New build, been a while...

[-Terminus-]

It's been a while since I've built a system. It seems (since I haven't been keeping up with things) that everything is so different. I've been doing some research trying to get up to speed on things... First, I'll answer the requisite questions:


1. What YOUR PC will be used for. That means what types of tasks you'll be performing.
Gaming, maybe some video editing of home movies type stuff... Other normal tasks (office, music, web browsing).

2. What YOUR budget is. A price range is acceptable as long as it's not more than a 20% spread
$1200-$1500ish? I want to put together a good performing system, but not get into the crazy expensive catagory...

3. What country YOU will be buying YOUR parts from.
USA

4. IF YOU have a brand preference. That means, are you an Intel-Fanboy, AMD-Fanboy, ATI-Fanboy, nVidia-Fanboy, Seagate-Fanboy, WD-Fanboy, etc.
Prefer Intel and nVidia, for this build, but open to anything really. Whatever makes the most sense.

5. If YOU intend on using any of YOUR current parts, and if so, what those parts are.
The only parts I'm thinking about reusing so far are the Power Supply (if it'll handle the new build, and a SATA DVD burner. Both are listed below as already owned.

6. IF YOU have searched and/or read similar threads.
I have. Been looking at builds and threads on this and other sites for a week or two now.

7. IF YOU plan on overclocking or run the system at default speeds.
I'm open to overclocking a little, but the goal is a stable system I won't have to tinker with much, once it's set up and running well.

8. What resolution YOU plan on gaming with.
1920x1080? I need a new monitor, too, I guess. The current LCD I have is 1680x1050.

9. WHEN do you plan to build it?
ASAP ... As soon as I can reasonably get all the suggestions and have some experts check out my parts selection, I'm buying and building. Unless there's something coming out next week that changes the game... I don't think I want to wait months for Bulldozer or Sandy Bridge, though.

10. Don't ask for a build configuration critique or rating if you are thin skinned.
This isn't technically a question. I wouldn't consider myself thin skinned and look forward to any comments/improvements/suggestions I can get before spending all this money. That's kind of the point of asking you guys (you guys rock, by the way!).


Ok. Now on to what I'm thinking about building... Before I spend the money on all this stuff, I wanted to get opinions, potential issues, or ideas for improvement/savings. Here's the plan now:

CPU --- Intel Core i7 950 -- 294.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115211
Seems to be the sweetspot for i7. I keep hearing I can save a lot of money on Intel CPUs by going to Micro Center. (Looks like 229.99, I just looked it up). The i7 930 is only 6 dollars less, and the i7 960 jumps WAY up to 579.99 on newegg.

Motherboard -- Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3R -- 188.99 w/ Promo Code
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128423

Memory -- Cosair XMS3 6GB (3x2GB) DDR3 1600 -- 129.99 w/ Rebate
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820145286
CAS 7 --- 7-7-7-20

GPUs -- 2x EVGA GeForce GTX 460 (Fermi) 1GB -- 479.98 (for 2)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130571

Storage OS (SSD) -- Crucial RealSSD C300 64GB SATA3 -- 139.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148357&Tpk=N82E16820148357

Storage Data -- 2x Western Digital Caviar Black WD1002FAEX 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s -- 179.98 (for 2)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822136533

Case -- Cooler Master CM690 II -- 89.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811119216

Power Supply -- Corsair CMPSU-650TX -- $0.00 -- ALREADY OWNED
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817139005

DVD-ROM -- ASUS Black 18X DVD-ROM - SATA -- 17.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16827135224

DVD-Burner -- ASUS Black 24X DVD+R SATA -- $0.00 -- ALREADY OWNED
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16827135204

I'll probably buy and install Windows 7 on this system...
Total with rebates, buying the CPU from Microcenter, but not including Windows 7 and shipping/tax so far: $1451.90 (I must have missed a cell in my speadsheet or something, this total had to be edited.)

Questions...
1. Will that Corsair Power Supply (650W) be enough for this? I did an online PSU calculator that said 540W, and recommended 580Ws for what I plugged in, but I'd much rather be safe than sorry...

2. Do I need a 3rd party CPU cooler? Will the stock Heatsink from Intel be sufficient if I'm not doing any crazy overclocking?

I really appreciate any advice or suggestions... You guys all have much more experience than I do, I'm sure. Thanks in advance!

 

[Blain]

How old is the Corsair PS?
Has it seen good clean power since being in service or is your power grid a little funky?

 

[-Terminus-]

Been in use since 1/18/2010, I think. It was a replacement for another older power supply that died.

I think the power has been pretty stable here... No blackouts or anything like that, if that's what you mean...

 

[-Terminus-]

It's been suggested that there's no need for a i7, when for this type of system an i5 760 makes much more sense.
I've also been linked to charts that show 16x / 16x for SLI isn't a huge improvement over 8x / 8x ... Any suggestions or comments there?
Would it make a lot more sense to go i5 760 instead? A big difference on how long the system will be "good enough"? Or about the same?

