New build, some feedback please

[Alex Sinov]

Evidently, I'm planning a new build. :biggrin: After a lot of thought, I've come to this.

Premise:

1. the IvyBridge got pushed 'till the end of April, that meaning probably the CPU's will be available in large stocks somewhere at the end of May/beginning of June
2. The Z77 chipset is at the first revision ever and we all know the testing procedures done with first revisions. Got myself burned once with ASUS on this, don't want to happen again. :\

So I'm sticking with the Z68 for now, planning another upgrade somewhere in the autumn, probably, when the market will be flooded with Z77s


Following-up to this thread, this is the configuration:

MoBo: Asus P8Z68-DELUXE
CPU: i7-2600K SandyBridge,
RAM: Corsair Vengeance 16GB (4 x 4GB), DDR3, 1600MHz, 1.5v
Cooler: Noctua NH-C14
​

I haven't decided yet on a GPU.
Also, I'm tempted to ditch the Noctua for an Antec Kuhler 920, since I plan to overclock as much as possible (well, 4.5 would be great for me, actually) but the noise part scares me.

I already have from the previous build:

PSU: Enermax 850W, Revolution 85+
Case: Antec P193 EU

​

Any opinions, suggestions?

 

[Ken g6]

Welcome to the General Hardware forum. For advice on your new build, please begin by answering the questions in [thread=80121]this thread[/thread].

If you're getting an unlocked Sandy Bridge now, and you're overclocking, there's very little point to getting an Ivy Bridge to replace it later.

 

[richaron]

My 2 cents,
I have an NH-C12 SE14, thicker heatsink but only one fan, it performs less than the C14. I've had an unlocked 4 core phenom2 @ 4GHz ~54ºC load.

I'm guessing this would burn as much heat as a 2600k @ 4.5, so C14 should be fine. But I like top-down air flow, and would avoid liquid with pumps unless I'm going hard overclocks. The Kuhler 920 (& h80) would have more headroom tho.

Edit: Ivy bridge -should- burn even less power if you want to wait for it..

 

[Alex Sinov]

@Ken g6: Thanks for the heads up, didn't see that thread.

1. What YOUR PC will be used for. That means what types of tasks you'll be performing.

Adobe CS, gaming, browsing, movies, music

2. What YOUR budget is.

Around 8-900 Euros, although because of the country I live in the prices and range of products are not really comparable to let's say, Amazon, Newegg

3. What country YOU will be buying YOUR parts from.

Romania

4. IF YOU have a brand preference.

Intel, Asus

5. If YOU intend on using any of YOUR current parts, and if so, what those parts are.

[B]PSU[/B]:  Enermax 850W, Revolution 85+
[B]Case[/B]: Antec P193 EU

6. New components.

[B]MoBo[/B]: Asus P8Z68-DELUXE
[B]CPU[/B]: i7-2600K SandyBridge, 
[B]RAM[/B]: Corsair Vengeance 16GB (4 x 4GB), DDR3, 1600MHz, 1.5v
[B]Cooler[/B]: Noctua NH-C14
I haven't decided yet on a GPU. Maybe some tips?

7. IF YOU plan on overclocking or run the system at default speeds.
Yes, in this case 4.5 GHz would be OK. But the more the better, of course.

8. What resolution will you be using?
2x 1920x1200

9. WHEN do you plan to build it?
This month.

 

[mfenn]

If you're getting an unlocked Sandy Bridge now, and you're overclocking, there's very little point to getting an Ivy Bridge to replace it later.

Agree. Similarly, upgrading from a Z67 to a Z77 is pretty much pointless.

OP, as for the parts you have picked out:
- CPU: Unless you're going to be doing a lot of encoding in Premiere, the i7 is overkill. Get the i5 2500K instead.
- Mobo: Waste of money. Given what you've described, you don't need anything more than the P8Z68-V LE.
- RAM: Vengeance is fine, but is generally overpriced relative to G.Skill, Mushkin, or Crucial.
- HSF: The top down design is generally considered to be less efficient than a tower like the NH-U12P or NH-D14.

As for the GPU, it really depends on how much is left over in the budget after making the changes suggested above and what sorts of games you play.

