a number of elements equal to the number stable elements known today that are unstable in increasing atomic number until they begin to return to stability. Might be awhile before we discover such elements if the latter is anywhere close to the truth.

But it would be indescribably amazing if such elements did indeed exist, and with their discovery brought a whole great deal of new information about elemental interaction and of what such elements could be capable.
 

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
That's kind of cool. They should be careful though, if they create new elements they might throw off all balance of physical material, and make the entire universe self implode into a void.

God would be pissed. He worked hard on this! :p

Actually I want a desk size particle accelerator. Would be neat to play with in the office.

"Mr. Bossman? Sorry. This thing just created a new element that proceeded to escape, run amok in my office, and irreversibly contaminate everything in the building."
"No sir, I'm not lying. Everything is glowing."
"No, I can't describe it more. I actually can't see anything."
"Yes I know that doesn't make sense. But neither does this glow."
"You really just need to come take a look at this for yourself."
"Also, it destroyed my clothes."
...later
"Yes sir, I know what I told you. I wasn't lying."
"Fired? Ugh... Well, I'm taking this thing with me. Deduct it from my pay. It just turns out this thing makes an unimaginably awesome atomic elemental drug. And I liked it."
"It was that expensive? Well... IOU. Give me a few weeks, I'll buy you a couple replacements."
 

So

Lifer
Jul 2, 2001
25,923
17
81
All these elements are so bullshit. "ooooh we smashed these two random substances together at light speed and made a new element. It existed for exactly .0000000000000000000000000001 seconds". Bullshit. Nitrogen. That's an element. Xenon, that's an element. Your bullshit fake element that you had to try too hard to get? Not an element. Keep that shit off my periodic table, asshole

Read up on the hypothesized "island of stability" einstein.
 

Chaotic42

Lifer
Jun 15, 2001
34,863
2,027
126
Imagine my surprise that eits would agree with something completely unscientific and contrary to all evidence. Define "element", genius.

I'm pretty sure Matt was joking. Anyway, we need to start cranking out ununpentium so we can fly around like Bob Lazar's aliens.
 

eits

Lifer
Jun 4, 2005
25,015
3
81
www.integratedssr.com
Imagine my surprise that eits would agree with something completely unscientific and contrary to all evidence. Define "element", genius.

imagine my surprise that cocklunch gayner would troll me for no good reason, just because i find it funny and agreeable to an extent that this completely unstable man-made elements should not be considered an element until it can prove its stability and that it can be a building block in matter. so far, they've created an extremely unstable atom and haven't found its island of stability yet. a little too fucking early to call it an element just yet, jackoff.

maybe in your part of new zealand, they didn't teach you not to count your sheep before you fuck them.

Despite an astounding display of ignorance of particle physics, this thread receives an infraction not for that, but rather for the personal attack. -Admin DrPizza
 
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Mike Gayner

Diamond Member
Jan 5, 2007
6,175
3
0
eits said:
imagine my surprise that cocklunch gayner would troll me for no good reason, just because i find it funny and agreeable to an extent that this completely unstable man-made elements should not be considered an element until it can prove its stability and that it can be a building block in matter. so far, they've created an extremely unstable atom and haven't found its island of stability yet. a little too fucking early to call it an element just yet, jackoff.

maybe in your part of new zealand, they didn't teach you not to count your sheep before you fuck them.

LOL, you're a touchy little quack aren't you? Like I said, I'm completely unsurprised that a quack practitioner would disregard science for his preheld beliefs. So it's your opinion (lol @ using the word "opinion" in a discussion of fact) that no man-made or unstable elements can be considered elements? Do you even know what a chemical element is by definition?

Yet another personal attack... yet another infraction -Admin DrPizza
 
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eits

Lifer
Jun 4, 2005
25,015
3
81
www.integratedssr.com
LOL, you're a touchy little quack aren't you? Like I said, I'm completely unsurprised that a quack practitioner would disregard science for his preheld beliefs. So it's your opinion (lol @ using the word "opinion" in a discussion of fact) that no man-made or unstable elements can be considered elements? Do you even know what a chemical element is by definition?

lol, hey, dicknose, explain how i disregarded science? when did i say no man-made or unstable elements can be considered elements?

of course i know what an element is... i practically spelled it out for you in my last post. learn to read. what, didn't they spraypaint letters on the backs of sheep where you're from in order to teach reading while you're fucking them?
 

Chaotic42

Lifer
Jun 15, 2001
34,863
2,027
126
imagine my surprise that cocklunch gayner would troll me for no good reason, just because i find it funny and agreeable to an extent that this completely unstable man-made elements should not be considered an element until it can prove its stability and that it can be a building block in matter. so far, they've created an extremely unstable atom and haven't found its island of stability yet. a little too fucking early to call it an element just yet, jackoff.

maybe in your part of new zealand, they didn't teach you not to count your sheep before you fuck them.