 

[-Terminus-]

The difference in the i5 760 build I was suggested was only $84.00 less.
$1451.90 vs. $1367.90 ... And I'd only have 4GBs of RAM, instead of 6GBs on the i7.

Seems like not that much savings, really... Any other thoughts?

 

[fffblackmage]

It's been suggested that there's no need for a i7, when for this type of system an i5 760 makes much more sense.
I've also been linked to charts that show 16x / 16x for SLI isn't a huge improvement over 8x / 8x ... Any suggestions or comments there?
Would it make a lot more sense to go i5 760 instead? A big difference on how long the system will be "good enough"? Or about the same?

LGA1366 isn't gonna last longer than the LGA1156 - both sockets are dead and will be replaced with LGA2011 and LGA1155. As far as gaming is concerned, the difference between LGA1156 and LGA1366 isn't significant.
--Triple channel memory isn't much of a factor, since dual channel DDR3 already has a ton of available bandwidth, especially if you're OCing.
--PCIe x8 doesn't limit graphics cards' performance significantly, if at all.

The difference in the i5 760 build I was suggested was only $84.00 less.
$1451.90 vs. $1367.90 ... And I'd only have 4GBs of RAM, instead of 6GBs on the i7.

Seems like not that much savings, really... Any other thoughts?

Doesn't sound right. The i5-760 is $60 cheaper than the i7-950 at microcenter, LGA1156 mobos should be around $40-$80 less, and a dual channel ram kit should be roughly $30-60 less.

 

[jaydee]

Are you sure you need $500 worth of GPU? What games are you playing? Regardless, I'd wait a week or two and see what AMD's 6xxx series brings. If nothing else, it should move the prices of current video cards down a little.

Do you need both a DVD-ROM and DVD burner?

Also, are you trying to fit a 1920x1080 LCD into this same $1500 budget?

 

[-Terminus-]

I'm not sure I need $500 worth of GPU right now. Maybe that is overkill...

I probably don't NEED both. I just remember I used to like being able to burn disc-to-disc. The DVD-ROM was only $18...

I wasn't counting the LCD, yet. I figured I could always buy that in a month or two, once I finished this project and looked at which ones were good.


... Maybe I need to go back and shave this down a little. Sounds like it's a little overkill for what I need based on the responses so far...

Thanks for your help!

 

[mfenn]

Doesn't sound right. The i5-760 is $60 cheaper than the i7-950 at microcenter, LGA1156 mobos should be around $40-$80 less, and a dual channel ram kit should be roughly $30-60 less.

My thoughts exactly.

OP, the general idea with SLI is that if you can get the same level of performance with a single card, then SLI is pointless.

I would be looking into the GTX 480 with a i5 760 and 4GB of RAM. You may need a 750W PSU.

Other places to trim some fat from your build:

• HDDs: Just grab a 2TB F4.
• The C300 isn't really all that. You can't even fully utilize it's only redeeming quality on the Intel platform because the Marvell SATA 6Gb/s controller is so damn bad. Get a Sandforce based drive like the Corsair Force instead.

 

[-Terminus-]

I thought that two 460's would out-perform a single 480 (by a lot), based on charts and so on... Real world, I guess I have no idea how that would affect me.

The parts suggested to me were:

Intel Core i5 760 169.99 http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0341729

ASUS P7P55D-E Pro 179.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131621

Corsair Dominator 4GB DDR3 1600 114.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145290

Maybe these are just expensive parts, I guess, but the differences were, $60 CPU, $9 MB, and $15 RAM (with 4GBs instead of 6GBs). So the total was only $84 less.

As far as the other fat trimming, the C300 is $134.99, and your Cosair Force you suggested (and linked) is $128.99 after rebate, so there's $6 ... If it's better, then cool, but not a huge fat trimmings there (six bucks).

As to the HDDs, I can see the 2TB F4 is a great deal. My fault I didn't mention that the plan was to mirror the two 1TB drives... I guess I do have an external USB drive now I could use to back up my financial data and photos and stuff... I just thought it would be nice not to lose data if a drive failed down the road...

 

[-Terminus-]

LGA1366 isn't gonna last longer than the LGA1156 - both sockets are dead and will be replaced with LGA2011 and LGA1155.

I know I said originally that I wouldn't want to wait a few months, but I'm wondering what the honest opinion out there on waiting... Is it completely silly to build right now? Should I piece together something to make things work until we see what's coming down? I really don't know much about any of the stuff coming up... I'm starting to doubt if I'm going about this the correct way... Trying to build a system to last a few years (4 or 5?) when everything is going change might not be the best thing.

Honest opinions on waiting?

 

[mfenn]

I thought that two 460's would out-perform a single 480 (by a lot), based on charts and so on... Real world, I guess I have no idea how that would affect me.