 

[ElFenix]

i swear i replied to this thread asking if you'd already purchased the components you've listed there, or whether they needed to be included with the budget?

 

[Alex Sinov]

@ElFenix: ummm...huh?
LE: They are to be bought. Only the PSU and case are from the current PC.

@mfenn:

CPU: Unless you're going to be doing a lot of encoding in Premiere, the i7 is overkill. Get the i5 2500K instead.

Well, more on the web design side than the video editing/compositing side. But on the CPU and MoBo front I like to go for the max performance, when possible. I also have to take into account how easy they'll be sold when the time comes.

Mobo: Waste of money. Given what you've described, you don't need anything more than the P8Z68-V LE.

Same as written above, plus there's no SLI, no bluetooth. I'll think about it.

RAM: Vengeance is fine, but is generally overprices relative to G.Skill, Mushkin, or Crucial.

I'm guessing you said Corsair is pricier than the others. I'll see how available are those brands here. There are a few stores that sell them but I have to check their track records in terms of warranty/RMA.
LE: I've checked and belive it or not, Corsair is the cheapest brand for this configuration (4x4GB@1600) :\

HSF: The top down design is generally considered to be less efficient than a tower like the NH-U12P or NH-D14

I know, but sadly an NH-D14 doesn't fit in an Antec P193...

As for the GPU, it really depends on how much is left over in the budget after making the changes suggested above and what sorts of games you play.

Any kind of game, really. Generally I try to buy a GPU that's fairly competitive but nothing over the top (no dual/triple monitor gaming, for example). For example, a year ago, when I built the present PC I bought a Radeon HD5770 and I've been happy with the performance.

 

[ElFenix]

2500k should resale just fine. i don't know what prices are like in romania, but here the 2600k costs 50% more. i doubt you'd get even half of that difference back selling in a couple years.

ivy shouldn't be a big enough improvement to justify selling in a few months. but even so, i'm fairly certain if you were to sell 6 months from now you'd take less of a hit reselling a 2500k than a 2600k.

 

[Alex Sinov]

And performance-wise the differences are THAT small? Overclocking, general "speed-feel", hyper threading...
LE: did a bit of research and the price difference between the i5 2500K and i7 2600K is somewhere around 80-90E (218Euros-i5, 309Euros-i7). Too little to give up the HT, 2MB cache, IMHO.

 

[DSF]

And performance-wise the differences are THAT small? Overclocking, general "speed-feel", hyper threading...
LE: did a bit of research and the price difference between the i5 2500K and i7 2600K is somewhere around 80-90E (218Euros-i5, 309Euros-i7). Too little to give up the HT, 2MB cache, IMHO.

The 2500k is well past the point where CPU speed matters for how responsive the system feels. That's more about hard drive and memory than anything.

 

[Alex Sinov]

Well, if the Super Moderator and a Diamond Member advise me the same thing, there must be something to it. I will seriosly think about it.

Any suggestions about the GPU? I was thinking about nVidia GeForce GTX560, 550 Ti-448Cores. The range of products around the GTX5xx makes my head spin.
560, 560Ti, 550, 550Ti, 550Ti-448Cores? wtf...

 

[lehtv]

In ascending order of performance:

GTX 550 Ti ~ HD6770
GTX 560 ~ HD6850
GTX 560 Ti ~ HD6870
GTX 560 Ti 448 Cores ~ HD6950/7850

There is no GTX 550, nor is there a GTX 550 Ti 448 cores.

 

[ElFenix]

Well, if the Super Moderator and a Diamond Member advise me the same thing, there must be something to it. I will seriosly think about it.

Any suggestions about the GPU? I was thinking about nVidia GeForce GTX560, 550 Ti-448Cores. The range of products around the GTX5xx makes my head spin.
560, 560Ti, 550, 550Ti, 550Ti-448Cores? wtf...

if i'm not signing things as Moderator, i'm just a regular user.

unfortunately i don't have a lot of CS benchmarks. anandtech usually only tests one.

i've seen a lot of game benchmarks and those usually give little advantage to hyperthreading.

 

[Alex Sinov]

@ElFenix: I know. My logic was that if you are a Moderator then you've been here for quite some time, day after day, and your PC knowledge surely greatly exceeds mine.