I'm going to regret this, but:

A chemical element is a pure chemical substance consisting of one type of atom distinguished by its atomic number, which is the number of protons in its nucleus.

From Wikipedia.

Now, I think I see your argument, that it being so short-lived, it's not useful in any real way, or something to that effect. That may be true, but it is also true that the 117 which was created fits the technical definition given above and is thus a chemical element.
 

Mike Gayner

Diamond Member
Jan 5, 2007
6,175
3
0
eits said:
lol, hey, dicknose, explain how i disregarded science? when did i say no man-made or unstable elements can be considered elements?

of course i know what an element is... i practically spelled it out for you in my last post. learn to read. what, didn't they spraypaint letters on the backs of sheep where you're from in order to teach reading while you're fucking them?

Woah dude, angry. You need to find your zen place. Is that part of your quack doctorine, or another one? You didn't spell you what an element is in your post above - you invented a definition that has no bearing on reality. Like spinal manipulation.
 
Oct 27, 2007
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science2.jpg
 

eits

Lifer
Jun 4, 2005
25,015
3
81
www.integratedssr.com
Woah dude, angry. You need to find your zen place. Is that part of your quack doctorine, or another one? You didn't spell you what an element is in your post above - you invented a definition that has no bearing on reality. Like spinal manipulation.

first of all, i'm not angry. secondly, i did basically spell it out as being a basic chemical building block of matter. yes, an atom was have been created for an incredibly short period of time under extreme artificial conditions, but that doesn't mean it should be considered an element under the periodic table unless it can be proven to show some kind of stability or composition into matter. i disagree that its stability shouldn't play a role in whether or not it is an element.
 

Gibsons

Lifer
Aug 14, 2001
12,530
35
91
imagine my surprise that cocklunch gayner would troll me for no good reason, just because i find it funny and agreeable to an extent that this completely unstable man-made elements should not be considered an element until it can prove its stability and that it can be a building block in matter. so far, they've created an extremely unstable atom and haven't found its island of stability yet. a little too fucking early to call it an element just yet, jackoff.
lol. Where would this atoms island of stability be found? Just around the nearest particle meridian flux?
 

eits

Lifer
Jun 4, 2005
25,015
3
81
www.integratedssr.com
Woah dude, angry. You need to find your zen place. Is that part of your quack doctorine, or another one? You didn't spell you what an element is in your post above - you invented a definition that has no bearing on reality. Like spinal manipulation.

lol. Where would this atoms island of stability be found? Just around the nearest particle meridian flux?

fuck if i know... i'm not a chemist :)
 

Mike Gayner

Diamond Member
Jan 5, 2007
6,175
3
0
eits said:
first of all, i'm not angry. secondly, i did basically spell it out as being a basic chemical building block of matter. yes, an atom was have been created for an incredibly short period of time under extreme artificial conditions, but that doesn't mean it should be considered an element under the periodic table unless it can be proven to show some kind of stability or composition into matter. i disagree that its stability shouldn't play a role in whether or not it is an element.

There you go again inventing definitions. Thankfully for us, chiropractors don't get to decide what the criteria for chemical elements are.

Exactly how stable does an element need to be for you to consider it an element by your definition? In fact, all of the elements on the bottom row of the periodic table are unstable - should we consider them elements or not? Do they get to fit into your personalised definition?
 

Jeff7

Lifer
Jan 4, 2001
41,596
20
81
imagine my surprise that cocklunch gayner would troll me for no good reason, just because i find it funny and agreeable to an extent that this completely unstable man-made elements should not be considered an element until it can prove its stability and that it can be a building block in matter. so far, they've created an extremely unstable atom and haven't found its island of stability yet. a little too fucking early to call it an element just yet, jackoff.

maybe in your part of new zealand, they didn't teach you not to count your sheep before you fuck them.

Despite an astounding display of ignorance of particle physics, this thread receives an infraction not for that, but rather for the personal attack. -Admin DrPizza
Technetium is flipping you off presently. ;)

If it's an atom, it's also an element. Decay rate is simply used to classify something as radioactive.
 

LordMorpheus

Diamond Member
Aug 14, 2002
6,871
1
0
Unobtainium is a real word I beleive. It describes an unknown material that is unobatainable.

engineers use it to describe rare / expensive / hard to get stuff. I've heard that the engineers designing the blackbird referred to titanium as unobtanium.

They'll also use it to describe fictional material with exactly the properties they need. It's just engineer humor.