The parts suggested to me were:

Intel Core i5 760 169.99 http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0341729

ASUS P7P55D-E Pro 179.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131621

Corsair Dominator 4GB DDR3 1600 114.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145290

Maybe these are just expensive parts, I guess, but the differences were, $60 CPU, $9 MB, and $15 RAM (with 4GBs instead of 6GBs). So the total was only $84 less.

As far as the other fat trimming, the C300 is $134.99, and your Cosair Force you suggested (and linked) is $128.99 after rebate, so there's $6 ... If it's better, then cool, but not a huge fat trimmings there (six bucks).

As to the HDDs, I can see the 2TB F4 is a great deal. My fault I didn't mention that the plan was to mirror the two 1TB drives... I guess I do have an external USB drive now I could use to back up my financial data and photos and stuff... I just thought it would be nice not to lose data if a drive failed down the road...

That mobo and RAM are both waaaaaaaay too expensive. GA-P55-USB3 and G.Skill DDR3 1333.

And no, two GTX 460's will not outperform a GTX 480 by "a lot", especially not at higher resolutions.

I know I said originally that I wouldn't want to wait a few months, but I'm wondering what the honest opinion out there on waiting... Is it completely silly to build right now? Should I piece together something to make things work until we see what's coming down? I really don't know much about any of the stuff coming up... I'm starting to doubt if I'm going about this the correct way... Trying to build a system to last a few years (4 or 5?) when everything is going change might not be the best thing.

Honest opinions on waiting?

You will never ever be able to build a system that is upgradeable 4-5 years down the road. If you want to wait that long between systems, you will be buying a completely new system every time.

Everything is always changing, just build the best system that you can right now and don't worry about it.

 

[-Terminus-]

And no, two GTX 460's will not outperform a GTX 480 by "a lot", especially not at higher resolutions.

You will never ever be able to build a system that is upgradeable 4-5 years down the road. If you want to wait that long between systems, you will be buying a completely new system every time.

Everything is always changing, just build the best system that you can right now and don't worry about it.

I thought it did, based on things I was reading like:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-gtx-460-sli-geforce-gtx-480,2694-11.html
The conclusion was that it make MUCH more sense to SLI 2 460's as opposed to a single 480. Not sure how true that is, but that's one of the places I was researching information.

I'm sorry, I really did mean "build a system that will be decent for 4-5 years, before building a new one". That's what I was trying to do with my parts list above. I just want it to last a while before being completely outdated.

You guys have given me a lot to think about. I really appreciate your expertise on these matters. It's a much different enviroment with a lot of different parts than it was last time I was building... and it looks like it'll change even more in the next few months...

I'll look over the parts you suggested and see how that prices differently, just to get an idea of the differences and cost differences.

Thanks again!

 

[-Terminus-]

Also, do you know if that memory is any good? I don't know anything about G.Skill ... I've only really used Corsair or OCZ and both have been very solid for me. Is it pretty much memory is memory?

 

[mfenn]

Also, do you know if that memory is any good? I don't know anything about G.Skill ... I've only really used Corsair or OCZ and both have been very solid for me. Is it pretty much memory is memory?

Some memory brands are crap. G.Skill isn't one of them. It's funny that you mention OCZ as being a good brand though.

 

[-Terminus-]

Heh... It has been years since I used it. Is it not good? Heh! Everything I have now is Corsair, so I guess I was sticking to what I am used to...

 

[mfenn]

I thought it did, based on things I was reading like:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-gtx-460-sli-geforce-gtx-480,2694-11.html
The conclusion was that it make MUCH more sense to SLI 2 460's as opposed to a single 480. Not sure how true that is, but that's one of the places I was researching information.

Tom's doesn't give you the full picture I'm afraid. They get hopped up on the Nvidia marketing and forget to mention how much of a loud, hot, PITA SLI GTX 460's are. And yes, they are loud and hot compared to a single GTX 480, so that's saying something. This is mostly due to the fact that the second GTX 460 gets smothered. Also, when you factor in the cost of the SLI mobo, the GTX 460's are ~30% more expensive that the GTX 480. Not a good deal IMHO because SLI scaling is so game and driver dependent.

I'm sorry, I really did mean "build a system that will be decent for 4-5 years, before building a new one". That's what I was trying to do with my parts list above. I just want it to last a while before being completely outdated.

Sorry, but this is simply not possible unless you have a very loose definition of decent.

You guys have given me a lot to think about. I really appreciate your expertise on these matters. It's a much different enviroment with a lot of different parts than it was last time I was building... and it looks like it'll change even more in the next few months...

I'll look over the parts you suggested and see how that prices differently, just to get an idea of the differences and cost differences.

Thanks again!

Np

 

[betasub]

Sorry, but this is simply not possible unless you have a very loose definition of decent.

:thumbsup

And kudos for correct use of the word "loose". Far too many ppl are typing it when they actual mean "lose".