@lehtv: thanks, that's exactly what I was hoping to find out!

 

[ElFenix]

@ElFenix: I know. My logic was that if you are a Moderator then you've been here for quite some time, day after day, and your PC knowledge surely greatly exceeds mine.

@lehtv: thanks, that's exactly what I was hoping to find out!

i mostly just defer to mfenn and lehtv

 

[mfenn]

i mostly just defer to mfenn and lehtv

 

[mfenn]

And performance-wise the differences are THAT small? Overclocking, general "speed-feel", hyper threading...
LE: did a bit of research and the price difference between the i5 2500K and i7 2600K is somewhere around 80-90E (218Euros-i5, 309Euros-i7). Too little to give up the HT, 2MB cache, IMHO.

That's nearly a 50% difference! You will have a hard time finding a benchmark where the i7 bests the i5 by 50%. At any rate, there are two main problems with your reasoning:

1. Focusing on specs instead of performance. Specs in and of themselves are meaningless, it's all about what real world benefit you'd see.

2. Thinking about each part in a vacuum. The question to ask is not, "can I afford the extra cost?", but instead, "what other component could I be improving with the extra money in my budget?"

Well, more on the web design side than the video editing/compositing side. But on the CPU and MoBo front I like to go for the max performance, when possible. I also have to take into account how easy they'll be sold when the time comes.

OK, so three points come to mind:
1. Web design doesn't really need a lot of CPU power. Again, think about what your needs are and balance your budget appropriately.
2. A motherboard has pretty much zero (2% or so) impact on performance.
3. Resale value is a non-issue, the i5 2500K will be in high demand for a while.

Same as written above, plus there's no SLI, no bluetooth. I'll think about it.

SLI is irrelevant for you as your gaming needs are not great. The ASUS bluetooth module is just a $10 USB bluetooth adapter, certainly not worth the $100 premium that they charge for the Deluxe.

I know, but sadly an NH-D14 doesn't fit in an Antec P193...

It fits in a P183, so I don't see why it wouldn't fit in a P193.

 

[Alex Sinov]

@mfenn: as always, I find it hard to break free of the marketing machine.
As for the whole, NH-D14/Antec P193 issue: it seems the BigBoy fan slightly protrudes in the case's space, interfering with the Noctua by "a few millimeters", as some say.
I've emailed Noctua support, hoping they have an official opinion about this.

 

[mfenn]

Looking at the side panel again, I see what you mean. I suppose it would be better to test it. Also, you can look at 120mm tower coolers which should be slightly shorter than the 140mm D14.

 

[Alex Sinov]

I emailed Noctua, requesting some sort of info and official position on this.
I've done in the past similar things with Thermalright (asking about Ultra 120 and Thermaltake's Soprano Case) and Geil (asking about Thermalright's Ultra 120 and some Geil memory) and got satisfactory and definitive answers.
Sadly, Noctua gave me nothing to hang on to, albeit fast (less than 24h)

Hello,
I’m interested in buying a Noctua NH-D14.
I have an Antec P193 case and I can’t seem to find out if it will fit in the case or if it’ll interfere with the side fan (which I understand it protrudes a few mm in the case space..
I really hope that you will be able to give me an official answer.

Thank you in advance,
Alex Sinov

----------Answer---------
Dear Mr. Sinov,

thanks for contacting Noctua and for your interest in our products.
Since we don't have this chassis at hand, we can't give you a secure answer to your question. As far as we can tell it should work out.

Kind regards,
Andreas Karner
Noctua support team

I figured since I'm referring to their top product and another product in the same niche (enthusiast) surely I'm not the first one to ask this. Both products are 1 year+ old and by now they'd know more compatibility-wise.
Moreover, on the internet you can find all sorts of info concerned height limitations cited as being from the Noctua support team, but I needed some official and precise info. Sadly, all I got was too vague for my taste.

 

[Alex Sinov]

Due to unforeseen events I have to abandon the build right now. Maybe it's for the better, since Z77 just started to rear it's head into the market.

I want to thank all who replied, esecially mfenn, ElFenix and lehtv.
I'll be back soon to pester you again